Digital BW, The Print

----- Original Message -----

From: "sceptre12345" <am1000@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 05, 2003 2:09 AM
Subject: [Digital BW] Mounting Oil was Re: Epson3200 - Test
results/Kami


> > For large negs consider using a cover sheet so that you have
a
> sandwich of
> > glass/oil/neg/oil/cover film. The cover film is taped to the
glass
> and you
> > can then use film wipes on the cover film to work air bubbles
out
> to the
> > edge of the negative.
> >
> > Martin Wesley
>
> Would some cover material like a clear acetate be sufficent as
a
> cover film ? How is the negative cleaned after scanning ? Any
danger
> to the emulsion of the negative ?
> TIA
> Andre

Use transparant polyester for that. That is the same plastic the
film is made of. The prepress supply dealers have that too in
sheets or on rolls.

One warning if you use fluids on a flatbed: the surrounding
plastic housing is often made of ABS, it will degrade when it
gets in contact with the fluid. Few plastics withstand the
agression of aromatic fluids: polyester, polypropylene,
polyethylene, nylon, polyurethane, silicone and several more
exotic grades will not be affected or less affected. You have to
work very careful and not spill any fluid on the housing or put a
polyurethane (or silicone that can be removed ?) varnish on the
plastic directly surrounding the glassplate. Maybe a piece of
cling foil with a window cut out will protect it as well (if it
isn't a PVC product).

Professional wetmounting is a process. Antistatic air, adhesive
rolls to take dirt of film and glass, extra cover sheet, mounting
fluid, pressure roll.
There are ways to simplify that.

The housing of most flatbeds isn't strong enough to squeeze the
fluid from the sandwich with a roll, better use a polyethylene
squeegee and another sheet of polyester on top to avoid
scratching of the first polyester sheet. A tod at the end to
absorb excessive fluid. Find a good methode that doesn't need
tape to keep the polyester sheet in position. Tape always gives a
mess in the long run. For that reason I've made some small clamps
on my special Nikon 8000 wetmounting carrier.

If you have a register punch and a register strip you can put the
strip with two sided tape on the housing outside the glass or on
a non scanning part of the glass. For the 3200: there is a small
strip along the left side that isn't scanned. Punch the foil and
put it on the scanner. If you use the same spots the glassless
carrier uses then it is easy, put the carrier on top of that and
mark the window on the polyester foil. Take it off and you know
where the film has to be placed between polyester and glass.
After mounting you can put the carrier on top for scanning. If
you need other film windows then the punch and black paper masks
will make the process as easy. That is how I used to wet mount
film on the Agfa Horizon Plus. If you are handy enough then a
good! adjustable! office punch and a selfmade strip will do.
Don't use more than two holes on sheet sizes like this.

Ernst

One thing I'm now doing on my 1680 is to put the neg in-between a black card
mount, place on the platen with AN glass over the top 0 a big improvement
over the carrier and the card cuts down shadow 'noise'.

Julian
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ernst Dinkla" <E.Dinkla@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 05, 2003 9:55 AM
Subject: Re: [Digital BW] Mounting Oil was Re: Epson3200 - Test results/Kami


>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "sceptre12345" <am1000@...>
> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, March 05, 2003 2:09 AM
> Subject: [Digital BW] Mounting Oil was Re: Epson3200 - Test
> results/Kami
>
>
> > > For large negs consider using a cover sheet so that you have
> a
> > sandwich of
> > > glass/oil/neg/oil/cover film. The cover film is taped to the
> glass
> > and you
> > > can then use film wipes on the cover film to work air bubbles
> out
> > to the
> > > edge of the negative.
> > >
> > > Martin Wesley
> >
> > Would some cover material like a clear acetate be sufficent as
> a
> > cover film ? How is the negative cleaned after scanning ? Any
> danger
> > to the emulsion of the negative ?
> > TIA
> > Andre
>
> Use transparant polyester for that. That is the same plastic the
> film is made of. The prepress supply dealers have that too in
> sheets or on rolls.
>
> One warning if you use fluids on a flatbed: the surrounding
> plastic housing is often made of ABS, it will degrade when it
> gets in contact with the fluid. Few plastics withstand the
> agression of aromatic fluids: polyester, polypropylene,
> polyethylene, nylon, polyurethane, silicone and several more
> exotic grades will not be affected or less affected. You have to
> work very careful and not spill any fluid on the housing or put a
> polyurethane (or silicone that can be removed ?) varnish on the
> plastic directly surrounding the glassplate. Maybe a piece of
> cling foil with a window cut out will protect it as well (if it
> isn't a PVC product).
>
> Professional wetmounting is a process. Antistatic air, adhesive
> rolls to take dirt of film and glass, extra cover sheet, mounting
> fluid, pressure roll.
> There are ways to simplify that.
>
> The housing of most flatbeds isn't strong enough to squeeze the
> fluid from the sandwich with a roll, better use a polyethylene
> squeegee and another sheet of polyester on top to avoid
> scratching of the first polyester sheet. A tod at the end to
> absorb excessive fluid. Find a good methode that doesn't need
> tape to keep the polyester sheet in position. Tape always gives a
> mess in the long run. For that reason I've made some small clamps
> on my special Nikon 8000 wetmounting carrier.
>
> If you have a register punch and a register strip you can put the
> strip with two sided tape on the housing outside the glass or on
> a non scanning part of the glass. For the 3200: there is a small
> strip along the left side that isn't scanned. Punch the foil and
> put it on the scanner. If you use the same spots the glassless
> carrier uses then it is easy, put the carrier on top of that and
> mark the window on the polyester foil. Take it off and you know
> where the film has to be placed between polyester and glass.
> After mounting you can put the carrier on top for scanning. If
> you need other film windows then the punch and black paper masks
> will make the process as easy. That is how I used to wet mount
> film on the Agfa Horizon Plus. If you are handy enough then a
> good! adjustable! office punch and a selfmade strip will do.
> Don't use more than two holes on sheet sizes like this.
>
> Ernst
>
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and
other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
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>

In a message dated 3/5/2003 5:38:53 AM Central Standard Time, 
julianthomas@... writes:

> put the neg in-between a black card
> mount, place on the platen with AN glass over the top 

Julian,
Could you explain this in a little more detail.  I'm not sure I understand 
what you mean.
Thanks, Billie


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

The 1680Pro  is an A4 flatbed. Rather than oil mount - I use  a black card
presentation slide mount. Slide the neg into the card mount. Out on the
flatbed platen and then put antinewton glass over the top. In some scans
with high black areas without the card and putting straight on the glass I
was getting some noise. The card reduces this.

Julian

Julian
----- Original Message -----
From: <BMercerTX@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 05, 2003 2:36 PM
Subject: Re: [Digital BW] Mounting Oil was Re: Epson3200 - Test results/Kami


> In a message dated 3/5/2003 5:38:53 AM Central Standard Time,
> julianthomas@... writes:
>
> > put the neg in-between a black card
> > mount, place on the platen with AN glass over the top
>
> Julian,
> Could you explain this in a little more detail.  I'm not sure I understand
> what you mean.
> Thanks, Billie
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and
other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same
page.
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - Include your full name with your message.
> - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
them short.
> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject header.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or
&amp;amp;quot;flames.&amp;amp;quot;
> - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the various
resources on the homepage.

>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>

----- Original Message -----

From: "sceptre12345" <am1000@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2003 5:09 PM
Subject: [Digital BW] Mounting Oil was Re: Epson3200 - Test results/Kami


> > For large negs consider using a cover sheet so that you have a
> sandwich of
> > glass/oil/neg/oil/cover film. The cover film is taped to the glass
> and you
> > can then use film wipes on the cover film to work air bubbles out
> to the
> > edge of the negative.
> >
> > Martin Wesley
>
> Would some cover material like a clear acetate be sufficent as a
> cover film ? How is the negative cleaned after scanning ? Any danger
> to the emulsion of the negative ?
> TIA

Andre,

Companies that sell mounting fluids and oils such as Kami and Prazio also
sell cover sheet material which I believe is a polyester film. I clean my
negs with a spray film cleaner from Prazio and/or PEC. With the "vanishing"
type oils like Kami and Prazio Anti-Newton this is pretty easy as there is
minimal residue. With heavy oils it takes longer and more film cleaner.
Typically drum scanner drums are filled with multiple negs so they can run
overnight and may be in contact with the mounting oil for many hours without
ill effects.

If you do use a cover sheet you really need to use appropriate mounting tape
that is compatible with the oils and easy to remove. Once again this can be
purchased from the companies that sell the oil and cover sheets. You can use
the same tape to tape the edges where the glass bed meets the scanner frame
to help keep oil from running into the scanner interior.

Martin Wesley

Thanks for your reply Martin. I've learn a lot with this tread. 
With an Epson 3200 arriving in a few days, I'll certainly put into 
practice what has been discussed. 

Now I need to find a retailer for scanning supplies in Canada. I've 
already emailed Access Imaging in Toronto but got no reply. 
Cheers,
Andre

-----------------------------------------------

> Andre,
> Companies that sell mounting fluids and oils such as Kami and 
> Prazio also sell cover sheet material which I believe is a 
> polyester > film.  I clean my negs with a spray film cleaner from 
> Prazio and/or > PEC.  With the "vanishing" type oils like Kami and 
> Prazio Anti-Newton this > is pretty easy as there is minimal
> residue. With heavy oils it 
> takes  longer and more film cleaner.
> Typically drum scanner drums are filled with multiple negs so they 
> can run overnight and may be in contact with the mounting oil for 
> many hours without ill effects.
>
> If you do use a cover sheet you really need to use appropriate 
> mounting tape that is compatible with the oils and easy to remove.
> Once again this can be purchased from the companies that sell the 
> oil and cover sheets. You can use the same tape to tape the edges
> where the glass bed meets the scanner frame to help keep oil from 
> running into the scanner interior.
> 
> Martin Wesley

Prazio is in Canada  (www.prazio.com)


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "sceptre12345" <
am1000@v...> wrote:

> Thanks for your reply Martin. I've learn a lot with this tread. 
> With an Epson 3200 arriving in a few days, I'll certainly put into 
> practice what has been discussed. 
> 
> Now I need to find a retailer for scanning supplies in Canada. I've 
> already emailed Access Imaging in Toronto but got no reply. 
> Cheers,
> Andre
> 
> -----------------------------------------------
> > Andre,
> > Companies that sell mounting fluids and oils such as Kami and 
> > Prazio also sell cover sheet material which I believe is a 
> > polyester > film.  I clean my negs with a spray film cleaner from 
> > Prazio and/or > PEC.  With the "vanishing" type oils like Kami and 
> > Prazio Anti-Newton this > is pretty easy as there is minimal
> > residue. With heavy oils it 
> > takes  longer and more film cleaner.
> > Typically drum scanner drums are filled with multiple negs so they 
> > can run overnight and may be in contact with the mounting oil for 
> > many hours without ill effects.
> >
> > If you do use a cover sheet you really need to use appropriate 
> > mounting tape that is compatible with the oils and easy to remove.
> > Once again this can be purchased from the companies that sell the 
> > oil and cover sheets. You can use the same tape to tape the edges
> > where the glass bed meets the scanner frame to help keep oil from 
> > running into the scanner interior.
> > 
> > Martin Wesley

Thanks mh, have just emailed them.
Cheers,
Andre

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "mh" <mh@t...> 
wrote:

> 
> Prazio is in Canada  (www.prazio.com)
> 
>