Digital BW, The Print

Shilesh, thanks for the heads-up on the Wolf workflow. I will check it when
it is posted.

Yes, I am applying an adjustment curve I made using my scanner, but I think
it is flawed. Without any curves, the gray ramp seems to have problems
around 15%, 65% and 90%, where there seems to be sharper transitions in the
ramp. My attempts at curve production just seem to move these problem areas
around (though I think I am getting more accurate 5% steps).

This is what led me to the conclusion that the inks & driver didn't mesh the
same way as the OEM color inks.
-BK

----- Original Message -----
From: "janishilesh" <shilesh.jani@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, June 18, 2002 2:12 PM
Subject: Re: [Digital BW] MIS-FS and PiezoTone test; now FSN 'E' hex


> Barry,
>
> I talked to Bob Ziess of MIS yesterday, and he told me that the c and
> m inks in FS-E were 1/3 dilutions of the normal FS inks. I don't know
> how this dilution translates to density, because it is not a linear
> function. In the normal FS inks, C=c (dark), and M=m (medium). So the
> FS-E inks tone order is CcMmY (inks position) =
> dark/medium1/medium2/light1/light2. I don't what the density
> relationship will be between medium1 and medium2, or light1 and
> light2. No matter, an RGB curve will need to be used to control the
> tones to bring each of the 5% print patches in-line with the expected
> density. Bob has not posted a curve yet, but he told me that he has
> received one from John Wolfe, and will be posting it soon. I am not
> sure which printer model it is for. However, I expect the curve
> generated on one hextone printer should be fairly close to universal
> for all 6 color printers, provided you maintain the same image space
> and other printer settings. Minor tweaks should be all that is
> necessary. Are you using an adjustment curve?
>
> From my own personal experience, a proper match (but not necessarily
> exact match) between perceived gray density of the OEM color and true
> gray (FS) inks is all one needs for a seamless ramp, and little issue
> with posterization.  My judgement tells me that the most important
> thing is that the progression from dark to light be maintained in the
> correct order. The perceived gray density (lightness value?) of OEM
> color inks from dark to light is approximately CMcmY.  I use the FS
> inks, but with modified positions, in the following manner: CcMmY
> (ink position) = CMCMY (FS inks) = dark/medium/dark/medium. Then I
> created a global RGB curve to get proper separation of 5% patches.
> Because of the tone order I use, the curve does not have steep
> gradients. Steep gradients in the curve actually can lead to
> posterization (or more accurately solarization). This work-flow on my
> 1280 gives me the best b/w prints I have ever made. The RGB curve can
> be found at the inkjetgoodies.com web-site (I have no interest in the
> company). This work-flow will, however, require you to use a CIS or
> fill your own cartridges. One thing I have found is that it helps to
> have a little toe in the dark end of the spectrum, i.e. the
> relationship is not linear at the dark end. I prefer my 5% RGB to be
> in the 2-3%, and the 10% be around 8%. This gives an overall
> impression of darker blacks in low-key images. For high-key images,
> it is better to have a straight linear relationship.
>
> I have actually found that for the 1280 class of printer, you
> actually need only 3 tones (black, dark, and medium) to get very good
> prints. The folks at lincolninks.com have been advocating this
> approach for quite a while.
>
> Good luck.
>
> Shilesh
>
>
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Barry Kelsall"
> <bktimes@y...> wrote:
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Paul Roark" <paul.roark@v...>
> >
> > > With the hextone machines, the Epson driver does not
> > > work at all because the FS and Piezo cyan & photo (light) cyan
> > > are the same density -- likewise for the magenta
> > > & photo magenta.  MIS now has what they call the FS-"E"
> > > series that is geared to the Epson driver, but I'm
> > > not sure anyone has developed workflows for the inks.
> >
> > I am using the FS-N "E" in my 1200 and can say it works great for
> > high-contrast, busy images.
> >
> > But on portraits I see mild posterization.
> >
> > I am no expert, but I am thinking that the density of the
> replacement ink
> > must match the Epson OEM color ink for this to work with the native
> Epson
> > driver. For example, say the hex-black cyan is a tad less dense
> than the
> > Epson cyan, and the hex-black photo-cyan is a tad more dense than
> its OEM
> > counterpart. Then the transition in the Epson driver between these
> tones
> > will not work, producing a flat spot where the inks mix that no
> amount of
> > RGB curve tweaking can cure. And only one of the inks needs be off
> to
> > produce this problem (this is my fuzzy logic here, though I state
> it like an
> > accepted pardigm).
> >
> > Also disturbing are the reports I have seen of users seeing
> posterization
> > with the Piezography driver. Even a dedicated partitioning solution
> has
> > problems?
> >
> > -BK
> > who is wondering what to try next
>
>
>
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