Digital BW, The Print

Paul,

The data section of the test file is in nine colums as follows:  Data 
number (1-51 in my case, 1-21 in yours); Sample name (A1, A2, A3, B1, 
B2, B3, C1, etc.); percentage of gray (e.g. 80.00); XYZ_X (e.g. 
4.65); XYZ_Y (e.g. 4.77); XYZ_Z (e.g. 3.54); LAB_L (26.08); LAB_A 
(e.g. 0.58); LAB_B (e.g. 2.52).  

Roy or Steve would know better, but I doubt Create ICC is reading the 
first column and probably not the second.  As Steve also suggested, 
the LAB_A and LAB_B columns could also be filled with zeros if you do 
not want to soft proof the actual paper color.  As the column 
headings are misalighed in my text file, I don't think Create ICC is 
looking for these headings, but rather columnar data that makes 
sense, left to right.  So, don't worry about the headings.  I suspect 
that columns 3-9 (or maybe 4-9) are the ones to have "in form."

I have found that the profiles from ICC create in a PS workflow are 
incredibly useful and I would encourage you to at least take a 
serious look at this.  I have finally found a reliable, consistent 
workflow to print through the Epson ABW driver.  This should be the 
same for any other form of output, driver, etc.

Best,
Walt


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Roark" 
<paul.roark@v...> wrote:
>
> Walt,
> 
> Thanks for the information, that clarifies it somewhat. 
> 
> I have an X-Rite where I'll have to create the text file manually.  
What
> format is used?  I see what appear to be some sample files in the 
i1 folder,
> but it's not really clear how I'd plug in the L values for the 21 
steps.
> Since I only have the 2.3.1, I may have to just wait until that 
version is
> fixed.
> 
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> > [mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf 
Of wwodets
> > Sent: Monday, October 17, 2005 7:04 PM
> > To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: Re: [Digital BW] ICC v. Transfer Function in Epson driver
> > 
> > Paul,
> > 
> > To try and clarify:  The Create ICC.exe is a "droplet" program.  
You
> > take the text file with the data and drag and drop it onto the
> > program (and not a shortcut to the program). Create ICC will then
> > create the ICC profile in the same folder as the text file.  When 
you
> > do this, a window will open momentarily while the program is 
creating
> > the ICC profile,  but the program does not "run."  I keep a copy 
of
> > the program on my desktop (not a shortcut to the program) and then
> > drag and drop the text file on it.  I then have the ICC profiles 
on
> > the desktop and move them to the color folder.
> > 
> > There is a text file in the Eye One folder of the QTR folder and 
it
> > explains the use of the program.  Although Steve has described
> > something different, I had problems with the output (to the 
printer)
> > with Create ICC 2.3.1, so I have returned to the version in QTR
> > 2.3.0.  In a post on the QTR forum, Roy actually suggested using 
the
> > 2.3.0 for output until he corrected the problems in 2.3.1.
> > 
> > Best,
> > Walt
> > 
> > 
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Roark"
> > <paul.roark@v...> wrote:
> > >
> > > Carl,
> > >
> > > Are you using Windows XP?  I think one problem I'm having is 
that
> > the Create
> > > ICC program doesn't seem to want to run at all.  I assume this 
is a
> > > different program than the Create Curve program -- or am I 
totally
> > confused?
> > >
> > > Paul
> > > www.PaulRoark.com
> > >
> > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> > > > [mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On 
Behalf
> > Of Carl
> > > > Schofield
> > > > Sent: Monday, October 17, 2005 5:02 PM
> > > > To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> > > > Subject: Re: [Digital BW] ICC v. Transfer Function in Epson 
driver
> > > >
> > > > Paul,
> > > >
> > > > A simple text file with a column of Lab L values or density 
values
> > > > measured from a 21 step wedge is probably all you need (use a
> > column
> > > > heading of D for density values or L for Lab L values).  Just 
drag
> > > > and drop the text file onto the Create-icc script and it 
should
> > > > create both the icc profile and a text file with a plot of the
> > data.
> > > >
> > > > Carl
> > > >
> > > > On Oct 17, 2005, at 8:42 PM, Paul Roark wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Steve,
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >> ...
> > > > >>
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>> So, does black point compensation mean the curve hits 
(0,0)?
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>
> > > > >> Yes.  ...
> > > > >>
> > > > >
> > > > > OK, BPC is used to take care of the end point issues, as I
> > > > > understand it.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >> ... in XYZ (for B&W we only care about Y)
> > > > >>
> > > > >
> > > > > I thought Y in CIE XYZ was green.  Or do you mean the Y in 
xyY?
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >> ...
> > > > >> BPC scales the data such that the curve begins at 0,0.
> > > > >> So when you send pixel value 0 to the printer
> > > > >> it gets left at 0 and hence prints as dark as the printer
> > possibly
> > > > >> can.
> > > > >>
> > > > >
> > > > > This is what I'd want.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >> ...
> > > > >>
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>> Is the QTR Curve Creator Linearization tab a look-up take
> > interface?
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>
> > > > >> Now it is.
> > > > >>
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > I think I'm only able to open the Curves Creator and not the
> > > > > "QTR-Create-ICC.exe."  Is this just a Mac program, or does 
it
> > > > > require i1?
> > > > > (It's in the i1 folder.)
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >> ... [Roy's] aim is to proof hue and luminance correctly.
> > > > >>
> > > > >
> > > > > Ultimately, that could be useful, but for the B&W I'm 
targeting
> > now
> > > > > it's
> > > > > complexity that gets in the way of the basics of B&W 
printing.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >> ...  ICC profiles have the advantage
> > > > >> that people can set up soft proof in the normal fashion.
> > > > >>
> > > > >
> > > > > That sounds like another complex story.  If we're in PS the
> > custom
> > > > > dot gain
> > > > > curves do it, but we do need to get a simpler method.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ...
> > > > >
> > > > >>> Is there a place that describes the specific ways in 
which a
> > > > >>> Windows XP user
> > > > >>> can use QTR to make an ICC that can be used in the Print 
with
> > > > >>> Preview
> > > > >>> workflow and then the Epson driver?
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >> Not sure but it is really very easy.  Print a step wedge 
with
> > the
> > > > >> workflow
> > > > >> of your choice eg Epson Adv B&W with a particular set of
> > > > >> settings.  Scan
> > > > >> the
> > > > >> step wedge with an EyeOne or other device that will 
provide the
> > > > >> sort of
> > > > >> data
> > > > >> QTR Create ICC can read. ...
> > > > >>
> > > > >
> > > > > I'm not sure I can even open Create ICC.  So far I just get 
a
> > > > > momentary
> > > > > flash on the monitor.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>> Are those ICCs useable in the Print with Preview procedure
> > > > >>> with the Epson driver?
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>   Yes I use them all the time.  I have profiled my Epson 
Adv
> > B&W
> > > > >> settings, one for each hue - neutral, warm, sepia and 
cool.  I
> > do
> > > > >> not mess
> > > > >> with the darker and other settings (other than hue).  I 
prefer
> > to
> > > > >> edit the
> > > > >> image in PS rather than in the driver which has limited 
editing
> > > > >> ability.
> > > > >>
> > > > >
> > > > > The possible advantage with using the driver controls as 
much as
> > > > > possible is
> > > > > that they may well be doing hardware linearization in the
> > driver --
> > > > > with no
> > > > > loss of grayscale steps.  The ICC or TF in the Print with
> > Preview
> > > > > -- or
> > > > > anywhere in PS -- loses some information with each
> > transformation.
> > > > >
> > > > > Interesting stuff, but I don't seem to have an easy way to 
make
> > the
> > > > > ICCs at
> > > > > this point.
> > > > >
> > > > > Paul
> > > > > www.PaulRoark.com
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
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> > printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be 
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AND
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LIABLE TO
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OF
> > PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF 
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