Dave Smith Instruments SYNTHESIZERS

I'd like to ask everyone a favor...

For everyone that's upset about this whole "Poly Evolver vs Waldorf 
Microwave XT" thing, and especially those of you who are angry at 
Ravi's recent posts, I'd like to ask you a favor, and I mean this 
sincerely.  I'd like to ask you to take a deep breath, calm down, and 
try to look at the whole thing objectively.

First of all, I honestly believe that some of you are reading *way* 
too much into Ravi's statements, and taking him to mean things that 
he has not said or done.  This is probably due to the emotional 
nature of the whole issue, which is certainly understandable.  

We had a situation that degenerated into personal criticism and name 
calling.  Be honest, and you have to admit it's happened to the best 
of us.  ;)  That said, I think it's fair to say that most people here 
would prefer that we didn't have that kind of behavior here on a 
regular basis.  I say that based on the past content of this list's 
messages (many months worth of great conversation and help), and on 
recent comments from people such as Joe and Damon, quoted below:

-----
Joe, in response to an inflammatory message, said:
"Someone criticizes one aspect of a synth you like and you resort to 
name calling - that's not what this community's about, is it?"
-----
Damon, in response to Ravi's request, "Stop this thread please. Both 
parties.", said:
"Thank you, Moderator."
-----
(I'm assuming that Joe and Damon weren't being sarcastic or cynical.)

I was honestly shocked and bewildered that Joe and Damon now want to 
leave the group, or maybe they've actually already left.  Joe and 
Damon, if you're reading, you are among the last two guys I would 
have expected to want to leave, given your statements above.

I really think all Ravi said and meant is that he would moderate 
posts of the "personal criticism and name calling" nature in the 
future.  He has never "squelched discussion and criticism" in the 
past, nor can I believe he would do it in the future.  (How many 
times have we had dissenting opinions in the past?  Lots!)  I also 
don't think that Ravi ever said or meant that you "can't voice 
discontent with behavior here".


So again, I ask you take a deep breath, try to look at the whole 
thing objectively, put the problems behind us (again, we all make 
mistakes), and move on.

Why do I care, and why do I ask this?  Because I think your views, 
your knowledge, and your participation in these forums is valuable 
and enjoyable.  It HAS been a good community, and I really hate to 
see any of you leave the group because of a misunderstanding.


One last comment... Consider that Ravi is doing what he thinks is 
best for the group.  You may or may not agree with his judgement, but 
at least respect that he's trying to do what he thinks is right.  And 
to be clear, this *is* Ravi's Yahoo group.  For anyone that may have 
a misunderstanding, Dave Smith does not own this group, sponsor it, 
or control it in any way (the same goes for our Evolver forum at 
EX5Tech).


Let's get back to having fun with our Evolvers, shall we?


Ski
www.ex5tech.com
EX5Tech Evolver forum:
http://www.ex5tech.com/ex5ubb_cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=forum&f=23

I have to say I was a bit surprised and disappointed about the 
moderator wanting to end the discussion in such a sudden and 
authoritarian way. I was very much enjoying the discussion. I 
don't know much about Waldorf synths and was very interested 
in the comparison. Yeah, tempers can flare and it can be 
annoying to read through but just about everyone was 
contributing interesting things. There have been times on this list 
where weeks have gone by without a single post. I personally 
would rather have heated discussion with the occasional temper 
flare than dead silence like we've had before. That's my opinion. I 
hate to see people leave over somethng silly too. Everyone loses 
out when that happens.

steve

Even though I've asked yahoo to unsubscribe me, I am not removed yet, 
so I received this.

Since I have been called out specifically and made an example of, 
improperly (as I will explain below), I will voice up one last time 
here.

The reason I left was because of what Ravi reacted to.  I was glad the 
thread was to be closed due to the name calling, the blatantly rude 
behavior.

However, that decision is worlds apart from the final message in which 
Ravi told me and others to silence up as "Last warning to ALL of you on 
this thread, including all who complain about complainers".

I don't want to be a part of a community that cannot voice discomforts 
about the state of things within the community.  This is what has me 
leaving.  I agreed with closure of the thread, but to say that you'll 
be moderated if you voice complaints about the state of the list seems, 
to me, completely counterproductive to any community growth.

If Ravi didn't mean this, he needs to be more careful about how he 
phrases things if he is to run any community, because the message is 
pretty clear and concise, and very, very controlling.  "Last warning 
to ALL of you on this thread, including all who complain about 
complainers. Next step will be that your posts will be moderated by 
yours truly and they simply won't get through."  This is pretty broad, 
and the moderation he is implying is one of complete squelching, 
silencing of all posts.

I also don't believe anyone should be running a community who proclaims 
themselves "I have no patience."  I don't want to be a part of that 
sort of rule.

For the record, none of this changes my opinion about the Evolver 
itself.

On May 25, 2004, at 4:19 PM, ski_ex5tech wrote:

> I'd like to ask everyone a favor...
>
>  For everyone that's upset about this whole "Poly Evolver vs Waldorf
>  Microwave XT" thing, and especially those of you who are angry at
>  Ravi's recent posts, I'd like to ask you a favor, and I mean this
>  sincerely.  I'd like to ask you to take a deep breath, calm down, and
>  try to look at the whole thing objectively.
>
>  First of all, I honestly believe that some of you are reading *way*
>  too much into Ravi's statements, and taking him to mean things that
>  he has not said or done.  This is probably due to the emotional
>  nature of the whole issue, which is certainly understandable. 
>
>  We had a situation that degenerated into personal criticism and name
>  calling.  Be honest, and you have to admit it's happened to the best
>  of us.  ;)  That said, I think it's fair to say that most people here
>  would prefer that we didn't have that kind of behavior here on a
>  regular basis.  I say that based on the past content of this list's
>  messages (many months worth of great conversation and help), and on
>  recent comments from people such as Joe and Damon, quoted below:
>
>  -----
>  Joe, in response to an inflammatory message, said:
>  "Someone criticizes one aspect of a synth you like and you resort to
>  name calling - that's not what this community's about, is it?"
>  -----
>  Damon, in response to Ravi's request, "Stop this thread please. Both
>  parties.", said:
>  "Thank you, Moderator."
>  -----
>  (I'm assuming that Joe and Damon weren't being sarcastic or cynical.)
>
>  I was honestly shocked and bewildered that Joe and Damon now want to
>  leave the group, or maybe they've actually already left.  Joe and
>  Damon, if you're reading, you are among the last two guys I would
>  have expected to want to leave, given your statements above.
>
>  I really think all Ravi said and meant is that he would moderate
>  posts of the "personal criticism and name calling" nature in the
>  future.  He has never "squelched discussion and criticism" in the
>  past, nor can I believe he would do it in the future.  (How many
>  times have we had dissenting opinions in the past?  Lots!)  I also
>  don't think that Ravi ever said or meant that you "can't voice
>  discontent with behavior here".
>
>
>  So again, I ask you take a deep breath, try to look at the whole
>  thing objectively, put the problems behind us (again, we all make
>  mistakes), and move on.
>
>  Why do I care, and why do I ask this?  Because I think your views,
>  your knowledge, and your participation in these forums is valuable
>  and enjoyable.  It HAS been a good community, and I really hate to
>  see any of you leave the group because of a misunderstanding.
>
>
>  One last comment... Consider that Ravi is doing what he thinks is
>  best for the group.  You may or may not agree with his judgement, but
>  at least respect that he's trying to do what he thinks is right.  And
>  to be clear, this *is* Ravi's Yahoo group.  For anyone that may have
>  a misunderstanding, Dave Smith does not own this group, sponsor it,
>  or control it in any way (the same goes for our Evolver forum at
>  EX5Tech).
>
>
>  Let's get back to having fun with our Evolvers, shall we?
>
>
>  Ski
>  www.ex5tech.com
>  EX5Tech Evolver forum:
> http://www.ex5tech.com/ex5ubb_cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=forum&f=23
>
>
>
>
>
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on 5/25/04 7:06 PM, Damon Menne wrote:

> "Last warning to ALL of you on this thread, including all who complain about
> complainers. Next step will be that your posts will be moderated by yours
> truly and they simply won't get through."  This is pretty broad, and the
> moderation he is implying is one of complete squelching, silencing of all
> posts.

where do you get that? it applies to the participants of that thread, and
the people who complain about the complainers...that hardly qualifies as a
³complete squelching, silencing of all posts.²

> For the record, none of this changes my opinion about the Evolver itself.

cool.

don¹t let the door hit you in the ass. ;)

and just a word of advice...don¹t take ASCII characters so seriously and
personally in the future! :P


wink,
aeon