AVR-Chat

Hi friendsi am new in AVR's.i want to srart learing this powerful chip.besides idont want to vaste time now i have a question from you.do i start with codvision or bascom?which one is better for a electronic student?which one is easier?what is your reasons?beside i know a littele C(language) but i dont know basic at all!.maby codvision is good for me.what is your suggestion?thanks a lotMona


      

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I would us gcc with AVR Studio. This allows both assembler and c  
programs. And, its free. gcc is as powerful as codevision, in my  
opinion.

Jim Wagner
Oregon Research Electronics

On Sep 12, 2008, at 7:31 PM, M F wrote:

> Hi friendsi am new in AVR's.i want to srart learing this powerful  
> chip.besides idont want to vaste time now i have a question from  
> you.do i start with codvision or bascom?which one is better for a  
> electronic student?which one is easier?what is your reasons?beside i  
> know a littele C(language) but i dont know basic at all!.maby  
> codvision is good for me.what is your suggestion?thanks a lotMona
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
> 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> Hi friendsi am new in AVR's.i want to srart learing this 
> powerful chip.besides idont want to vaste time now i have a 
> question from you.do i start with codvision or bascom?which 
> one is better for a electronic student?which one is 
> easier?what is your reasons?beside i know a littele 
> C(language) but i dont know basic at all!.maby codvision is 
> good for me.what is your suggestion?thanks a lotMona

I suggest you have a look at: http://www.arduino.cc/

Underneath it is a wrapper around AVR Mega168 and AVR-GCC C/C++ Compiler
with a nice library and IDE environment and some hardware that works well
with the environment.

It is probably not all that different to BASCOM/AVR in terms of how
hard/easy it is to start doing stuff with it but as someone who has used
both, I'd prefer to use the C/C++ environment so Arduino is a better choice
for me for projects that I want others to be able to use.

If you really want to get at the bare metal then just using AVR Studio with
WinAVR (avr-gcc + avr-libc) is a reasonable place to start also but you are
exposed to the whole of the environment whereas things like Arduino and
BASCOM/AVR hide some complexity from you.

YMMV

Alex Shepherd

If you are inexperienced in programming and do not want to start with
the C language, then rather than BASCOM for the AVR, may I suggest
this: www.basic.com. The reason: That BASIC is much like Microsoft's
Visual Basic and other structured BASIC compilers. These are logically
designed and ease the transition later to C or C++. Conversely, BASCOM
may tend to teach bad coding habits. ZBasic.net is the most rapid way
to get going with embedded micros.

But really, IMO, the best way to start embedded software programming
is to first learn the fundamentals of C using a freeware SIMPLE C
compiler for a PC where you don't have to struggle with the embedded
microprocessor yet. Then study the assembly language examples for the
AVR, then study others' C. Then modify someone else's C code to learn.
There are lots of examples of ASM and C on avrfreaks.net, in the
"projects" section.

--- In AVR-Chat@yahoogroups.com, dlc <dlc@...> wrote:
>
> If you are not a programmer, especially not an embedded programmer then 
> the answer is plain in my opinion: Bascom AVR.  But really, what is
your 
> goal?  Where are you going with this?
> 
> DLC
> 
> M F wrote:
> > Hi friendsi am new in AVR's.i want to srart learing this powerful
chip.besides idont want to vaste time now i have a question from
you.do i start with codvision or bascom?which one is better for a
electronic student?which one is easier?what is your reasons?beside i
know a littele C(language) but i dont know basic at all!.maby
codvision is good for me.what is your suggestion?thanks a lotMona

> > 
> > 
> >       
> > 
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > 
> > 
> > ------------------------------------
> > 
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > .
> 
> -- 
> -------------------------------------------------
> Dennis Clark          TTT Enterprises
> www.techtoystoday.com
> -------------------------------------------------
>

If you are not a programmer, especially not an embedded programmer then 
the answer is plain in my opinion: Bascom AVR.  But really, what is your 
goal?  Where are you going with this?

DLC

M F wrote:
> Hi friendsi am new in AVR's.i want to srart learing this powerful chip.besides idont want to vaste time now i have a question from you.do i start with codvision or bascom?which one is better for a electronic student?which one is easier?what is your reasons?beside i know a littele C(language) but i dont know basic at all!.maby codvision is good for me.what is your suggestion?thanks a lotMona
> 
> 
>       
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------
> 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
> .

-- 
-------------------------------------------------
Dennis Clark          TTT Enterprises
www.techtoystoday.com
-------------------------------------------------

correction to the below: 
www.zbasic.net - rather than as below. (brain fart)

--- In AVR-Chat@yahoogroups.com, "stevech11" <stevech@...> wrote:
>
> If you are inexperienced in programming and do not want to start with
> the C language, then rather than BASCOM for the AVR, may I suggest
> this: www.basic.com. The reason: That BASIC is much like Microsoft's
> Visual Basic and other structured BASIC compilers. These are logically
> designed and ease the transition later to C or C++. Conversely, BASCOM
> may tend to teach bad coding habits. ZBasic.net is the most rapid way
> to get going with embedded micros.
> 
> But really, IMO, the best way to start embedded software programming
> is to first learn the fundamentals of C using a freeware SIMPLE C
> compiler for a PC where you don't have to struggle with the embedded
> microprocessor yet. Then study the assembly language examples for the
> AVR, then study others' C. Then modify someone else's C code to learn.
> There are lots of examples of ASM and C on avrfreaks.net, in the
> "projects" section.
> 
> --- In AVR-Chat@yahoogroups.com, dlc <dlc@> wrote:
> >
> > If you are not a programmer, especially not an embedded programmer
then 

> > the answer is plain in my opinion: Bascom AVR.  But really, what is
> your 
> > goal?  Where are you going with this?
> > 
> > DLC
> > 
> > M F wrote:
> > > Hi friendsi am new in AVR's.i want to srart learing this powerful
> chip.besides idont want to vaste time now i have a question from
> you.do i start with codvision or bascom?which one is better for a
> electronic student?which one is easier?what is your reasons?beside i
> know a littele C(language) but i dont know basic at all!.maby
> codvision is good for me.what is your suggestion?thanks a lotMona
> > > 
> > > 
> > >       
> > > 
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > 
> > > 
> > > ------------------------------------
> > > 
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > .
> > 
> > -- 
> > -------------------------------------------------
> > Dennis Clark          TTT Enterprises
> > www.techtoystoday.com
> > -------------------------------------------------
> >
>

So you are and electronics student . . .

That being the case, not knowing how much or what area of electronics you
may get into, that being the case this may not apply to you but you will
probably be using a programming language on and off during your career. Here
goes . . .

You mentioned you know a little about C. If you take up C over BASCOM I
recommend you start with the demo version of CodeVisionAVR. It has several
wizards that are really great and has hand-held many C programmers,
especially the newbies but the seasoned also. Later on you can move to GNU
GCC, called WinAVR (pronounced whenever). Assuming you are using Windows. It
is open source, free and very good. Its short comings that it is not for the
newbies. GCC has the big learning curve of setting it up, learning how to
use it plus getting your first HELLO program into your micro and work
properly.

I would stay away from ardunino and zbasic.

Mike


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Mike Bronosky wrote:
> I would stay away from ardunino and zbasic.

Having just started working with an Arduino, I'm curious as to why you recommend against it.  It seems to be meant to overcome the obstacles of getting started that you claim are a problem with WinAVR.

-- 
Carl D Cravens (raven@phoenyx.net)
Windows isn't crippleware: it's Functionally Challenged.

--- In AVR-Chat@yahoogroups.com, Carl Cravens <raven@...> wrote:
>
> Mike Bronosky wrote:
> > I would stay away from ardunino and zbasic.
> 
> Having just started working with an Arduino, I'm curious as to why 
you recommend against it.  It seems to be meant to overcome the 
obstacles of getting started that you claim are a problem with WinAVR.
> 
> -- 
> Carl D Cravens (raven@...)
> Windows isn't crippleware: it's Functionally Challenged.
>

While the Arduino project is not all things to all people, it is 
remarkedly good for getting people introduced to microprocessors.  It 
is very well established and is based on two other well-established 
movements: Wiring and Processing.  

For a beginner, it is pretty remarkable to be able download the dev 
system, plug in an Arduino board, and instantly be able to blink the 
lights.  The standard software has some very good examples.  

If you want to do something closer to the metal, or more 
sophisticated, then you can easily switch to Atmel's deveopment 
tools.  

In addition, there are numerous clones ranging from bare minimum 
breadboards mpus all the way to I2C, CAN, and Ethernet.  

A great intro for teh beginner, but ultimately useful to the more 
experienced as well.  

Definitely worth a look.  arduino.cc

David