Digital BW, The Print

John,

I'm not a chemist, but anyone can get some information about Epson ink
content from looking at their Material Safety Data Sheets, which are on the
web at 
http://www.epson.com/cgi-bin/Store/support/Supportmsdsmain.jsp?BV_UseBVCooki
e=yes

I take it from these that Epson inks have a lot of proprietary pigments in
them besides carbon.  ON the other hand, I think aside from the acrylic
coating, I think Epson pigments are not that unique.  The pigment industry
is rather larger than Epson.

I think the encapsulation is acrylic and is for adhesion to the glossy
papers mostly.  

With respect to the Archival K, in my fade tests it performed more like the
old MIS VM K than the newer, high-load MIS and UC black inks.  The MIS VM K
had a slight amount of dye in it, as did the competing black pigments of
that time because, from what I've been able to learn, the industry did not
know how to keep the higher loads of the newer inks in suspension.  I've
heard the C86 DuraBrite black is, likewise, a hybrid black.  

A large part of the new generation of inks has more to do with the
base/dispersant (fluid) than the pigments themselves.  I see this, for
example, in the amount of the color pigs I have to use to neutralize the
midtone warm carbon (mostly at least for MIS, I'm told) gray inks.  The new
MIS and UC color pigs are simply more concentrated than the older MIS and
Epson Archival pigs.

I wish we did know more about these pigments, but the companies are rather
protective of their products.  I've been able to learn more for the
watercolor information (see http://handprint.com/HP/WCL/water.html)  and
what is put out by some of the large companies like Cabot.  I have a pdf
that is rather good from them.  I can send this off list.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com 





-----Original Message-----
From: john dean [mailto:deanwork2003@...] 
Sent: Saturday, January 15, 2005 9:12 AM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Digital BW] Epson's various black pigments - are they carbon ? or
what?



To all you digital photo chemists out there: does anyone have any idea  what
the Epson 
BLACK pigments are composed of chemically? I vaguely remember Paul saying
that he 
thought the Ultra chrome matte black was carbon pigment, similar to the
composition of 
some of the new generaton of quad pigments out there. What about the CF
Epson Archival 
inkset? Does anyone have knowledge of them also?

I know that Epson's pigments are "encapsulated" with a poly resin,
presumably to make 
them flow better through the nozzles without as much clogging ( according to
Epson's 
reps) and give better moisture and light protection, if I remember
correctly.

Someone on one of these lists also made the statement that the Cf inkset
might have 
some dye in it, but I think that was just speculation. This does not make
sense to me 
because of the WR permanency rating that gave this inkset much higher
ratings, and also 
the fact that if a dye was incorporated ( which I think it is not) the dmax
would be a lot 
better than it is, which is less than the carbon pigments used in other
inksets. Since that 
inkset was designed for outdoor as well as indoor imaging, that would
certainly be counter 
productive.

Just curious. I like to know as much as I can about these things from
unbiased sources.

John








Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as
they are often being updated.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint

If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same
page.

Please follow these basic guidelines:
- As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
them short.
- Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames.
Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
membership without notice.
- Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W
printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from
the membership.
- By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and
guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner and
Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines" in the Files section:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/

BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE "OWNER" AND
"MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU
FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY
DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS,
GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  "OWNER" AND
"MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE
POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY
TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR
ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY
THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER
MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
 
Yahoo! Groups Links