Digital BW, The Print

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Steven 
Karafyllakis <stevek@e...>" <stevek@e...> wrote:
> Hi Martin;
> 
> This all sounds very interesting-is there a URL for Sundance, and 
do 
> you have any idea if the PixelPixasso rip will support other (not 
> seven ink) printers in some fashion?. Also: not to be negative,but 
> did you happen to mention to them how absurd these prices sound to 
> most of us?  I just got to see a couple of test prints of Pauls 
new 
> UC VM inks, and I have to say that no matter how good a solution 
the 
> R9 set is, they have some serious competition here. Most people, 
> myself included will try Paul's new set first, and stick with it 
if 
> it works, even though we really want a driver/rip that gives us 
> proper control at the gui.
> 
> Steve K
> 
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Martin 
Wesley" 
> <mwesley250@e...> wrote:
> > A week ago I received a set of five ~6x9" prints, printed on the 
> same long strip of Photo Rag by a 7600 using a new set of inks 
from 
> Sundance and software by R9. These are the two companies 
responsible 
> for developing the original Piezo inks and software plugin. There 
> was an information sheet with the prints explaining how the system 
> worked.
> > 
> > I also exchanged a couple of e-mails with Gary Rogers of R9 and 
> got the chance to talk to him by phone.
> > 
> > The Septone inks are a set of a neutral black with three neutral-
> warm gray inks and three neutral-cool gray inks. These are 
designed 
> for use in the new 7-ink Epson printers. Specifically the 2200, 
7600 
> and 9600 printers. The PixelPixasso RIP allows the user to 
determine 
> the blend of the gray inks in the high, mid and low tones of the 
> grayscale image.
> > 
> > First a paper profile is selected and then three sliders allow 
you 
> to set the ink blend for each tonal range in 1% increments.
> > 
> > The five prints I received include one print made with 100% NC 
in 
> all three ranges, one with 100% NW in all three, one with 50/50% 
> NW/NC in all ranges, one set to 100% NC in the highlights, 25/75% 
> NC/NW in the mid tones and 100% NW warm in the low or shadow 
tones, 
> the fifth print was set to 100% NW in the highlights, 25/75% NW/NC 
> in the mid tones and 100% NC warm in the low tones.
> > 
> > The prints are of a wonderful image of a single fully opened 
rose 
> blossom taken by Ken Niles. It is a full range image with gentle 
> tonal graduations in all areas of the tone scale. The hue of the 
> prints is very nice in all the examples. I lean more to the warm 
> side of neutral but the cool will appeal to many. The 100% cool is 
> about as cool as MIS-FN, not quite as cool as you could get from 
MIS-
> VM using a "cold" curve. The warm print falls somewhere in-between 
> Warm Neutral PiezoTone and Carbon Sepia PiezoTone. A little more 
> reddish than MIS-FS or MIS-VM with a "warm" curve. Not as red as 
MIS-
> VM Sepia.
> > 
> > None of the prints show any sign of metamerism under tungsten, 
> quartz-halogen, fluorescent or day light. Nor do I see even the 
> slightest hint of olive or yellow-green that I see prints made 
with 
> the original Sundance/Piezo inks.
> > 
> > Unfortunately there were no step-wedges included but hunting 
> around the prints with an X-Rite 811 densitometer I measured Dmax 
> values in the 1.71 to 1.74 range. These were consistent throughout 
> the five prints and are comparable to MIS-FS black and PiezoTone 
> Portfolio Black.
> > 
> > The really fascinating thing is that the tonal balance across 
all 
> five prints is identical. The highlights don't blow out or the 
> shadows don't get muddy as the ratio of the two gray sets is 
> adjusted. As Gary explained the software takes into account the 
> varying ink densities and make compensations on the fly to keep 
the 
> over all balance.
> > 
> > Simply put what you have here is all the advantages of the tonal 
> variation of MIS-VM with finer control combined with the tonal 
> accuracy and ease of use of the R9/Piezo plug-in. They are side 
> stepping the inherent problems of using a toner gray and RGB 
> separation curves to "trick" the Epson driver and address the 
> printer directly. Based on the samples and the description, 
without 
> actually have had a chance to try it myself, it looks like a 
> wonderful plug-and-play B&W solution for the 7-ink printers.
> > 
> > For those of you who need it, PixelPixasso is also a color RIP 
and 
> is sold on a "one license per CPU" basis so you can use the RIP to 
> control a dedicated B&W printer and a separate color printer as 
> well. Can't tell you anything about the color potential though.
> > 
> > Please note that the inks used are not the original 
Piezo/Sundance 
> inks. The NC grays are the current Sundance NC and the NW is a yet 
> to be released ink set using the same chemistry as the NC. Gary 
says 
> these inks do not suffer the clogging issues of the original inks. 
> The NC set has been fade tested by RIT and received a >100 years 
> rating with the comment "...seemed to be almost not affected by 
the 
> exposure to light." Gary expects the NW inks to be even slightly 
> more light resistant.
> > 
> > The Sundance NC inks have been available since last summer and I 
> am wondering if anyone out there has given them a try. If anyone 
> has, please share your experiences.
> > 
> > The new Sundance NW inks will also be available separately and 
> will be compatible with the R9/Piezo plug-in. This will bring the 
> total of warm tone ink sets for the plug-in up to five! Sundance 
> plans to continuing marketing the original inks but perhaps under 
a 
> new name such as "Classic".
> > 
> > I don't have any pricing information on the ink cartridges but I 
> expect it will be in line with Sundance (www.bwguys.com) pricing. 
> The PixelPicasso will also follow their RIP pricing of $1,495 for 
> the 7600/9600 wide format printers and $495 for the desktop 
version 
> of the RIP. Particularly exciting for those like me who have 
neither 
> the resources or space for one of these wide printers, they expect 
> to be selling pre-filled 2200 cartridges by the end of March and 
> expect to sell the hue blending software as $150 plug-in or 
perhaps 
> simply include support for the ink, the blending feature and the 
> 2200 into the existing R9/ plug-in. This put the entry level price 
> point at $850 for a new 2200 with the plug-in plus the cost of the 
> inks. With the availability of continuous inking systems for the 
> 2200 coming on line this makes the entire thing very attractive.
> > 
> > Quite frankly the quality of these prints seems much superior to 
> anything I have seen from the 2200 using the Epson inks. However, 
> like any of the carbon pigment inks, I assume you would not have 
the 
> ability to print on RC type glossy papers as you can with the 
Epson 
> ink.
> > 
> > Since this software is designed to work with two sets of gray 
inks 
> that closely match the density range of the original 
Sundance/Piezo 
> inks, it makes me wonder if you couldn't use it with other pairs 
of 
> gray inks such as Warm Neutral and Cool Neutral PiezoTone or 
> Selenium and Warm Neutral PT or MIS-FS and FSN or....
> > 
> > I posed this question to Gary and he wrote back:
> > 
> > "Both user experience and our own rigorous testing and analysis 
> show that the R9 software will not perform to its maximum capacity 
> when used with unsupported inks or media and may not perform as 
> intended. A change in solvent, dMax, and/or chroma between ink 
sets 
> would necessitate the profiling of the ink/media/printer 
> configuration. R9 will profile ink sets for manufacturers, but it 
> requires a commitment of resources on the part of the ink 
> manufacturer."
> > 
> > This is a very reasonable answer and given the shifts observed 
in 
> switching from original Piezo to PiezoTone inks with the Piezo 
plug-
> in, correct. Change any part of the system and there will be 
changes 
> in the final result. However, as many of us have found the change 
is 
> often something we can live with or work around so there may be 
> possibilities in this direction. Gary's last sentence should be of 
> interest to ConeTech and MIS. Sounds like R9 is holding the door 
> open to add support for other ink sets to their software. I hope 
> one, or better both, will seriously consider this offer.
> > 
> > Sundance and R9 plan to make the official announcement next 
> weekend at PMA. Hopefully there will be more info then. If you go 
to 
> PMA, stop in at their booth (P-70) and let us know what you think.
> > 
> > Martin Wesley
> > 
> > http://www.borderless-photos.de/guests.html
> > 
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]