Digital BW, The Print

Walker wrote:



Colorburst can get there with custom RGB  
Input and CMYK output profiles.  But the amount of time spent setting  
up a quality color-ink-to-bw setup has always been 4 times as long as  
dedicated Quad-split or K7. And much more complicated.



I couldn't agree more. We've been using ColorBurst for about five years now; currently with a 9800/ConeColor ink set-up and our old trusty 4000/OEM inks. You an achieve neutral grayscale printing with these set-ups, but you have to know a lot about profiling, and have professional profiling software/hardware to do it. It's a sound approach for anyone wanting to tunnel that deep into color management. In my opinion, this is not a good approach for those wishing to work on the prosumer level. It also doesn't negate any issues related to CMYK+ ink fade/shift over time; it just allows you to produce a neutral grayscale print with a color ink set.



I don't want to offend anyone on this list but I find that threads like this are repeatedly rooted in the difference between working on a consumer or prosumer level versus working on a professional level. The current OEM printing solutions are so much better than what we had to work with just a few years ago. QTR, out of the box, has opened up an easily implemented alternative. It's up to each worker to pick their sweet spot, and master an approach that makes best sense to them. I don't think it serves anyone's best interest to confuse what can be accomplished on the prosumer20level with the potential that exists beyond that.




Paul wrote:




"I'm hopeful that the 8 carbon inks and QTR will allow me to print on Arches uncoated watercolor paper more smoothly and with a better dmax than the OEM approaches, and 100% carbon on Arches is about as close to my "carbon on cotton" ideal medium as I think I can get. (And it's going to be a lot of fun exploring tinting & painting with watercolors with my painter as well as photographer friends.)"




We've printed large editions using our 9800/ConeColor/ColorBurst set-up on Arches BFK uncoated. Really beautiful, but with a "soft" black. Very appropriate for some work. Paul, you are aware that BFK is now available coated for inkjet? I think this paper is one of the best yet. I really love it for both color and dedicated grayscale printing (we're using a 9600/K7 Sepia set-up). It's my choice for printing my own work. Contact Jim or Mary at Shades of Paper for information.







Bill Kennedy

K2 Press, Inc.

Austin, Texas



-----Original Message-----

From: Walker Blackwell <forums@...>

To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Thu, Sep 3, 2009 8:58 am

Subject: Re: [Digital BW] Dedicatd B&W printer - is it worth it?











The whole reason why I went dedicated bw back when I was just learning  
all this was because I didn't want to deal with complicated CMYK  
profiles and the RGB drivers just weren't up to snuff. Over the years  
I realized mor
e and more that CMYK ink mixed into a grayscale print  
just doesn't physically work very well. QTR gets it almost their with  
its various tonal splits. Colorburst can get there with custom RGB  
Input and CMYK output profiles.  But the amount of time spent setting  
up a quality color-ink-to-bw setup has always been 4 times as long as  
dedicated Quad-split or K7. And much more complicated.

Dedicated is worth is. And you get way better physical (real-world)  
resolution with K7 dedicated. Just look at Tyler's blog for that. The  
difference between dedicated and CMYK is the same to me as the  
difference between BW on c-paper and BW on silver paper. No contest.

That said, there are times when I like the wide-open toning options  
available in a well built CMYK grayscale environment.

Walker



On Sep 3, 2009, at 9:40 AM, deanwork2003 wrote:

> That's a bit of a distortion. There is no real "learning curve"  
> unless you are mentally challenged.
>
> A learning curve is trying to make clean neutral monochrome out of  
> ABW that won't shift in color over time.
>
> So, the answer is yes, its definitely worth the trouble.
>
> john
>
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, C D Tobie  
> <CDTobie@...> wrote:
> >
> >
> > On Sep 2, 2009, at 5:46 PM, tboleyyh wrote:
> >
> > > One other thing I will say, to play my own devil's advocate. Some
> > > people either can not see the difference in the prints, or are
> > > unconcer
ned with the differences. This poster sounded like he is a
> > > fairly serious B&W worker.
> >
> >
> > Thats really the crux of the matter, Tyler, not "is it easy" but  
> "do I
> > want it"... the parenthetical part being: "want it badly enough to  
> go
> > through whatever learning curve and efforts are required."
> >
> > C. David Tobie
> > Global Product Technology Manager
> > Digital Imaging & Home Theater
> > CDTobie@...
> >
> >
> > ----------
> >
> >
> > Datacolor
> > www.datacolor.com/Spyder3
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>
>
> 

Walker Blackwell
802.735.0621
www.walkerblackwell.com
aim: greendirtblues





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