Digital BW, The Print

_Martin, thanks for the evaluation, I'll 
interject my comments in your text body.



Message: 23
   Date: Thu, 09 Aug 2001 03:53:20 -0000
   From: mwesley250@...
Subject: Spectratone Print Samples

Allen,

I got the sample prints you sent. Thanks a 
lot, just when I was 
getting used to the warm tone of my Piezo 
prints you have to go and 
send me these prints with a wonderful cool 
selenium tone. Sigh.

Seriously the color of the ink set is very nice 
indeed and the prints 
sitting on my table say "silver." I seriously 
doubt that the average 
viewer would realize they were inkjet and not 
the genuine article. In 
side-to-side comparisons with selenium 
toned Ilford and Oriental 
fiber paper under a combination of quartz 
halogen and tungsten 
floods, the Spectratone looked a little cool. 
Under tungsten very 
neutral. Both nice and to my taste. Have you 
considered a variable 
tone approach similar to what Paul Roark 
worked out with the MIS inks?

~no, I'm keeping it simple at this stage of the 
game

Anyone out there trying to get pigment ink to 
stay on papers like 
Kodak Ultima Satin should stop driving 
themselves crazy and take a 
look at this stuff. Allen, have you tried that 
paper by the way?

~no, I'm sticking to the polymer and geletin 
coated papers for max longevity

I do have to disagree with you on the 1200 
vs. 3000 output. To me the 
1200 print on the Ilford 9 mil glossy is the 
best. Black looks a 
little blacker. Slightly smoother tonal 
transitions. Looks sharper at 
normal viewing distances.

~that's why I send the samples out.  i think 
that they are very close and depending on the 
media etc, may alternate on quality of dither.  
the black point of the 3000 is controllable in 
PressReady and these are kinda "general 
solution prints"

Under magnification I can see the dot pattern 
on 3000 prints and an 
occasional tiny tonal band. At normal 
viewing distances for these 
8.5X11's this gives the image a bit of a 
grainy quality on the very 
glossy film, which is very unforgiving, a 
little less on the semi 
matte and completely invisible on the Oce 
Watercolor. With large 
prints or on textured paper this would not be 
an issue. 

The 1200 print under magnification shows a 
dot pattern which is much 
more subtle. (This is much better than the 
"window screen" pattern 
that I see in my Piezo prints with the 1200.) 
The edges of the 
letters are much sharper and cleaner than the 
3000 prints. Even on 
the glossy paper I can't see the pattern under 
normal viewing.

~thanks for the in depth inspection.  
depending on your requirements, the 3000 
may be a "done deal" but if you are printing 
small on glossy this kind of anaylsis may be 
relavent.  The 3000 separations for the inkset 
CMYK = 2341 are for a general solution 
with a dark biased inkset so that you can also 
print on high bleed uncoated papers as well 
as the glossy papers.  Dan Culbertson has 
probably worked out the ultimate smooth 
solution for coated papers only.  


The print from the 1200 indicates that it was 
printed using 
the "Standard RGB 1200 driver 5.6E" was 
this done without PressReady?

~yes.

I like the inks but I am not fond of the 
papers. The Ilford papers 
are too much like RC silver for my tastes but 
at the same time the 
1200 print is closest thing to real RC silver in 
quality I have seen. 
In some ways I like is better. I can see some 
slight "bronzing" 
or "solarization" when light reflects off the 
glossy prints, nothing 
extreme like a pigment print on glossy paper, 
but noticeable. 
Probably less than a silver RC for that matter 
but I don't have a RC 
print handy to compare. The semi matte is 
more appealing and shows 
much less "solarization" than the glossy.

The Oce Watercolor looks the best except 
that the texture is too 
large for a print this size and overwhelms the 
image. The print color 
and tonality are excellent with better 
separation in the shadows. I 
would really like to see the ink on some 
bright white papers ranging 
in smoothness comparable to Museo or 
Epson Archival Matte. Once again 
there is a large amount of personal taste 
involved here.

~these are just small sample prints on the Oce 
Watercolor paper.  think 17" x X" on the 
3000

This would be a perfect ink set and paper 
combination for Rick 
Schiller who was looking for a reliable 
neutral B&W output for his 
head shot work or anyone wanting the look 
of a glossy silver gelatin 
print. This would also be really great on the 
big printers 7000 or 
9000 for display prints. The output is much 
nicer than the monochrome 
Fuji Crystal I saw a few years ago. (I 
haven't seen anything recent 
so the Fuji may have improved). A photo lab 
or service bureau could 
offer top notch B&W without the huge cost 
of a LightJet. 

Would be a great way to provide contact 
negs for alternative 
processes as well. I can also see why Dan 
Burkholder is looking at 
this for making contact negatives. Not only 
do you have the high 
quality and density but it actually stays on the 
film unlike the 
pigment inks. 

~we are still fiddeling around with a high 
density black just for contact negs since Dan 
isn't getting the D-max he needs for platinum 
palladium prints.  I get good paper white 
with gum bichromate and cyanotype but 
haven't completed the circle on platinum.

For the lone photographer starting from the 
ground up there look to 
be two paths.

- The Epson 3000, Adobe PressReady and a 
set of ink cartridges for 
about $1,500. If you already have the 3000, 
$500

-A refurbished Epson 1200 ($234), CIS, ink 
and PressReady for about 
$815. If you already have the 1200, about 
$580.

First of all is that correct or can you go 
without the PressReady on 
either printer?

~nope, no PressReady needed on the 1200.

~I still haven't tried out PressReady on the 
1200 since I like the Epson built in 
separation solution with the native free RGB 
driver.   It's best to try out the spectratones 
in a regular cart in the 1200 before 
proceeding with CIS units since I haven't 
run the various types of CIS units.  I still like 
the 3000 since it's so reliable in it's 
preformance and refilling is easy and 
verifiable.  



Have you run the inks with an Epson 1270 
or 1280? If I were going to 
buy another printer, I would just as soon get 
a model that is still 
in production.

~no, but I'm open to a little beta testing for 
owners of current models.  drop me a line.

I'm curious to give them a try, but I would 
like a better art paper 
for small size "fine art" prints and some way 
cheaper to stick my toe 
in the water. I am thinking of trying the new 
MIS on a 1280. If that 
works out, I'll consider switching my 1200 
over to the Spectratones.

Thank you again for the prints. I know you 
sent them out to some 
other folks on the list and I hope they will 
chip in their opinions 
too.

Keep us posted on your work with Dan and 
developements in general.

Martin Wesley

~thanks for the comments Martin.  if I get 
time, perhaps I'll work on a more specific 
solution for coated media on the 3000.  
Now, I wonder what Dan Culbertson. has 
been up to in this area?

Allen