Digital BW, The Print

Todd,

They are supposed to be 100% pigment, like the Color Piezo. Actually 
the list owner just sells the inks, and appears totally dependent on 
his information from the manufacturer. I went down that path with the 
Cone Color Piezo inks becoming a paying beta tester as did many 
others. While I don't doubt the Indelible inks work fine in the older 
Epsons like the 1200 and the large format Epsons (for which they were 
originally designed), I want proof from the 12x0 and 2000P line 
before spending the money.

My testing has shown that the variations in these newer Epson 
printers can be substantial from printer to printer. It seems to boil 
down to the voltage output on each given printer at the head. In 
testing many different inks, I have found that many inks that work 
with the 1200 and older lines sometimes will not work in the newer 
versions. Much of this has to do with the split droplet design, as 
well as lower voltages in the two photo colors. Some will band, some 
will mist, some will do both. The lower voltage output of the two 
photo colors seems to be where the most problems stem from, as I 
usually see little in the way of problems from the K,C,M, and Y. Many 
of these inksets will need reformulated for lower viscosity in the Cc 
and Mm positions to prevent problems.

As a result of the testing I have done I have become very cautious 
about compatibility claims. I did offer to beta test the Indelible 
inks in CIS systems on my printers since I was blessed (cursed) with 
2 1270's and a 2000P that will show these problems, but never 
received a reply.

As a side note and good news is that the following inksets all work 
perfectly:

MIS archival color
Enhanced Generations
MIS Variable Tone  

I think it is important for these ink manufacturers to shoot for 
formulations that will work in the bulk of the printer lines they 
advertise compatibility with. What I am finding, is that most only 
test in one printer and if it works they claim compatibility. The 
Color Piezo inks were a perfect example of this - they claimed 
compatibility with the 12x0 and 2000P line with minimal testing (even 
though they had a 2000P that showed the misting problem). They then 
purchased 10 brand new printers and 2 of the 10 showed problems, now 
they don't recommend these inks in cartridges (but claim to be 
developing a high viscosity CIS!?) for the 12x0 or 2000P line.

Just my 2 cents and maybe something for any ink manufacturers 
monitoring the list to consider.

Terry

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., Todd Flashner <tflash@e...> 
wrote:
> Ha, I hadn't even noticed the part about the mono inks. That is 
interesting.
> I don't even know if any of these inks are dyes or pigs, do you?
> 
> Todd
> 
> > All I know is from the same list Todd, so you know as much as I. 
I'm waiting
> > for some responces to Jim's questions too. I was
> > just suprised they are offering quad and hex mono inks, all 
previous info has
> > been about color.
> > We'll see.
> > Tyler
> > 
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., Todd Flashner 
<tflash@e...> wrote:
> >> Tyler,
> >> 
> >> I've been monitoring that list for a week, and so far haven't 
heard anything
> >> but sales claims. Those claims do sound good, but I'd sure like 
to hear them
> >> backed up by some users. Have you seen anything along those 
lines? I found
> >> the follow up questions to that post interesting and hope some 
answers will
> >> follow. At $50 per 4oz color, testing won't be cheap. Anyway, if 
you do hear
> >> of anything good from a third party please pass it along.
> >> 
> >> Todd 
> >> 
> >>> Well, as always when I get settled into certain materials and 
workflows,
> >>> something interesting comes along to consume
> >>> all my time with testing. I don't feel comfortable directly 
quoting people,
> >>> but for those interested in another pigment quad/
> >>> hex ink as well as color, check this out-
> >>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/InkOptions/message/62
> >>> Haven't tried it yet.
> >>> Tyler