Digital BW, The Print

Julian, et al,

I am with you...I have to choose market/sell/promote or work and I
absolutely hate it. (I don't quite understand how I can be so compulsive and
nit picky about my images and can't oraganize anything else, priorities, I
guess) 
I have belonged to a cooperative gallery...it was fun, work and didn't sell
much, but work got seen.
At present, I am concentrating soley on work...no competitions, galleries or
showing portfolios. I only want to create art that is meaningful to me...I
recognize that it may not "sell", but I think it needs to exist...who knows,
maybe someday people will base art preferences on something besides sofas
and size...
Sooo....back to work.

t

> From: "Julian Thomas" <julianthomas@...>
> Reply-To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2001 23:03:57 +0200
> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: Re: [Digital BW] Lenswork issues
> 
> Harvey,
> I agree totally with your post on editioning. Nothibng to add!
> 
> The dealer thing is tricky - dealers/ galleries can only take on a limited
> number of photographers. So there are always people - like me - spending a
> small fortune on portfolios, building up images. It would be really nice to
> be able to increase sales without relying on the whim of a third party.
> Maybe cooperatives, web sites, are a way forward?? BTW I'm crap at the
> commerce side, I have no interest in it. It feels like I've spent the last 2
> months doing nothing else.
> 
> Julian
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "SKID Photography" <skid@...>
> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2001 10:54 PM
> Subject: Re: [Digital BW] Lenswork issues
> 
> 
>> Julian Thomas wrote:
>> 
>>> I've just received two copies of Lenswork - issues no 36 and 37. If no
> one
>>> has seen this magazine it is a must. it is very well written, aiming at
> an
>>> intelligent audience (one issue even has an article by Tolstoy!) with
>>> well-presented photography - almost like an academic journal but more
>>> readable!
>>> I ordered these two issues because of two articles - one by Brooks
> Jensen
>>> on editioning, and one by John Wimberley on 'dealing with dealers'. Some
> of
>>> you know that I had an unpleasant expereince at a Gallery where I was
> told
>>> that I could only make 4 copies of an editioned print 'for it to be
> art',
>>> and that I had to 'make it big'.
>>> Brooks makes the valid point that editioning is solely a marketing ploy
> and
>>> that it is better to sell more prints at a lower price than artificially
>>> limit the sale to an arbitrary number of prints.
>>> John tells a number of horror stories and then advocates breaking the
>>> dealer's monopoly by photographers contacting collectors directly.
>>> Now this last point, to me, is the crux of the problem, if editioning
> only
>>> benefits dealers, then in order for the photographer top benefit, one
> needs
>>> to sell directly to collectors. But HOW?? Has anyone any thought on
> this?
>>> Some people use the internet http://www.davebeckerman.com/ for example.
>>> Anyone else do this?
>>> 
>>> Julian
>> 
>> Julian,
>> I should start by saying that I have not read the articles you mentioned,
> but am commenting just on your post.
>> 
>> In my opinion, this concept of cutting out the 'middleman', (the photo
> dealer, or gallery owner) is a little
>> short sided and unfair.  Think about it, (and I am talking *only* about
> reputable dealers), selling art is a
>> *business*, it has *nothing* to do with art, the quality of said art, or
> making art...it is commerce.  Do not
>> confuse art and commerce!  (I know I keep on harping back to that line,
> but is *SO* important!)
>> 
>> Yes dealers get 50%, but if they do their jobs properly, they deserve it,
> the same as any retailer.  They have
>> overhead and need to invest time and money in your work, in order to sell
> it.  Most times, in the beginning, a
>> dealer cannot get a lot of money for an emerging artist's work, they need
> to work their connections and
>> collectors to 'brand' you, in the same way Epson has branded themselves as
> a company that makes good inkjet
>> printers.  If you turn around and go to the collectors that have already
> bought your images (through a
>> dealer), then you are stealing the dealers hard, honest work.  Also,
> collectors go to dealers because they
>> trust the dealer's taste, opinions, and ability to find new talent.
>> 
>> You ask how to get to the collectors?  That *is* the big question...And
> that is where the galleries and
>> dealers come in.  It is *their* job to find those people..  They have
> galleries, which they advertise and
>> promote, in order to get collectors interested enough to come in.  They do
> press releases, maintain and send
>> out mailing lists, schmooze with art critics etc.  Yes, we might be able
> to do that part ourselves, but then
>> it takes away from the time we want to use making art in the first place.
> Some people enjoy it, some are
>> terrible at it.  The choice is yours, but still remember, do not confuse
> art and commerce.
>> 
>> Editioning:
>> 
>> If you recall, I posted that the whole modern concept behind editioning
> was purely a commerce/marketing
>> issue.  Originally, etchings were editioned because the etching plate
> literally wore out, and the earlier
>> prints were a higher quality.  There really was a finite number of prints
> that could be made from an etching
>> plate.  With modern steel plating techniques that is no longer true.
>> 
>> Yes editioning now is usually a marketing ploy.  I think it was Brett
> Weston's son, but it might have been a
>> Brett Weston sibling, who was (I don't know if he is still doing this)
> making one print from his 8x10
>> negative, and then dry mounting the neg. to the back of the print.  I
> guess to him it was the initial
>> 'concept' that was important, and he never wanted to revisit those
> thoughts...I find that limiting.
>> 
>> Ansel Adams did at least one 'portfolio' in the 60's where, after printing
> the initial portfolio edition,
>> (which might have been as high as 100) he put the negatives through a
> Pitney Bowes 'cancellation machine' (it
>> punches holes through them) so that he could never make any more prints.
> It was a marketing ploy that Ansel
>> lived to regret, and said so.  Years later, he felt he could have done
> more with the images, but couldn't
>> because he had destroyed the negatives...So much for the initial
> 'previsualization' (and this is from the
>> originator and master of the concept).
>> 
>> You have to decide if you want the initial money for limiting the print
> run, or you want the freedom over the
>> long haul to be able to revisit those images.  Again, while I know that
> dealers *claim* that they need to get
>> the photographers to limit the editions to get 'prices', history has shown
> us that it is just not true.
>> Edward Weston's 'Pepper #40' has the most copies in circulation, and still
> goes for the most at auction.  It
>> is sort of a 'catch 22'...If you are famous, it's ok, if you're unknown,
> you *must* follow the rules...Just
>> like with print quality or originality.  Michael Stipe of REM can get away
> with publishing books of photos
>> that look exactly like student work, but students could never get the same
> deal....Go back to the 5 rules of
>> success.  ;- )
>> 
>> Harvey Ferdschneider
>> partner, SKID Photography, NYC
>> 
>> 
>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>> 
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> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and other
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