Digital BW, The Print

Alex,

Why don't you send me a copy of the 100-step grayscale and I will put it in
the Files section.

Thanks,
Martin Wesley

http://www.borderless-photos.de/guests.html



----- Original Message -----
From: "B. Alex Pettit Jr." <a_pettit_jr@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 12:03 PM
Subject: [Digital BW] Re: posterisation - how to defeat


> Frank,
>
> I have a 100 step greyscale I can email to you. I recommend you analyze
the overall grey you are printing in a resolution finer than the 21 step
chart. I am having a quite challenging time working on a set of curves for a
2000P using the MIS FSe inkset. Flat spots in the curve are much more
visible in a real print than in that 21 step analysis. The graduated scales
in the PiezoTest print are also valuable to ensure there smooth transitions.
I think 8 bit i.e. 256 levels of grey ( 0.4 % steps ) are not your problem.
>
> Alex
> Orlando Fl
>
>
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "frankg_photo" <frank@f...>
wrote:
> > Even with using 16 bit scans and doing the major curve/level adj
> > before switching to 8 bit, I still have a problem with posterisation
> > in areas of my prints.
> >
> > I have tried the same neg/scan on several paper samples I had (Royal
> > Renaissance (Photo Rag), Eclipse Satine Soft & the Bright, EAM) &
> > it's pretty much the same on all.
> >
> > I am using MIS sepia>neutral inkset in an 1160 with Paul's curves.
> >
> > In the past some have reported duplicating the background layer
> > and/or combining 2 curve adjustment layers and/or adjusing the
> > opacities - this is a muddle for me.
> >
> > can anyone clarify this workflow or suggest another way I can try and
> > beat the posterization blues
> >
> > thanks
> > Frankg
>
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and
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----- Original Message -----
From: "frankg_photo" <frank@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 12:56 PM
Subject: [Digital BW] Re: posterisation - how to defeat


> Here i am replying to my own post :-)
>
> After trying all day, I found tips posted by Bob ? to my first pleas
> in August, which suddenly seemed decipherable and produced an
> immediate improvement.
>
> 1.make 2x duplcate layers of the background
> 2.place one of Paul's curves above the first duplicate & set the Fill
> Opacity to around 70% & keep layer type Normal
> 3. on the 2nd duplicate layer, change the type to Overlay & the
> opacity to around 80%
>
> Dont ask me why or how - but this has made an immediate improvement
> to my prints.
> Can anyone delve deeper and/or finesse this procedure ?

Frank,

I can suggest another technique. Use two curve adjustment layers on top of
the image, each with different RGB separation curves and adjust the opacity
of the top layer. I have used this to get intermediate hues with the curves
and it can also sometimes help with flat spots.

A more desperate measure is to identify and select the tonal range that is
the problem and increase the contrast slightly.

The other think to look at are your scans. Did you make fairly straight
forward scans or did you do major adjustments in the scanning software? I
sometimes find that if I take an image too far at the scanning stage it is
difficult to shift it back.


Martin Wesley

http://www.borderless-photos.de/guests.html




> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "frankg_photo" <frank@f...>
> wrote:
> > Even with using 16 bit scans and doing the major curve/level adj
> > before switching to 8 bit, I still have a problem with
> posterisation
> > in areas of my prints.
> >
> > I have tried the same neg/scan on several paper samples I had
> (Royal
> > Renaissance (Photo Rag), Eclipse Satine Soft & the Bright, EAM) &
> > it's pretty much the same on all.
> >
> > I am using MIS sepia>neutral inkset in an 1160 with Paul's curves.
> >
> > In the past some have reported duplicating the background layer
> > and/or combining 2 curve adjustment layers and/or adjusing the
> > opacities - this is a muddle for me.
> >
> > can anyone clarify this workflow or suggest another way I can try
> and
> > beat the posterization blues
> >
> > thanks
> > Frankg
>
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and
other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same
page.
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - Include your full name with your message.
> - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
them short.
> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject header.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or
&amp;amp;quot;flames.&amp;amp;quot;
> - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the various
resources on the homepage.

>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

Steve,

The fill% adjustments that I make are to the Duplicate Background Layer 
(which I set in an overlay mode) and to the adjustment curve layer (into 
which one of Paul's curves is loaded).  No fill adjustment is made to the 
Background Layer itself.  Just look on the monitor and see how the image's 
appearance changes as you change these fill%'s.

Bob

Ok, so I understand the concept of varying the opacity of the 
duplicate layers but surely if you are applying more than one curves 
LAYER they compound across each of the duplicates, curve and 
background layers - OR do you just apply the curves to the duplicate 
rather than actually using a layer?.
I might be mixed up on my blending modes (I'll have a play tonight) 
but I can't get my head around applying a warm curve then compounding 
that with another different curve further up - wouldn't you end up 
with all kind of hue and saturation nasties?

I suppose in theory you could also use more complicated layer masks 
to create a split toning effect with the VM set for example?  I'd be 
interested to get this sussed.

Kind regards

Steve




--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., workmantx@a... wrote:
> Steve,
> 
> The fill% adjustments that I make are to the Duplicate Background 
Layer 
> (which I set in an overlay mode) and to the adjustment curve layer 
(into 
> which one of Paul's curves is loaded).  No fill adjustment is made 
to the 
> Background Layer itself.  Just look on the monitor and see how the 
image's 

> appearance changes as you change these fill%'s.
> 
> Bob