Digital BW, The Print

In a message dated 9/13/02 11:56:57 AM, jimhayes@... writes:


> Like doing a field of sunflowers in B&W with just one petal yellow...
> 
> Or maybe just adding a heavy bluish, reddish, etc tone like the 
> darkroom Berg toners to the overall print.
> 
> Or both? Can the $500 colorbyte package accomodate this? Either?
> 

The question is not whether the RIP can do this, its what inkset you would 
need to accomplish it. The ColorByte RIP is designed to be used with 
grayscale inks for grayscale work, or with color inks for color work. If you 
wish to do both (as your examples describe), then you will not get any of the 
special advantages of the grayscale system, and will be dependent on the 
color profiles to produce your grays with the color inks. 

C. David Tobie
Design Cooperative
CDTobie@...


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--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., CDTobie@a... wrote:
> 
> In a message dated 9/13/02 11:56:57 AM, jimhayes@j... writes:
> 
> 
> > Like doing a field of sunflowers in B&W with just one petal 
yellow...
> > 
> > Or maybe just adding a heavy bluish, reddish, etc tone like the 
> > darkroom Berg toners to the overall print.
> > 
> > Or both? Can the $500 colorbyte package accomodate this? Either?
> > 
> 
> The question is not whether the RIP can do this, its what inkset you 
would 
> need to accomplish it. The ColorByte RIP is designed to be used with 
> grayscale inks for grayscale work, or with color inks for color 
work. If you 
> wish to do both (as your examples describe), then you will not get 
any of the 
> special advantages of the grayscale system, and will be dependent on 
the 
> color profiles to produce your grays with the color inks. 
> 
> C. David Tobie
> Design Cooperative
> CDTobie@d...
> 

Okay, thanks. But maybe I missed something posted previously about the 
2200...the Colorbyte RIP is designed to be used with greyscale inks? 
What greyscale inks? I thought Epson only had the seven chambered 
Ultrachrome color set with a choice of either matte or "photo" for the 
k position as an option. Has someone made a 3rd party greyscale ink 
while I wasn't looking and cracked the chip?

And assuming the Ultrachromes ARE used, can the RIP do the spot color 
yet still deliver the neutrality of the rest of the print? 
Jim H.
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

In a message dated 9/13/02 3:44:56 PM, jimhayes@... writes:


> Okay, thanks. But maybe I missed something posted previously about the 
> 2200...the Colorbyte RIP is designed to be used with greyscale inks? 
> What greyscale inks? I thought Epson only had the seven chambered 
> Ultrachrome color set with a choice of either matte or "photo" for the 
> k position as an option. Has someone made a 3rd party greyscale ink 
> while I wasn't looking and cracked the chip?
> 
> 

Specificly with the 2200 and 76/9600, there are not yet any alternative inks 
available, and the color inks are the only alternative for color or for 
grayscale. 

C. David Tobie
Design Cooperative
CDTobie@...


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CDTobie@... wrote:

>In a message dated 9/13/02 11:56:57 AM, jimhayes@... writes:
>
>
>  
>
>>Like doing a field of sunflowers in B&W with just one petal yellow...
>>
>>Or maybe just adding a heavy bluish, reddish, etc tone like the 
>>darkroom Berg toners to the overall print.
>>
>>Or both? Can the $500 colorbyte package accomodate this? Either?
>>
>>    
>>
>
>The question is not whether the RIP can do this, its what inkset you would 
>need to accomplish it. The ColorByte RIP is designed to be used with 
>grayscale inks for grayscale work, or with color inks for color work. If you 
>wish to do both (as your examples describe), then you will not get any of the 
>special advantages of the grayscale system, and will be dependent on the 
>color profiles to produce your grays with the color inks. 
>
>  
>
That's another thing missing in the EPSON driver...

Where's that "digitaldog" dude?  ;-)

Andrew, tell EPSON it would really make sense to add a spot color 
overlay option for registered spot color printing...  My 10 year old 
ALPS can do it without a problem... No valid reason except crappy driver 
design that these EPSON's shouldn't be able to do it by now..

Keith
 
 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Your choices with the 2200 / ImagePrint combo are to print colour 
with Ultrachrome color inks, or to print B&W, also using the 
Ultrachrome inks.  In the latter case, there is a seperate inks 
setting ("gray matte pigment") that you select, along with a special 
profle (one with "gray" in the name) that activates the tint picker.

You could print a gray image without the tint picker - just a regular 
desaturated RGB image - but you may not then get the same B&W quality 
you'd get from the dedicated profiles designed for the best B&W 
printing.  But you could then at least colorise part of your image.

Or the third alternative would be to use ImagePrint to print to a 
dedicated B&W printer with quad inks (MIS, Piezo).  There is support 
for this in the program.

Cripes, I'm starting to sound like Andrew Rodney :-)
--
Quentin

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "jim hayes" <jimhayes@j...> 
> > 
> 
> Okay, thanks. But maybe I missed something posted previously about 
the 
> 2200...the Colorbyte RIP is designed to be used with greyscale 
inks? 
> What greyscale inks? I thought Epson only had the seven chambered 
> Ultrachrome color set with a choice of either matte or "photo" for 
the 
> k position as an option. Has someone made a 3rd party greyscale ink 
> while I wasn't looking and cracked the chip?
> 
> And assuming the Ultrachromes ARE used, can the RIP do the spot 
color 

> yet still deliver the neutrality of the rest of the print? 
> Jim H.
> > 
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "qdfb" <qdb@b...> wrote:
> Your choices with the 2200 / ImagePrint combo are to print colour 
> with Ultrachrome color inks, or to print B&W, also using the 
> Ultrachrome inks.  In the latter case, there is a seperate inks 
> setting ("gray matte pigment") that you select, along with a special 
> profle (one with "gray" in the name) that activates the tint picker.
> 
> You could print a gray image without the tint picker - just a 
regular 
> desaturated RGB image - but you may not then get the same B&W 
quality 
> you'd get from the dedicated profiles designed for the best B&W 
> printing.  But you could then at least colorise part of your image.
> 
> Or the third alternative would be to use ImagePrint to print to a 
> dedicated B&W printer with quad inks (MIS, Piezo).  There is support 
> for this in the program.
> 
> Cripes, I'm starting to sound like Andrew Rodney :-)
> --
> Quentin
> 

<g>.
Thanks all. Too bad- the 2200 seems like a neat printer to start to 
have an option for spot color, though I don't know what software 
hurdles would be involved. Seems like the hardware is there.
Jim H.

In a message dated 9/13/02 4:33:35 PM, qdb@... writes:


> 
> You could print a gray image without the tint picker - just a regular 
> desaturated RGB image - but you may not then get the same B&W quality 
> you'd get from the dedicated profiles designed for the best B&W 
> printing.  But you could then at least colorise part of your image.
> 

This brings up an intriguing idea; convert the image to grayscale right in 
Photoshop via Convert ot Profile using the special gray profile, so the grays 
are balanced as desired for that particular ink, paper, and settings, rather 
then being workingspace grays where R=G=B, then add your spot color(s) to the 
image, and print without further color management. There are a couple 
possible issues with this technique, but it would be interesting to try.

C. David Tobie
Design Cooperative
CDTobie@...


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