Carl, That looks a lot like I'm getting. Here's my carbon(warm) and neutral: Carbon: Step Gain Density 0 0.00 0.076 ** 5 -0.28 0.126 **** 10 -0.35 0.181 ***** 15 -0.02 0.243 ******* 20 -0.58 0.296 ******** 25 -0.13 0.365 ********** 30 0.07 0.435 *********** 35 -0.05 0.503 ************* 40 0.41 0.585 *************** 45 -0.08 0.656 ***************** 50 0.06 0.743 ******************* 55 0.13 0.834 ********************* 60 0.02 0.928 ************************ 65 0.11 1.034 ************************** 70 0.10 1.148 ***************************** 75 0.37 1.279 ******************************** 80 0.51 1.420 ************************************ 85 -0.26 1.551 *************************************** 90 0.44 1.750 ******************************************** 95 0.12 1.939 ************************************************* 100 0.00 2.180 ******************************************************* Neutral: Step Gain Density 0 0.00 0.058 ** 5 2.02 0.135 **** 10 3.48 0.209 ****** 15 4.11 0.278 ******* 20 4.76 0.350 ********* 25 4.41 0.413 *********** 30 4.01 0.478 ************ 35 3.64 0.548 ************** 40 3.95 0.632 **************** 45 4.50 0.726 ******************* 50 4.23 0.812 ********************* 55 3.69 0.899 *********************** 60 2.32 0.974 ************************* 65 3.38 1.111 **************************** 70 3.81 1.246 ******************************** 75 4.00 1.389 *********************************** 80 3.69 1.535 *************************************** 85 2.06 1.650 ****************************************** 90 3.29 1.896 ************************************************ 95 1.85 2.060 **************************************************** 100 0.00 2.252 ********************************************************* With the neutral there's a lot of ink hence the higher dmax. With the carbon I have a GRAY_OVERLAP=20 so there's 20% light gray with the dark gray. The result looks quite nice, no bronzing, but even after an hour of drying there's a little tackiness in the dark areas. It's pretty delicate for a long time. Roy --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Carl Schofield <scho@m...> wrote: > Roy, > > That worked just fine. I dropped Eboni out of the UT1 mix and made > curves using just C, LC, and Y grays for the carbon-warm curve and > added M and LM toners for a cool curve, on Epson Photo Paper. Just > kept the ink limits all at 100, partitioned the grays as usual, and > linearized. Below is a plot of the densities for a 50% blend of the > warm and cool curves. I made a neutral and warm print of a test image > with these curves and they look great with no rub-off, bronzing, or > gloss differential problems. The prints have a beautiful, uniform, > soft gloss and the 1.9+ dmax on plain old epson photo paper isn't too > shabby. So, "K-less" printing now for glossy papers? > > Carl > > Step Density > 0 0.028 * > 5 0.075 ** > 10 0.132 **** > 15 0.188 ***** > 20 0.247 ******* > 25 0.293 ******** > 30 0.359 ********* > 35 0.424 *********** > 40 0.501 ************* > 45 0.582 *************** > 50 0.645 ***************** > 55 0.742 ******************* > 60 0.837 ********************* > 65 0.918 *********************** > 70 1.024 ************************** > 75 1.133 ***************************** > 80 1.265 ******************************** > 85 1.401 ************************************ > 90 1.533 *************************************** > 95 1.703 ******************************************* > 100 1.932 ************************************************* > > On Monday, January 19, 2004, at 08:40 PM, Roy Harrington wrote: > > > > > Hi Carl, > > > > I just sent my post about leaving out Eboni. I'm thinking that once > > you drop eboni from the mix you may actually be able to use the > > toner. > > > > Roy > > > > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Carl Schofield > > <scho@m...> > > wrote: > >> Paul, > >> > >> You are right about the toner limitation for glossy with the UT1 inks > >> and I have some UT2 inks on order from MIS, but I just wanted to see > >> how this worked with the UT1 inks since I still have them loaded in > >> the > >> 1270. I did get somewhat higher dmax with Epson Pro Glossy (1.76) and > >> even better with Ilford Smooth Pearl (2.04), using the same 92% curve > >> limit at 100%. However, when I printed a QTR warm curve (no toner) on > >> the Pro Glossy the dmax dropped to 1.59 and the print showed bronzing > >> and gloss differential as well. > >> > >> Carl > >> On Monday, January 19, 2004, at 04:05 PM, Paul Roark wrote: > >> > >>> Carl, > >>> > >>> The problem with this Eboni-glossy printing approach and the UT1 is > >>> the > >>> light toner. In UT2 the coolness comes from an ink that is actually > >>> a > >>> hair > >>> darker than the UT1 cyan. That accounts for the dmax differences, I > >>> assume. > >>> > >>> Paul > >>> www.PaulRoark.com > >>> _____________________________________ > >>> > >>> -----Original Message----- > >>> From: Carl Schofield [mailto:scho@m...] > >>> Sent: Monday, January 19, 2004 12:50 PM > >>> To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com > >>> Subject: Re: [Digital BW] Re: Glossy printing with Eboni -- who > >>> needs a > >>> 4000? > >>> > >>> Roy & Paul, > >>> > >>> I tried the UT1 inks with Eboni K in my 1270 using a neutral curve in > >>> QTR and printed to Epson Photo Paper. The Eboni rubbed off and > >>> showed > >>> a gloss differential only in the 100% patch. However, by applying a > >>> curve adjustment layer and limiting output at 100% I was able to get > >>> rid of the rub-off and gloss differential. The "optimal" 100% output > >>> limit in terms of dmax was at 92% and there was no rub-off or gloss > >>> differential. Print looked great with no bronzing either. Dmax > >>> numbers (see chart below) were not that great but the blacks still > >>> looked good. I did no spraying with Print Shield for these tests. I > >>> wonder if more C position gray ink were laid down under the Eboni if > >>> dmax would be higher. Roy, could this be accomplished with a higher > >>> GRAY-OVERLAP? I was using 10%. > >>> > >>> Carl > >>> > >>> Curves 100% Ouput D > >>> 90 1.64 > >>> 91 1.64 > >>> 92 1.65 > >>> 93 1.631 > >>> 94 1.614 > >>> 95 1.609 > >>> On Monday, January 19, 2004, at 02:42 PM, Roy Harrington wrote: > >>> > >>>> > >>>> Hi Paul, > >>>> > >>>> I'm curious just what you've got here. Is it that this one specific > >>>> paper Smooth Pearl is somehow compatible with Eboni but > >>>> others aren't? Or are you just not using the Eboni ink by making > >>>> the 100% spot just 100% R and G and 0% B -- i.e. the dark warm > >>>> gray and dark cool gray inks are enough to give a great dMax. > >>>> > >>>> Roy > >>>> > >>>> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Roark" > >>>> <paul.roark@v...> wrote: > >>>>> OK, this is a little half-baked, but the bottom line is that I've > >>>>> hit > >>>>> a dmax > >>>>> of 2.28 on Ilford Galerie Smooth Pearl - with Eboni. There is not > >>>>> significant dusting or rub-off. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> The secret is that the UT2 (and perhaps UT1) inks use a base that > >>>>> is > >>>>> the > >>>>> glossy binder. It's not an acrylic coating on the particle. So, I > >>>>> don't > >>>>> let Eboni sit there by itself - or barely at all. So, to the > >>>>> extent > >>>>> there > >>>>> is Eboni there, it is held by the base that carried the other inks > >>>>> into that > >>>>> spot. The best dmax so far is with the yellow position sepia toner > >>>>> pulled > >>>>> out entirely at the 100% spot. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> Whether I can write full curves for this is untested. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> So, there is more to do here before declaring any kind of victory, > >>>>> but we > >>>>> may not need to mess with switching blacks any more. Now that > >>>>> would > >>>>> be > >>>>> nice. > >>>>>
Message
[Digital BW] Re: Glossy printing with Eboni -- who needs a 4000?
2004-01-20 by Roy Harrington