Digital BW, The Print

I have a print I am making that has a very empty sky with about a 50% gray tone that fades darker to lighter. When I print this I get vertical streaking in the area at the top of the print and continuing down about 2". The streaking is not fine like a clogged nozzle, it is a very light banding that fades in and out gradually with a peak to peak width of about 3/4". It is not highly noticeable, but there if you are looking for it. 

The lower part of the image is busy, so I flipped the image 180% in photoshop and printed it again thinking that if it is a printer issue on the left side of the printer it might disappear. In the flipped image, the streaking is much lighter, but still there. I cannot see this issue anywhere else in the image other than in the top of the sky where the tone is very even. 

I also think this defect fades as the print dries, but copy that is a month old still has some of the streaking, so it does not completely go away. 

Any ideas what causes this?

Do you print with uni- or bi-directional mode? I had once this kind
of issue in uni-directional mode, and it was solved in the
bi-directional mode. 

my2c 

Sylvain. 

Le 2013-03-07 03:33, remononaz1
a écrit : 

> I have a print I am making that has a very empty sky with
about a 50% gray tone that fades darker to lighter. When I print this I
get vertical streaking in the area at the top of the print and
continuing down about 2". The streaking is not fine like a clogged
nozzle, it is a very light banding that fades in and out gradually with
a peak to peak width of about 3/4". It is not highly noticeable, but
there if you are looking for it. 
> 
> The lower part of the image is
busy, so I flipped the image 180% in photoshop and printed it again
thinking that if it is a printer issue on the left side of the printer
it might disappear. In the flipped image, the streaking is much lighter,
but still there. I cannot see this issue anywhere else in the image
other than in the top of the sky where the tone is very even. 
> 
> I
also think this defect fades as the print dries, but copy that is a
month old still has some of the streaking, so it does not completely go
away. 
> 
> Any ideas what causes this?
 

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I also had some issues with streaking recently, however this occurred when printing 2880 dpi bi-directionally and was solved by switching to uni-directional printing.  This does make printing a lot slower.  It was most noticeable on thick matte paper mainly an inch or two in from the left edge.

Ross

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Sylvain M." <sylvain@...> wrote:

>
>  
> 
> Do you print with uni- or bi-directional mode? I had once this kind
> of issue in uni-directional mode, and it was solved in the
> bi-directional mode. 
> 
> my2c 
> 
> Sylvain. 
> 
> Le 2013-03-07 03:33, remononaz1
> a écrit : 
> 
> > I have a print I am making that has a very empty sky with
> about a 50% gray tone that fades darker to lighter. When I print this I
> get vertical streaking in the area at the top of the print and
> continuing down about 2". The streaking is not fine like a clogged
> nozzle, it is a very light banding that fades in and out gradually with
> a peak to peak width of about 3/4". It is not highly noticeable, but
> there if you are looking for it. 
> > 
> > The lower part of the image is
> busy, so I flipped the image 180% in photoshop and printed it again
> thinking that if it is a printer issue on the left side of the printer
> it might disappear. In the flipped image, the streaking is much lighter,
> but still there. I cannot see this issue anywhere else in the image
> other than in the top of the sky where the tone is very even. 
> > 
> > I
> also think this defect fades as the print dries, but copy that is a
> month old still has some of the streaking, so it does not completely go
> away. 
> > 
> > Any ideas what causes this?
>  
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

I also had some issues with streaking recently, however this occurred when printing 2880 dpi bi-directionally and was solved by switching to uni-directional printing.  This does make printing a lot slower.  It was most noticeable on thick matte paper mainly an inch or two in from the left edge.

Ross

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Sylvain M." <sylvain@...> wrote:

>
>  
> 
> Do you print with uni- or bi-directional mode? I had once this kind
> of issue in uni-directional mode, and it was solved in the
> bi-directional mode. 
> 
> my2c 
> 
> Sylvain. 
> 
> Le 2013-03-07 03:33, remononaz1
> a écrit : 
> 
> > I have a print I am making that has a very empty sky with
> about a 50% gray tone that fades darker to lighter. When I print this I
> get vertical streaking in the area at the top of the print and
> continuing down about 2". The streaking is not fine like a clogged
> nozzle, it is a very light banding that fades in and out gradually with
> a peak to peak width of about 3/4". It is not highly noticeable, but
> there if you are looking for it. 
> > 
> > The lower part of the image is
> busy, so I flipped the image 180% in photoshop and printed it again
> thinking that if it is a printer issue on the left side of the printer
> it might disappear. In the flipped image, the streaking is much lighter,
> but still there. I cannot see this issue anywhere else in the image
> other than in the top of the sky where the tone is very even. 
> > 
> > I
> also think this defect fades as the print dries, but copy that is a
> month old still has some of the streaking, so it does not completely go
> away. 
> > 
> > Any ideas what causes this?
>  
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

I also had some issues with streaking recently, however this occurred when printing 2880 dpi bi-directionally and was solved by switching to uni-directional printing.  This does make printing a lot slower.  It was most noticeable on thick matte paper mainly an inch or two in from the left edge.

Ross

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Sylvain M." <sylvain@...> wrote:

>
>  
> 
> Do you print with uni- or bi-directional mode? I had once this kind
> of issue in uni-directional mode, and it was solved in the
> bi-directional mode. 
> 
> my2c 
> 
> Sylvain. 
> 
> Le 2013-03-07 03:33, remononaz1
> a écrit : 
> 
> > I have a print I am making that has a very empty sky with
> about a 50% gray tone that fades darker to lighter. When I print this I
> get vertical streaking in the area at the top of the print and
> continuing down about 2". The streaking is not fine like a clogged
> nozzle, it is a very light banding that fades in and out gradually with
> a peak to peak width of about 3/4". It is not highly noticeable, but
> there if you are looking for it. 
> > 
> > The lower part of the image is
> busy, so I flipped the image 180% in photoshop and printed it again
> thinking that if it is a printer issue on the left side of the printer
> it might disappear. In the flipped image, the streaking is much lighter,
> but still there. I cannot see this issue anywhere else in the image
> other than in the top of the sky where the tone is very even. 
> > 
> > I
> also think this defect fades as the print dries, but copy that is a
> month old still has some of the streaking, so it does not completely go
> away. 
> > 
> > Any ideas what causes this?
>  
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Sylvian:

I am using the uni-directional setting, so it is not that. Perhaps I should try bi-directional. I guess I could also try printing sheets of 50% gray just to see what I get. 

I could also try different papers and curve settings. This particular image is being printed with UT14 ink on RR Ultrapro Satin using a curve to control the Ebony black and GLOP. Other than this strange banding, the print looks really good. 

What is also odd, and perhaps significant, is that the sky fades (I applied a graduation to it) from about 50% gray at the top (of the sky, left side of the print on 11" x 17" paper) to ~15% at the horizon. The banding is all in the ~50% to 30% range, then it disappears in the lighter tones.

So, it's the image or it's the printer (including all parts of the print
pipeline).

Have you tried another image? From the mention of 50% gray sheets below,
I'd guess not.

As they have both interesting gradient areas and real-world insets, I like
to use images from Keith Cooper's "Northlight Images" website for testing;


http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/article_pages/black_and_white_test.html--
this is a good overall test
    http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/downloadable_1/DL_page.html
       -- the grouping of 4 circles with graduated interior fill is a
terrific test image
    http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/article_pages/test_images.html
        -- and here are some others that may be useful.

I must admit I don't know if you're using the Epson driver or QTR, but if
the latter are you sure you've got your calibration correct? I started
using MIS Eboni ink, mixed to my own choice of dilutions, in one of my
printers and while many images turned out very well using a stock printer
curve, I had problems in the highlights of some images. After setting out
to calibrate the new system, it only took about 5 prints of the QTR
calibration mode image for me to get the new curve defined and it's
beautifully smooth over the entire range of image values.

Best,
Pete

On Thu, Mar 7, 2013 at 7:54 AM, remononaz1 <homershannon@gmail.com> wrote:

> Sylvian:
>
> I am using the uni-directional setting, so it is not that. Perhaps I
> should try bi-directional. I guess I could also try printing sheets of 50%
> gray just to see what I get.
>
> I could also try different papers and curve settings. This particular
> image is being printed with UT14 ink on RR Ultrapro Satin using a curve to
> control the Ebony black and GLOP. Other than this strange banding, the
> print looks really good.
>
> What is also odd, and perhaps significant, is that the sky fades (I
> applied a graduation to it) from about 50% gray at the top (of the sky,
> left side of the print on 11" x 17" paper) to ~15% at the horizon. The
> banding is all in the ~50% to 30% range, then it disappears in the lighter
> tones.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as
> they are often being updated.
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
> unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same
> page.
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
> them short.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames.
> Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
> membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W
> printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from
> the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and
> guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner
> and Moderators. See �Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines� in the Files
> section:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
>
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
> YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE �OWNER� AND
> �MODERATORS� OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO
> YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR
> EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF
> PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE
>  �OWNER� AND �MODERATORS� OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN
> ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR
> THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii)
> UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii)
> STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO
> GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO
> GROUP.
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Pete:

Thanks for responding. We haven't shared a post in quite a while. 

I'm not using QTR, just the Epson drivers gamma 2.2 for this particular ink and paper. The printer seems fine for most prints and I've been printing 5.5x8.5 Northlight test images 100% successfully. It's just in this one image with its very empty sky that the problem appears. 

Close inspection of the print shows no banding like with a clogged nozzle and using the eye dropper I checked the image to confirm that shading was not somehow embedded into the image itself. It is not. So, I'm pretty sure it is a printer problem, but a subtle one.

I've had this printer two years now. Perhaps its time to get some of Cone's special cleaning fluid and give the thing a thorough cleaning.

This Saturday morning I took a closer look at this problem. A scan of the printed image and a crop of the Photoshop image, along with a full image so you can get a sense of scale, are posted at http://sdrv.ms/Y1V9Lg. 

In the scan you cannot actually see the issue I see in the print. In the print you really have to look at the image from the side to see the vertical 'streaking', which can better be described as a waviness. 

However, looking at the print through a loop (a real one, not Lr) you can see what looks like very fine scratches in the areas where the waviness is. You can see this in the file 'Longfellow scan' best when viewed in PS at 25% resolution. The original image does have some noise that you can see in the crop and it is in the print. Zooming in on the scan to 50% you can see more visible vertical lines, which are not the waviness, but I think they are related. 

In the scanned image, I see these lines and they may be defects, but I also see that the dot pattern is consistent and is not displaying any obvious clogging. I looked at my Northlight test image for this paper and ink and do not see the line condition in any of the areas that have a similar tone. 

I guess my question is, is this just the way images look when printed in grayscale with a printer of the caliber of a 1400 or is there a problem with the printer? Or am I just chasing windmill?