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Damage from Windex

Damage from Windex

2011-06-03 by David Kachel

Has anyone in this group had any experience with using Windex, as suggested
by so many, resulting in damage to aftermarket cartridges or to the printer?
Especially but not exclusively with regard to the Epson 3800.

Also, has anyone had any experience with current production B&W carbon ink
sets damaging 3800 printers or aftermarket cartridges?


David Kachel

___________________

Artist-Photographer
Fine B&W Photographs

www.davidkachel.com
david@...

Gallery:
www.reddoorfinephotographs.com
director@...

PO Box  1893
Alpine, TX 79831
(432) 386-5787




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Damage from Windex

2011-06-03 by -= Chris =-

and..... what kind of damage are we refering to?


----- "David Kachel" <david@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> Has anyone in this group had any experience with using Windex, as
> suggested by so many, resulting in damage to aftermarket cartridges or to the
> printer?

Re: [Digital BW] Damage from Windex

2011-06-03 by David Kachel

>>> and..... what kind of damage are we refering to?

It has been suggested that using Windex to clean out the lines and head
prior to loading aftermarket Pigment B&W inks will damage various parts of
the lines and print head and also irreparably damage the cartridges
themselves making them not useful for ink. I have also kept my non-used
position cartridges filled with Windex. The obvious conclusion that this
long-term use of Windex should be even more damaging, though this suggestion
was not made.


David Kachel

___________________

Artist-Photographer
Fine B&W Photographs

www.davidkachel.com
david@...

Gallery:
www.reddoorfinephotographs.com
director@...

PO Box  1893
Alpine, TX 79831
(432) 386-5787





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Damage from Windex

2011-06-03 by David Kachel

>>> and..... what kind of damage are we refering to?

Š I forgot;

More specifically, the ammonia in Windex corrodes and otherwise harms
printhead parts and cartridge parts.


David Kachel

___________________

Artist-Photographer
Fine B&W Photographs

www.davidkachel.com
david@...

Gallery:
www.reddoorfinephotographs.com
director@...

PO Box  1893
Alpine, TX 79831
(432) 386-5787





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Damage from Windex

2011-06-03 by -= Chris =-

The issue with an unknown formula, in this case Windex, is that the product also has trace amounts of cellosolve, along with perfume, water and alcohol.  I'm not sure, as the formula may have evolved, but there could even be traces of DEP - but I doubt it.  You will note that the Windex container is PETE. In the old days it was glass, and later a plastic was used, that over time would deform.

The issue is with the long term contact of cellosolve and perfume with the plastic. I would suggest you take a broken piece of reference plastic and place it in a sealed jar.  Store in a warm environment, say 45C for 6-8 weeks, then observe the plastic's condition.  Long term contact soften / dissolve the plastic.

Windex is designed for glass, and is not a leave on product. You can use it on plastic, but a wipe off is expected. Hence you need to perform a test with the substance on which the Windex will be in long term contact.

I think the key with Windex, is the alcohol/water ratio.  Alcohol is the solvent of choice.  Butyl cellosolve is a great cleaner, but you need to flush out the product after use.



----- "David Kachel" <david@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> >>> and..... what kind of damage are we refering to?
> 
> It has been suggested that using Windex to clean out the lines and
> head
> prior to loading aftermarket Pigment B&W inks will damage various
> parts of
> the lines and print head and also irreparably damage the cartridges
> themselves making them not useful for ink. I have also kept my
> non-used
> position cartridges filled with Windex. The obvious conclusion that
> this
> long-term use of Windex should be even more damaging, though this
> suggestion
> was not made.
> 
> 
> David Kachel
> 
> ___________________
> 
> Artist-Photographer
> Fine B&W Photographs
> 
> www.davidkachel.com
> david@...
> 
> Gallery:
> www.reddoorfinephotographs.com
> director@...
> 
> PO Box  1893
> Alpine, TX 79831
> (432) 386-5787
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------
> 
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Re: [Digital BW] Damage from Windex

2011-06-03 by tboleyyh

yes that's the impression I've been given from a few different sources with no common agendas. Therefore I'd never use Windex for any long term exposure to printer parts... though I still sometimes use it only for capping station or wiper quick cleans assuming I can get it right off. I'm sorry to say I would not put it in carts at all... I hope you are not in some difficult situation...

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, David Kachel <david@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> >>> and..... what kind of damage are we refering to?
> 
> Š I forgot;
> 
> More specifically, the ammonia in Windex corrodes and otherwise harms
> printhead parts and cartridge parts.
> 
> 
> David Kachel
> 
> ___________________
> 
> Artist-Photographer
> Fine B&W Photographs
> 
> www.davidkachel.com
> david@...
> 
> Gallery:
> www.reddoorfinephotographs.com
> director@...
> 
> PO Box  1893
> Alpine, TX 79831
> (432) 386-5787
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Re: [Digital BW] Damage from Windex

2011-06-03 by David Kachel

>>> Windex is designed for glass, and is not a leave on product. You can use it
on plastic, but a wipe off is expected. Hence you need to perform a test with
the substance on which the Windex will be in long term contact.

Wouldn't it be easier to ask a group of people who have been using Windex
long term with inkjet printers; as I did?


David Kachel

___________________

Artist-Photographer
Fine B&W Photographs

www.davidkachel.com
david@...

Gallery:
www.reddoorfinephotographs.com
director@...

PO Box  1893
Alpine, TX 79831
(432) 386-5787





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: Damage from Windex

2011-06-03 by Ken Jaskot

I've only heard of, and used, Windex to help clear a printhead clog, by parking overnight the printhead on a paper towel soaked with Windex. It works, and I never noticed any resulting problems.

I did this with color bulk inks delivered via a CIS.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Damage from Windex

2011-06-04 by mrjimbo

I am not in a position to answer this from a personal knowledge standpoint but I do know that certain types of plastics don't get along with Windex.. Most kitchen counter tops will soften over time with regular cleanings using Windex. Once this has occurred the material will not harden back up.. I assume it is the alcohol that is doing it.. This is a known industry issue but to be honest I don't know if the material that is used in printers is anything like that used in countertops. 

jimbo
Show quoted textHide quoted text
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: David Kachel 
  To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Friday, June 03, 2011 4:10 PM
  Subject: Re: [Digital BW] Damage from Windex


    
  >>> and..... what kind of damage are we refering to?

  It has been suggested that using Windex to clean out the lines and head
  prior to loading aftermarket Pigment B&W inks will damage various parts of
  the lines and print head and also irreparably damage the cartridges
  themselves making them not useful for ink. I have also kept my non-used
  position cartridges filled with Windex. The obvious conclusion that this
  long-term use of Windex should be even more damaging, though this suggestion
  was not made.

  David Kachel

  ___________________

  Artist-Photographer
  Fine B&W Photographs

  www.davidkachel.com
  david@...

  Gallery:
  www.reddoorfinephotographs.com
  director@...

  PO Box 1893
  Alpine, TX 79831
  (432) 386-5787

  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



  

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Damage from Windex

2011-06-04 by Leslie Otterbein

Read Arthur Entlich's fine manual:

--  
If you need one of my Epson Cleaning Manuals,
please send an email to: e-printerhelp(at)mvps(dot)org
(at) = @ (dot) = .

Please remove [EPSON_Printers] from the subject line,
and indicate the model(s) of printers you wish to work on.

If you are interested in issues surrounding e-waste,
I invite you to my blog: http://piezofix.wordpress.com/

Arthur also resides on the Epson forum.

Leslie Otterbein



On Jun 3, 2011, at 2:42 PM, David Kachel wrote:

> Has anyone in this group had any experience with using Windex, as  
> suggested
> by so many, resulting in damage to aftermarket cartridges or to the  
> printer?
> Especially but not exclusively with regard to the Epson 3800.
>
> Also, has anyone had any experience with current production B&W  
> carbon ink
> sets damaging 3800 printers or aftermarket cartridges?
>
> David Kachel

Leslie Otterbein

web.me.com/lotterbein
http://gallery.me.com/lotterbein#

Re: [Digital BW] Damage from Windex

2011-06-04 by David Kachel

>>> Read Arthur Entlich's fine manual:

Thank you. I have it. But you are missing the point.
I asked if anyone has any direct personal knowledge of damage from Windex:
actual ruined printer or cartridges.


David Kachel

___________________

Artist-Photographer
Fine B&W Photographs

www.davidkachel.com
david@...

Gallery:
www.reddoorfinephotographs.com
director@...

PO Box  1893
Alpine, TX 79831
(432) 386-5787




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

RE: [Digital BW] Re: Damage from Windex

2011-06-04 by Tom Mallonee

Hopefully I can (or someone else) address David's issue about "clogging"
soon (which is not clogging - it's air, the peristaltic pump, pump tubing, a
damper leak, or the capping assembly). I've dissected, repaired, and
sometimes destroyed Epsons of all stripes and (like some people here) have a
detailed and intimate  knowledge of how the ink delivery system works - and
doesn't. (Did I really say intimate about a printer?). I've used Windex a
lot for years in one-two-three-four. nine of my own Epsons, for both long
and short term and I can guarantee it's not causing a problem with David's
3800 heads. I have used it for at least 18 months as a "dummy" fluid when I
didn't need to fill all the ink slots. There's plenty of copper in the
head's circuits but I doubt there is any copper in the heads' ink path.
Anhydrous ammonia is indeed reactive with copper but my heads would have
been goners a long time ago. I even put straight ammonia through the heads
some time ago with no ill effects. Windex has a high pH of just like
cleaning fluids. Empirically, Windex is safe in Epson heads and I'll stand
by that. Getting the circuits on the back side of the head plate wet with
Windex or any fluid will ruin the head and can likely take the main board
with it. 
 
Also David - I may have mentioned this before - DO NOT buff the head by
moving it back and forth across a soaked cloth, or if you do it, do it
gently and briefly with something like Pec-Pads. The idea obviously is to
dislodge ink or debris from a nozzle and it infrequently does work, but
you're almost as likely to permanently jam some junk into a nozzle. I've
done it, and then had to replace the head.  Some of the veterans here on the
list know that I've blown up every printer part that can be blown, probably
more times by stupidity than I care to admit. Setting the head down onto a
wet cloth or lint free paper for a while is OK. The rubber wiper is the only
thing that should swipe the head and it causes enough problems of its own. 
 
Best,
 
Tom
 
Tom Mallonee
Owens Valley Imaging
www.ovimaging.com
760.873.8501
 
Description: OVI_Logo_For_Email.jpg
Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ken
Jaskot
Sent: Friday, June 03, 2011 4:54 PM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Digital BW] Re: Damage from Windex
 
  
I've only heard of, and used, Windex to help clear a printhead clog, by
parking overnight the printhead on a paper towel soaked with Windex. It
works, and I never noticed any resulting problems.

I did this with color bulk inks delivered via a CIS.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

RE: [Digital BW] Damage from Windex

2011-06-04 by Tom Mallonee

>Also, has anyone had any experience with current production B&W carbon ink
sets damaging 3800 printers or aftermarket cartridges?


David Kachel
 
No. 


Tom Mallonee
Owens Valley Imaging
www.ovimaging.com
760.873.8501
 
Description: OVI_Logo_For_Email.jpg





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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