Digital BW, The Print

Hallo again,

A question!

Those with new printers like 9000 Epson series - if you
look very close to the tubes - it's very tiny, and hard to find.
Can You see any "type number" or brand on them!

If on those printers they must be good - however bending flexibility
might be different - and the main last support may be modified.

Simple done with a thin plate of aluminium that is cut out and bended,
and fixed to hold the tubeset free!

Made three CFS's myself - the weak link is the tubes! Cheap things!
both on MIS and CIS version of CFS-systems!
(I know what it is! Water permeable and used for short term in 
hospitals and universities!)

For those interested have a look here!
Alcohol at least seems to be one ingredient:
http://www.tygon.com/new/europe/english/europe_chem/chemahead.html

Fiat Lux!
Bo
Moderator "Minolta Multi Pro" at Yahoo

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "sm7bxd" <sm7bxd@y...> 
wrote:
> 
>  
>  
> 
> Hallo,
> 
> I have posted in this issue before! 
> 
> My own name for it "the master black devil clog"!
> 
> This is not only a MIS issue - got letters from others having the 
> same problems!
> 
> 
> I'm that type of person that I might do photographing for let's say 
> three weeks, scanning for four days - printing for 4-5 days, in 
> cycles. And that cycle may vary - depending of many a thing!
> 
> I have three CFS's - 1290 (1280's)(dye color, pigment color and a 
> QUAD- systems that vary - and the my black tubes is clogged 
> completely now and then. As beeing aware of it - I take the 
following 
> measures:
> 
> Rip of the black-tube.
> 
> When printer not in use losen it from the black cart and plugs it 
> with a 6 mm tube that is melt glued in the end.
> Rise the black tube to emty it into the bottle - and plug the tube 
as 
> well with a meltglued inlet-knee that is sold from MIS.
> 
> When to use the printer - - the plug from the cart is taken away - 
> the ordinary tube is put back *when* I have filled the tube with 
ink, 
> by carefully pressing the black bottle until the black tube is 
filled 
> (put some absorbic paper on the black cart to soak some drops of 
> black ink!)
> A drip of isopropanol now and then on the parkingpad is liked by 
the 
> printers!<smile> Keeps the nozzels fit!
> 
> 
> The "dye-ink" - printer does not seems to have the same issue - 
howeve
> I must clean this by printing some color-purging prints now and 
then 
> to keep it fit for imediate use - otherwise this one also clogs in 
> the nozzels!
> 
> Why this - because - the tubes are as well absorbic to air as well 
as 
> pearmeable for fluids. I destroyed one printer - if not doing this -
 
> the black "fat grease" end up in the black cart - whatever you do.
> 
> I have investigated the tubes from CIS and MIS and they are about 
the 
> same cheap stuff. There are other things - just now I have 
> one "black" Tygon SE 200 for test taped on to the tubeset - and it 
> works flowlessly so far. But I got one user mailing me when this 
> issue was up last time - and he told me that he used the same TYGON 
> SE 200 (a tube with inert of teflon) and the innert cracked. 
> Not mine so far!
> 
> I have had this up with MIS directly and inderectly with the CIS 
> deliverants and both simular cheap tubings!
> 
> Nothing done so far!
> 
> I'm not alone -got plenty of E-Mails last time it happend and this 
> issue was up!
> 
> ( You can start reading here - taken from the middle when this 
issue 
> was up last time! 
> 
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/message/146
> 15 )
>  
> This should be solved by the companies delivering the systems - as 
> they are aware of it!
> 
> I have mailed the deliverants - and they did ask me not to "blow
> this up".
> 
> *Now* I got enought!
> 
> However - they have now been given proper time to "fix it" - but 
> they don't seems to care!
> 
> I did - as you can see do some investigations as the engineer I am -
 
> however - time and job ended this!
> 
> If somone want's to cooperate I might take it up again. But there 
are 
> costs (tubes and fright) and time involved - buying mounting , fill 
> tubes and plug them,
> and put them in heat (40 degres celcius) and then measure the 
weight 
> on in milligrams over the time - and make carefull notes. Also 
> testing and modifying holders are involved as the bending stiffnes 
> are different.
> 
> Cut out from earlier post:
> 
> This is what is used - the cheapest there are: 
> Look for Tygon® Vacuum Tubing : Formulation R-3603
> 
> http://www.tygon.com/new/europe/english/en_europe_index.html
> Look into the PDF - and you see it's waterpermeble. (Think for 
> youself what happens when you get other chemicals in it!) 
> 
> What we have stated 
> 1/ Low pressure
> 2/ Low flow or slow flow
> 3/ The Specific area of the tubes are very big that is:
> the tubes must not absorbatic or permeatic.
> This is 1,2 and 3 - Fluid stays relatively long time in the tube
> The risk of both absorbation of outer air and parmation and thereby 
> evaporation on the tubes surface are to be stopped. 
> What is good:
> a/ that the "transporting area" is very good.
> b/ That friction agains the tubes walls are NOT a big issue(slow 
> flow)!
> c/ Pressure compared to the pressure that ALL tubes of Tygon is of 
no 
> interest here - We have a very low pressure - next to none here 
> compared to what the tubes they sell have!
> d/All other tubes now examened has better/same fattigue strenge.
> 
> The flexibility of the of the tubes are important - and they stated 
> that the hardnes meassured in Shore does in whole (some correlation 
> here but it could also be the opposit) has not to do with the 
bending 
> stress or bending elasticy force.
> 
> All othe tubes now examened has better fattigue strenge.
> 
> The HOT one just now is the inert tube that You can see here:
> 
> Look for: Tygon® Inert Tubing Formulation SE-200
> http://www.tygon.com/new/europe/english/en_europe_index.html
> 
> The gay that reported of the "cracked" inerts in this tubes - seems 
> to have vanished??? Are You there - *please* mail me! 
> 
> But - again - It's not our job to get "nice" tubes - it's up to the 
> deliverants of this systems - not???
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fiat Lux! (Let There be Light!)
> 
> Bo Wrangborg
> Moderator "Multi Pro" at Yahoo
> M.Sc. Engineer
> But in soul born to Photographing and Drawing!
>  
> 
> 
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Paul Roark" 
> <paul.roark@v...> wrote:
> > Using old CIS's that had been sitting around for a while totally 
> killed the
> > head of my 1160.  I'm not sure what the exact cause of the 
problem 
> was, but
> > I suspect something is drying out in those systems when they are 
> sitting
> > around unused.  (One thread here seemed to indicate that the 
tubes 
> allow
> > some air to seep through.  I would think that dried ink around 
the 
> outlets
> > might also be a source of problems.)
> > 
> > While the ink that caused my problem was Generations, I suspect 
all
> > pigmented ink would cause the same problem.  In fact, I suspect 
> that the
> > VM/FS black and all the old Piezo inks would be the worst due to 
> the more
> > volatile co-solvent base that is used in those inks.  (But that 
co-
> solvent
> > is probably one of the reasons the VM/FS and PiezoBW blacks -- 
not 
> the new
> > PT K --  were the best all-pigment blacks I've tested.)
> > 
> > At any rate, I'd be reluctant to use a CIS that had been lying 
> around unused
> > for too long.  Replacing the head of my 1160 was not cheap.
> > 
> > Paul
> > http://www.PaulRoark.com
> > 
> > 
> > _________________________
> >   -----Original Message-----
> >   From: azshtr [mailto:dave@t...]
> >   Sent: Tuesday, July 09, 2002 11:46 AM
> >   To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y...
> >   Subject: Re: [Digital BW] Cleaning Nomorecarts CIS tubes
> > 
> > 
> >   --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y...,
> >   Bernhard.Schuerlein@t... wrote:
> >   > ----- Original Message -----
> >   > From: "k2_chittin" <k2chittin@l...>
> >   >
> >   > > MIS VM with a new set of carts.  Having washed out the old
> >   ink with
> >   > > warm water, I'm unable to get the "black" tube completely
> >   clean.  Has
> >   > > anyone who has done something similar been able to
> >   completely clean
> >   > > their tubes?
> >   >
> >   > This is funny, because after some 3 weeks of no printing my
> >   black cart tube
> >   > was permanently clogged and I had to get replacement from
> >   MIS. The clolour
> >   > ink tubes were fine however...
> >   >
> >   > greetings Bernhard
> > 
> >   Ditto... after not using my system for a while the nozzle check
> >   showed no black. After much cleaning and trouble shooting it
> >   turned out the Black line was hardened, completly dry inside in
> >   places.
> > 
> >   Dave
> > 
> > 
> >         Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> >               ADVERTISEMENT
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >   Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, 
> Polls and
> > other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
> > 
> >   http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> > 
> >   Please follow these basic guidelines:
> >   - Include your full name with your message.
> >   - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> >   - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier 
> messages to keep
> > them short.
> >   - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the 
subject 
> header.
> >   - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or
> > "flames."
> >   - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> >   - Before posting a question, search the message archives and 
the 
> various
> > resources on the homepage.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >   Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of 
> Service.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]