AVR-Chat

HOLY SHIT BATMAN!
http://www.eetimes.com/news/latest/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=210605267

LONDON — Microchip Technology Inc. and ON Semiconductor Corp. are 
combining forces in an attempt to acquire Atmel Corp. in a deal that 
values the latter at $2.3 billion. Microchip is leading the initiative, 
and the deal would in part be financed by the sale of Atmel's 
nonvolatile memory and RF and automotive businesses to ON 
Semiconductor. 


On the other hand, maybe they'll dump the PIC!  (evil grin)

Seriously, it's possible that they will keep the AVR, and give us
tools that work, and real support!

Possible....

On Oct 2, 2008, at 2:51 PM, Dave VanHorn wrote:

> Seriously, it's possible that they will keep the AVR, and give us
> tools that work, and real support!


What? From the company whose tools run in a 16 bit DOS box with  
mysterious configuration parameters hidden inside undocumented binary  
project files which have the full DOS pathname for every file you use  
making the project non-portable not even to another directory on the  
same machine?

I hear Microchip has remedied some of those problems. Some big users  
of the PIC dictate, "No Project", hard code all chip options including  
chip selection inside the source file. This is (was?) the only way to  
ensure the same compile/assembly options are used if the project is  
pulled out of archive sometime in the future.

As for myself, I really *like* Makefile.

--
David Kelly N4HHE, dkelly@HiWAAY.net
========================================================================
Whom computers would destroy, they must first drive mad.

> What? From the company whose tools run in a 16 bit DOS box with
> mysterious configuration parameters hidden inside undocumented binary
> project files which have the full DOS pathname for every file you use
> making the project non-portable not even to another directory on the
> same machine?

Well, the last time I tried to do anything under studio, I got this
sort of wonderfulness:

;Much code before, enter here with R16=0
ldi R16,3   ;
;R16 still has 0 in it.

I complained, I sent them project files, I even sent them screen
capture videos of it happening.
Totally ignored.

So, we're using ARM now.
:(

----- Original Message ----- 

From: "David VanHorn" <microbrix@gmail.com>
To: <AVR-Chat@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, October 03, 2008 3:16 PM
Subject: Re: [AVR-Chat] HOLY SHIT BATMAN!


>> What? From the company whose tools run in a 16 bit DOS box with
>> mysterious configuration parameters hidden inside undocumented binary
>> project files which have the full DOS pathname for every file you use
>> making the project non-portable not even to another directory on the
>> same machine?

Sorry, but MPLAB and the other tools are actually better than those for the 
AVR!

Leon

On Fri, Oct 03, 2008 at 03:40:38PM +0100, Leon wrote:
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "David VanHorn" <microbrix@gmail.com>
> To: <AVR-Chat@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Friday, October 03, 2008 3:16 PM
> Subject: Re: [AVR-Chat] HOLY SHIT BATMAN!
> 
> 
> >> What? From the company whose tools run in a 16 bit DOS box with
> >> mysterious configuration parameters hidden inside undocumented binary
> >> project files which have the full DOS pathname for every file you use
> >> making the project non-portable not even to another directory on the
> >> same machine?
> 
> Sorry, but MPLAB and the other tools are actually better than those for the 

MPLAB 5.0 was not.

And nothing for the PIC compares to avr-gcc.

-- 
David Kelly N4HHE, dkelly@HiWAAY.net
========================================================================
Whom computers would destroy, they must first drive mad.

----- Original Message ----- 

From: "David Kelly" <dkelly@hiwaay.net>
To: <AVR-Chat@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, October 03, 2008 4:27 PM
Subject: Re: [AVR-Chat] HOLY SHIT BATMAN!


> On Fri, Oct 03, 2008 at 03:40:38PM +0100, Leon wrote:
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "David VanHorn" <microbrix@gmail.com>
>> To: <AVR-Chat@yahoogroups.com>
>> Sent: Friday, October 03, 2008 3:16 PM
>> Subject: Re: [AVR-Chat] HOLY SHIT BATMAN!
>>
>>
>> >> What? From the company whose tools run in a 16 bit DOS box with
>> >> mysterious configuration parameters hidden inside undocumented binary
>> >> project files which have the full DOS pathname for every file you use
>> >> making the project non-portable not even to another directory on the
>> >> same machine?
>>
>> Sorry, but MPLAB and the other tools are actually better than those for 
>> the
>
> MPLAB 5.0 was not.
>
> And nothing for the PIC compares to avr-gcc.

The dsPIC and PIC24 use gcc. There is a free version of C18 for the PC18, 
it's a good compiler.

Leon
--
Leon Heller
Amateur radio call-sign  G1HSM
Yaesu FT-817ND transceiver
Suzuki SV1000S motorcycle
leon355@btinternet.com
http://www.geocities.com/leon_heller

Hi,
    I just joined the avrchat list. It is great to see some hams are  
using the list!
I am using mostly Atmega168's for automotive and amateur radio  
applications.
fyi: I am developing with the GNU toolset on a mac.

Regards,

Eric Linn Rabinowitz
eric.rabinowitz \_a_t_/ gmail.com
415.336.6938 mobile
512.494.4914 home/office

N6LG

On Fri, Oct 3, 2008 at 11:39 PM, Leon <leon355@btinternet.com> wrote:

>> And nothing for the PIC compares to avr-gcc.
>
> The dsPIC and PIC24 use gcc. There is a free version of C18 for the PC18,
> it's a good compiler.
>

No need to worry about AVR and avr-gcc. You can still use them after
Microchip owns them (if the big goes successful, I hope it will).

http://ww1.microchip.com/downloads/en/Market_Communication/Customer%20Letter%20About%20Atmel.pdf

"Microchip has a proven reputation for enabling low-risk product
development, lower total
system cost, faster time to market and outstanding customer service
for thousands of
diverse customer applications worldwide spanning the automotive, communications,
computing, consumer and industrial control markets. We expect to apply
these same
strengths to Atmel's business while continuing to deliver their full range of
microcontrollers, and intend to make the integration process as
seamless as possible for
you."

Even this is a PR but the track record of Microchip is good.

We are using Atmel ARM and 8051 in my current job. I am
not worried that we would need to redesign our product
any time soon.


Xiaofan

Hi Eiric,

That was one of the main reasons i got into the chips (amateur radio) but i
haven't really gotten around to teaching myself the little things properly!

73
Paul - EI5GTB



On Fri, Oct 3, 2008 at 4:53 PM, Eric Rabinowitz
<eric.rabinowitz@gmail.com>wrote:

>   Hi,
> I just joined the avrchat list. It is great to see some hams are
> using the list!
> I am using mostly Atmega168's for automotive and amateur radio
> applications.
> fyi: I am developing with the GNU toolset on a mac.
>
> Regards,
>
> Eric Linn Rabinowitz
> eric.rabinowitz \_a_t_/ gmail.com
> 415.336.6938 mobile
> 512.494.4914 home/office
>
> N6LG
>
>  
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I don't know if there is a "proper" way to learn.  I started working with 
microcontrollers some years ago. My first was the Z80. Remember the ARRL 
Microcontroller project?

I eventually picked up the 8051 and 8085 for projects. All my programs 
were written in the respective assembly languages.

I introduced myself to Microchip PICs and then eventually discovered 
AVR's. My preferred programming method id still assembler. I think it 
teaches you to "think" like the microcontroller and lets you write (in 
most cases) shorter and faster programs than a higher-level compiler will 
produce.

I've written or modified a lot of programs for various amateur radio 
projects - frequency generators, counters, DDS controllers, voltmeters, 
etc. I'd like to build a microcontroller-based EME array steering system.

In my other hobby of large-format photography I'd like to build a 
microcontroller-based compensating darkroom timer such as the one Zone VI 
Studios used to sell.  Zone VI Studios has been gone for many years and 
their compensating timers that are still around have become scarce and 
very pricey.

Zack W9SZ

On Sat, 4 Oct 2008, paul sinclair wrote:

> Hi Eiric,
>
> That was one of the main reasons i got into the chips (amateur radio) but i
> haven't really gotten around to teaching myself the little things properly!
>
> 73
> Paul - EI5GTB
>
>
>
> On Fri, Oct 3, 2008 at 4:53 PM, Eric Rabinowitz
> <eric.rabinowitz@gmail.com>wrote:
>
>>   Hi,
>> I just joined the avrchat list. It is great to see some hams are
>> using the list!
>> I am using mostly Atmega168's for automotive and amateur radio
>> applications.
>> fyi: I am developing with the GNU toolset on a mac.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Eric Linn Rabinowitz
>> eric.rabinowitz \_a_t_/ gmail.com
>> 415.336.6938 mobile
>> 512.494.4914 home/office
>>
>> N6LG
>>

Hi Zack,

Thats some interesting stuff. I also enjoy photography, (digital mainly)

yea, i never did like assembly, always liked c, been programming in C since
i was 13 or 14, then i gout out of it for a few years, and then i decided to
get back into it with the micro controllers.

one of my projects is an antenna rotator (az & al) for satellite work and
the likes. Its been on the back burner for a while tho, school has thinghs
on hold.

73
Paul.

On Sat, Oct 4, 2008 at 2:46 PM, Zack Widup <w9sz@prairienet.org> wrote:

>
> I don't know if there is a "proper" way to learn. I started working with
> microcontrollers some years ago. My first was the Z80. Remember the ARRL
> Microcontroller project?
>
> I eventually picked up the 8051 and 8085 for projects. All my programs
> were written in the respective assembly languages.
>
> I introduced myself to Microchip PICs and then eventually discovered
> AVR's. My preferred programming method id still assembler. I think it
> teaches you to "think" like the microcontroller and lets you write (in
> most cases) shorter and faster programs than a higher-level compiler will
> produce.
>
> I've written or modified a lot of programs for various amateur radio
> projects - frequency generators, counters, DDS controllers, voltmeters,
> etc. I'd like to build a microcontroller-based EME array steering system.
>
> In my other hobby of large-format photography I'd like to build a
> microcontroller-based compensating darkroom timer such as the one Zone VI
> Studios used to sell. Zone VI Studios has been gone for many years and
> their compensating timers that are still around have become scarce and
> very pricey.
>
> Zack W9SZ
>
>
> On Sat, 4 Oct 2008, paul sinclair wrote:
>
> > Hi Eiric,
> >
> > That was one of the main reasons i got into the chips (amateur radio) but
> i
> > haven't really gotten around to teaching myself the little things
> properly!
> >
> > 73
> > Paul - EI5GTB
> >
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Oct 3, 2008 at 4:53 PM, Eric Rabinowitz
> > <eric.rabinowitz@gmail.com <eric.rabinowitz%40gmail.com>>wrote:
> >
> >> Hi,
> >> I just joined the avrchat list. It is great to see some hams are
> >> using the list!
> >> I am using mostly Atmega168's for automotive and amateur radio
> >> applications.
> >> fyi: I am developing with the GNU toolset on a mac.
> >>
> >> Regards,
> >>
> >> Eric Linn Rabinowitz
> >> eric.rabinowitz \_a_t_/ gmail.com
> >> 415.336.6938 mobile
> >> 512.494.4914 home/office
> >>
> >> N6LG
> >>
>  
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> "Microchip has a proven reputation for enabling low-risk product 
> development, lower total system cost, faster time to market and 
> outstanding customer service for thousands of diverse customer 
> applications worldwide spanning the automotive, communications, 
> computing, consumer and industrial control markets. We expect to 
> apply these same strengths to Atmel's business while continuing 
> to deliver their full range of microcontrollers, and intend to 
> make the integration process as seamless as possible for you."

I read "... a proven reputation for enabling low-risk product 
development" to mean no more new, interesting niche parts like 
the 32-bit AVR's unless someone like GM or IBM asks for it. 
Further, I would expect the current wide range of parts to be 
trimmed down with all but the ten top selling parts vanishing 
within six months. Very sad.

It sounds like Microchip can't stand the competition so they've
teamed up with the takeover gorilla, ON Semi, to eliminate it.

HOLY SHIT indeed!

Bruce

----- Original Message ----- 

From: "Bruce Parham" <obparham@jpl.nasa.gov>
To: <AVR-Chat@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, October 04, 2008 7:29 PM
Subject: [AVR-Chat] Re: HOLY SHIT BATMAN!


>> "Microchip has a proven reputation for enabling low-risk product
>> development, lower total system cost, faster time to market and
>> outstanding customer service for thousands of diverse customer
>> applications worldwide spanning the automotive, communications,
>> computing, consumer and industrial control markets. We expect to
>> apply these same strengths to Atmel's business while continuing
>> to deliver their full range of microcontrollers, and intend to
>> make the integration process as seamless as possible for you."
>
> I read "... a proven reputation for enabling low-risk product
> development" to mean no more new, interesting niche parts like
> the 32-bit AVR's unless someone like GM or IBM asks for it.
> Further, I would expect the current wide range of parts to be
> trimmed down with all but the ten top selling parts vanishing
> within six months. Very sad.
>
> It sounds like Microchip can't stand the competition so they've
> teamed up with the takeover gorilla, ON Semi, to eliminate it.

 Microchip's policy has always been to keep parts in production. Unlike 
Atmel, they don't drop older parts when something bigger and better comes 
along, leaving customers in the lurch.

I think it's the case that every device that Microchip has ever made is 
still available.

Leon