Yahoo Groups archive

Digital BW, The Print

Index last updated: 2026-04-28 22:56 UTC

Message

Part Two: Experiments; question

2004-03-10 by sandersm@aol.com

As a follow-on to my last post (see below), I should mention that the 
Oriental FB print gave the look of a darkroom fiber print only after having been 
oversprayed with 3-4 coats of PremierArt Shield spray.   The unsprayed prints had 
bronzing and surface gloss issues that would have made the results 
unacceptable, but the spray corrected those problems and the result was quite pleasing.

A couple of people have found Oriental FB lacking in DMAX.   I am working by 
eye, not with a densitometer.   But to my eye the Oriental gives a much deeper 
black than any of the matte papers I tested.   The Epson Semigloss might have 
a higher DMAX, but I could not see it; and the Oriental paper to my eye has a 
superior surface texture to the semigloss, and also did a better job of 
revealing detail in the deepest shadows.   And while I cannot explain it, somehow 
the the Epson semigloss looked "flatter," while the Oriental gave a greater 
sense of depth, or dimensionality, to the image.   I would be very interested to 
hear if anyone else has noticed this.

And when I said that most of the images in my test were difficult to 
distinguish, I was referring to the image itself, and not the papers, which had clear 
differences in color and surface texture.   Of the matte papers, the Hawk 
Mountain papers (Merlin and Condor BW) were a pleasant surprise.   I will use them 
again. 

We return you now to your regular programming, already in progress.

Sanders McNew
www.mcnew.net



---Original Post---

Over the weekend, I ran several different ink/paper/driver combinations 
through my 2200, trying one last time to get a good answer to how best to charge my 
7600 for B+W printing.  I printed using QTR, the Colorburst RIP and CJ's BO 
method.  I used matte K and photo K.  I used BO with matte K on matte and Epson 
semigloss alike.  Papers ... Hawk Mountain Merlin and Condor BW, Epson 
Ultrasmooth Fine Art, Moab Entrada, Oriental FB glossy, Epson semigloss, and a sheet 
of EEM just to be sure.  Inks in all cases were the Epson UC inkset  (I tried 
to use the UT2200 Eboni cartridge, but it stayed stubbornly uncooperative to 
the end.)  The test image was a chiarascuro image of a dancer, dead black 
field with the midtone grays and highlights you would expect to find in a figure 
study, from a Rolleiflex Tri-X negative scanned at 3200 dpi and printed 6 
inches square.

With two exceptions, the amazing thing about this orgy of printing was how 
similar the results looked.  Just to be sure it wasn't my bad eyes, I took the 
prints into my office and summoned whoever passed by in for a look, and all 
concurred that you had to strain to see any difference.  I can pick out the BO 
prints from the others because they seem a tiny bit more vibrant in the 
highlights (a good thing) and a tiny bit rougher in the transitions from shadow to 
light (a bad thing).  But from a foot away it is hard to see a difference.

The exceptions:  (1) The Oriental FB, printed with QTR and photo K, stood 
apart from the rest.  Its surface, AFTER printing, looked very very close to a 
darkroom print, and the image had a depth and dimensionality the others lacked.  
Shadow detail was superior to the others, and it offered a much deeper black 
than the competition.  Too bad the largest sheet is 13x19, of it would be the 
winner in my book.  (In fairness, the office divided between it and the Epson 
Ultrasmooth.)

(2) The BO print with matte K on Epson semigloss was a dud.  The paper 
cockled under the amount of ink the printer laid down to create the black field.  
This was a disappointment, because BO had worked so well in all other respects.  
I changed to an image with a more even distribution of grays, and this BO 
paper/ink combination looked great with the second image.

So, as of Tuesday night, I have concluded that there is no clearly right 
answer, but the happy flip side is that there seem to be few wrong answers too.  I 
think I will go with the Epson UC inkset and the matte K ink for my 7600, and 
run it with QTR.  I love QTR's ability to tone prints by blending profiles -- 
so easy, and so elegant.

BUT

that Oriental print gives pause.  I would love to use the paper, if it were 
available in larger sizes. 

QUESTION:  Someone on the list mentioned a paper, from Lyson I think, 
claiming that it too had a printed surface amazingly close to a darkroom fiber 
print.  At the time, I tried and failed to find information about the paper.  Does 
this ring any bells with anyone?  Is the paper on the market yet?  And if so, 
can someone provide a link to a web page that describes it or offers it for 
sale? 

Sanders McNew
www.mcnew.net


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Attachments

Move to quarantaine

This moves the raw source file on disk only. The archive index is not changed automatically, so you still need to run a manual refresh afterward.