Digital BW, The Print

Mike and Julian, 

Both of you have interesting points that are well articulated.  Keep it up.  It is enlightening and certainly adds some "weight" to this forum.

But make sure you continue to play by the Rules of good sparring...

Regards and appreciation to both of you. 

Steadman


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: mh@... 
  To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2001 6:36 AM
  Subject: Re: [Digital BW] ART-what is it?


  --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Julian Thomas" <
  julianthomas@t...> wrote:
  > Sad isn't it. Art dealers support stuff they can sell, critics write about
  > things they can write about. None of this has anything to do with the work,
  > but with the concept behind the work. Arts education (and I used to be in
  > it) ,for a whole load of reasons that has very little to do with teachers,
  > is doing a poor job of educating people about art - and very often people
  > need the help of a dealer to interpret a 'concept'. And there is no causal
  > link between those who have money to buy art as having the skills to make a
  > judgement.
  > 
  > Julian

  I halfway don't agree with you. When talking about dealers, you need to 
  differentiate between the high end and the low end. Low end dealers, 
  the kind that are in every city, deal in stuff that they can sell, 
  usually a lot of Terry Redlin type paintings. High end dealers don't 
  care about whether the art will look good over a couch because, as we 
  have all seen, they can sell about anything (my old bosses had a 
  sculpture made out of manure in our studio) Nothing has changed in the 
  low end art world for a long time, and you won't really come away with 
  much other then a pretty picture (probably of something cute)  High end 
  art is always changing, usually much more interesting and will make you 
  think, but not always something you want in your house.

  Critics mostly go along with the high end dealers, so they are not 
  really hurting or helping things a lot of the time. The time when 
  things become skewed is when a famous person (like a hollywood type) 
  buys something and then all the other famous/rich people have to buy 
  the same thing. We can only hope that there was someone knowledgeable 
  in the field of art that influenced the original guy on his/her 
  purchase.

  Art is a very complex thing, most people think that the upper echelon 
  is pretty strange because they have no basis to understand nor the 
  patience or determination to follow up. I can describe this with 
  another one of my interests: volleyball. Most people can take or leave 
  volleyball. Some play it, but they prefer a soft $10 ball and play with 
  a standard rotation. But once you get into it, you learn that the play 
  at the higher end is a completely different game. You play with a $60 
  ball that is made with different materials in a different way; there 
  are positions, each with a different responsibility, and you learn 
  lineups, hits, and rules that you never knew existed before. Some of it 
  is based on history and tradition, some of it is based on new rules 
  that everyone likes to complain and argue about. Most people play maybe 
  once or twice a year in someone's backyard or at the beach, I play 
  twice a week, year-round, now.  Is good art something that should 
  require such a commitment? maybe not, but as the world gets older, and 
  people have more time on their hands, and doing something original 
  becomes more difficult, things naturally become intricate and 
  complicated.


  When you say this; "None of this has anything to do with the work,
  > but with the concept behind the work"
  you must remember that in a lot of those cases, the concept is the work 
  and the concept is what the buyer is buying. You can go to some 
  galleries and buy a piece in an edition and what you get are directions 
  on how the create the piece yourself and a certificate that says you 
  own number such and such out of such and such. Thankfully that is a 
  moment in art history and I don't believe artists today are able to get 
  away with such things. But if you come up with another twist, 
  complexity, or concept that adds something new, you could probably sell 
  an idea too.

  This is how art varies from other fields. An artist with very little 
  experience/knowledge of the art world, can create great art.  Studying 
  art will help you recognize and understand other people's work. It will 
  help you see greatness, and your own work will improve, but studying 
  alone will not make your work great. (that is why so many artists are 
  frustrated)

  -mikeH
  toomanyartists.com

  ps 
  The thing that is sad is not the high end art world, it is the low end/
  popular art world and the populations lack of interest in anything more 
  than a nature scene. Trendy-ness is something the art snobs love to 
  hate, but in actuality is one of the only things that help bring better 
  art to the masses. Offensive or outrageous pieces can do the same thing 
  because of the press and attention they receive (see Piss Christ).



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