RE: [Digital BW] Digest Number 1432
2003-04-05 by Paul Nash
Hi Has anybody actually seen one of the new Canon i9100s yet. PV
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-----Original Message-----
From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Friday, April 04, 2003 1:20 PM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Digital BW] Digest Number 1432
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------------------------------------------------------------------------
There are 18 messages in this issue.
Topics in this digest:
1. Re: Peter Gasser online
From: "sceptre12345" <am1000@...>
2. Re: Re: Peter Gasser online
From: "Len Salem" <lensalem@...>
3. Re: Peter Gasser online
From: Jerry Olson <jerryolson@...>
4. Re: UltraTone Mix is wrong!
From: Jerry Olson <jerryolson@...>
5. RE: UltraTone Mix is wrong!
From: "Paul Roark" <paul.roark@...>
6. For Sale: 2 Epson 2200 printers
From: "Christopher Williams" <leicachris@...>
7. Re: For Sale: 2 Epson 2200 printers
From: "Gregory Schern" <gschern@...>
8. Re: UltraTone Mix is wrong!
From: "Jeff Korte" <jeffkorte@...>
9. Re: UltraTone Mix is wrong!
From: "scrber" <stephen.bate@...>
10. Re: UltraTone Mix is wrong!
From: "scrber" <stephen.bate@...>
11. What is linearization?
From: "danielstaver" <daniel@...>
12. 2200
From: "Stephen Kobrin" <skobrin@...>
13. Re: 2200
From: Richard Sintchak <richcontaxg@...>
14. Re: OPM - 2200 - black only tests - initial report
From: grdglass@...
15. Re: What is linearization?
From: "Antonis Ricos" <antonisphoto@...>
16. Re: Re: Brightcube semi-matte similars
From: Robert Morrison <rmorrison@...>
17. Re: Densitometer or Spectrophotometer?
From: Robert Morrison <rmorrison@...>
18. Re: OPM - 2200 - black only tests - initial report
From: "Antonis Ricos" <antonisphoto@...>
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 03 Apr 2003 23:36:57 -0000
From: "sceptre12345" <am1000@...>
Subject: Re: Peter Gasser online
Peter Gasser has found what I would call "the" name for carbon
pigmented inks. He calls them "Fine arts inks". In that same vein, I
guess Alain Briot would call them "Beaux arts inks"!. Very
interesting.
Name variation: "Carbon fine arts inks" or how about...well you name
it.
Now I'm going to have a longer visit at Mr. Gasser's site.
Cheers,
Andre
--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, " Ruhrfoto/Bernd
L." <ruhrfoto@y...> wrote:
> Hi, gang,
> is it allowed to talk about images - or are we restricted to talk
> about imaging?
> If not, I would like to recommend a new site on the net.
> An old friend of mine, Peter Gasser, photographer from
> Switzerland, eventually managed to go online.
> Here is his address:
> http://fineartphotography-online.com/
> Give it a look, you won\ufffdt be disappointed, he is one of the very
> best - not only in good OLD Europe - but worldwide.
> Bernd
> PS: I swear, he doesn\ufffdt know what I did.
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 2
Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 00:58:34 +0100
From: "Len Salem" <lensalem@...>
Subject: Re: Re: Peter Gasser online
----- Original Message -----
From: "sceptre12345" <am1000@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, April 04, 2003 12:36 AM
Subject: [Digital BW] Re: Peter Gasser online
Peter Gasser has found what I would call "the" name for carbon
pigmented inks. He calls them "Fine arts inks". In that same vein, I
guess Alain Briot would call them "Beaux arts inks"!. Very
interesting.
Name variation: "Carbon fine arts inks" or how about...well you name
it.
Now I'm going to have a longer visit at Mr. Gasser's site.
Cheers,
Andre
--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, " Ruhrfoto/Bernd
L." <ruhrfoto@y...> wrote:
> Hi, gang,
> is it allowed to talk about images - or are we restricted to talk
> about imaging?
> If not, I would like to recommend a new site on the net.
> An old friend of mine, Peter Gasser, photographer from
> Switzerland, eventually managed to go online.
> Here is his address:
> http://fineartphotography-online.com/
> Give it a look, you won\ufffdt be disappointed, he is one of the very
> best - not only in good OLD Europe - but worldwide.
> Bernd
> PS: I swear, he doesn\ufffdt know what I did.
Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and
other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
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If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
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- Include your full name with your message.
- Include the address of your website, if you have one.
- As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
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- As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject header.
- Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or
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- Complete your Yahoo profile.
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Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 3
Date: Thu, 03 Apr 2003 18:19:42 -0600
From: Jerry Olson <jerryolson@...>
Subject: Re: Peter Gasser online
Bernd,
Your friend is another Ansel! Great photos!!! But I think he should
have a way to enlarge the images,
they're awfully small.
Jerry
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 4
Date: Thu, 03 Apr 2003 18:23:21 -0600
From: Jerry Olson <jerryolson@...>
Subject: Re: UltraTone Mix is wrong!
Paul, was the Eboni ink affected?
Jerry
Paul Roark wrote:
> Yes, we now understand why the Ultra Tone inks and vm curves were not
> working for some people. Not all batches were affected, but a number of 4
> oz. bottles were shipped that had not only the wrong percentages, but also
> the wrong inks (thus the rub-off problem some mentioned).
>
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 5
Date: Thu, 3 Apr 2003 17:16:14 -0800
From: "Paul Roark" <paul.roark@...>
Subject: RE: UltraTone Mix is wrong!
Jerry,
The Eboni ink was not affected by the mixing errors. I have yet to have any
clogs with Eboni. I don't follow the Piezo list, but I did a quick search
there about a week ago and didn't notice any significant Museum black
clogging issues either. I think they are about the same ink. I strongly
suspect the problems you were having were CIS cartridge-related, not
ink-related.
Paul
http://www.PaulRoark.com
_________________________________________
-----Original Message-----
From: Jerry Olson [mailto:jerryolson@...]
Sent: Thursday, April 03, 2003 4:23 PM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Digital BW] UltraTone Mix is wrong!
Paul, was the Eboni ink affected?
Jerry
Paul Roark wrote:
> Yes, we now understand why the Ultra Tone inks and vm curves were not
> working for some people. Not all batches were affected, but a number of 4
> oz. bottles were shipped that had not only the wrong percentages, but also
> the wrong inks (thus the rub-off problem some mentioned).
>
Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and
other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same
page.
Please follow these basic guidelines:
- Include your full name with your message.
- Include the address of your website, if you have one.
- As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
them short.
- As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject header.
- Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or
&amp;quot;flames.&amp;quot;
- Complete your Yahoo profile.
- Before posting a question, search the message archives and the various
resources on the homepage.
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 6
Date: Thu, 3 Apr 2003 23:01:50 -0600
From: "Christopher Williams" <leicachris@...>
Subject: For Sale: 2 Epson 2200 printers
I have 2 New In Box Epson 2200's looking for good homes. House trained and
all. Comes with a USB cable that Epson does not include with it.
$699+$50 shipping UPS ground(heavy big box- I ain't lying)
Checks or Paypal accepted.
Chris Williams
New Orleans
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 7
Date: Fri, 04 Apr 2003 05:18:20 -0000
From: "Gregory Schern" <gschern@...>
Subject: Re: For Sale: 2 Epson 2200 printers
FYI, these printers are in stock at most online retailers. Here are
some of the better deals:
inkjetgoodies.com $694 + FREE shipping
inkjetart.com $699 + FREE shipping
--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Christopher
Williams" <leicachris@w...> wrote:
> I have 2 New In Box Epson 2200's looking for good homes. House
trained and
> all. Comes with a USB cable that Epson does not include with it.
>
> $699+$50 shipping UPS ground(heavy big box- I ain't lying)
>
> Checks or Paypal accepted.
>
> Chris Williams
> New Orleans
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 8
Date: Fri, 04 Apr 2003 13:41:10 -0000
From: "Jeff Korte" <jeffkorte@...>
Subject: Re: UltraTone Mix is wrong!
I will be making the switch from VMs to the Ultratones soon. It
appears that these new inks may be more difficult to use with a
CIS (nomorecarts in my case).
Is anyone using these new inks successfully with a CIS?
Thanks,
Jeff
--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul
Roark" <paul.roark@v...> wrote:
> Jerry,
>
> The Eboni ink was not affected by the mixing errors. I have yet
to have any
> clogs with Eboni. I don't follow the Piezo list, but I did a quick
search
> there about a week ago and didn't notice any significant
Museum black
> clogging issues either. I think they are about the same ink. I
strongly
> suspect the problems you were having were CIS
cartridge-related, not
> ink-related.
>
> Paul
> http://www.PaulRoark.com
> _________________________________________
>
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 9
Date: Fri, 04 Apr 2003 13:48:03 -0000
From: "scrber" <stephen.bate@...>
Subject: Re: UltraTone Mix is wrong!
Hi Jeff, I have unfortunately been unable to correct the clogging
issues I have had with Eboni black. I am using the GP colour inks
and (was) the Ultratone VMs, in seperate 1290s, both CFSs, both
clogging, pooling and banding despite efforts to the contrary. I
gave up and switched to PK for the colour (fine - and the colours
dont rub off) and GEN4 for the VM.
Maybe when the next bottles are out and the new inks are proven, with
new curves to support, I will switch back. In the mean time, I will
stick with what I know to work....
Kind regards
Steve
--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff Korte"
<jeffkorte@m...> wrote:
> I will be making the switch from VMs to the Ultratones soon. It
> appears that these new inks may be more difficult to use with a
> CIS (nomorecarts in my case).
>
> Is anyone using these new inks successfully with a CIS?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jeff
>
>
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul
>
> Roark" <paul.roark@v...> wrote:
> > Jerry,
> >
> > The Eboni ink was not affected by the mixing errors. I have yet
> to have any
> > clogs with Eboni. I don't follow the Piezo list, but I did a
quick
> search
> > there about a week ago and didn't notice any significant
> Museum black
> > clogging issues either. I think they are about the same ink. I
> strongly
> > suspect the problems you were having were CIS
> cartridge-related, not
> > ink-related.
> >
> > Paul
> > http://www.PaulRoark.com
> > _________________________________________
> >
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 10
Date: Fri, 04 Apr 2003 13:48:35 -0000
From: "scrber" <stephen.bate@...>
Subject: Re: UltraTone Mix is wrong!
Hi Jeff, I have unfortunately been unable to correct the clogging
issues I have had with Eboni black. I am using the GP colour inks
and (was) the Ultratone VMs, in seperate 1290s, both CFSs, both
clogging, pooling and banding despite efforts to the contrary. I
gave up and switched to PK for the colour (fine - and the colours
dont rub off) and GEN4 for the VM.
Maybe when the next bottles are out and the new inks are proven, with
new curves to support, I will switch back. In the mean time, I will
stick with what I know to work....
Kind regards
Steve
--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff Korte"
<jeffkorte@m...> wrote:
> I will be making the switch from VMs to the Ultratones soon. It
> appears that these new inks may be more difficult to use with a
> CIS (nomorecarts in my case).
>
> Is anyone using these new inks successfully with a CIS?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jeff
>
>
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul
>
> Roark" <paul.roark@v...> wrote:
> > Jerry,
> >
> > The Eboni ink was not affected by the mixing errors. I have yet
> to have any
> > clogs with Eboni. I don't follow the Piezo list, but I did a
quick
> search
> > there about a week ago and didn't notice any significant
> Museum black
> > clogging issues either. I think they are about the same ink. I
> strongly
> > suspect the problems you were having were CIS
> cartridge-related, not
> > ink-related.
> >
> > Paul
> > http://www.PaulRoark.com
> > _________________________________________
> >
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 11
Date: Fri, 04 Apr 2003 13:50:58 -0000
From: "danielstaver" <daniel@...>
Subject: What is linearization?
It seems like everybody here knows this already, but I need to ask:
What is linearization and how is it done? I'm pretty sure it's
something related to calibration and densitometers, but I've never
read the exact definition of the process. Apparently I will be
borrowing a good densitometer next week, so I think this could be
useful information. I'd be grateful for any clarifying answers. Thanks!
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 12
Date: Fri, 04 Apr 2003 15:52:51 -0000
From: "Stephen Kobrin" <skobrin@...>
Subject: 2200
Now that the Epson 2200 seems to be readily available and given that
a number of people on the list have used it for a while, I wonder if
anyone could compare the results (B&W) to quad printing using one of
the older Epson printers. I use a 1200 with the MIS-VM inks and have
been pleased with the output. All things equal -- mainly my own
capabilities -- does the 2200 really provide much more upside
potential? I rarely print larger than 8X10. Is it better or just
different??
Thanks,
Steve
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 13
Date: Fri, 04 Apr 2003 08:22:34 -0800
From: Richard Sintchak <richcontaxg@...>
Subject: Re: 2200
Friday, April 4, 2003, 7:52:51 AM, Stephen Kobrin wrote:
SK> Now that the Epson 2200 seems to be readily available and given that
SK> a number of people on the list have used it for a while, I wonder if
SK> anyone could compare the results (B&W) to quad printing using one of
SK> the older Epson printers. I use a 1200 with the MIS-VM inks and have
SK> been pleased with the output. All things equal -- mainly my own
SK> capabilities -- does the 2200 really provide much more upside
SK> potential? I rarely print larger than 8X10. Is it better or just
SK> different??
SK> Thanks,
SK> Steve
Without an expensive RIP I do not think neutral B&W is possible with
the 2200 no matter what workflow is used---and I have tried dozens and
dozens over the last few months. People who claim they are getting
neutral B&W prints from their 2200 using the Epson drivers I highly
suspect have not printed a B&W step wedge and compared it to one they
know is neutral, such as one from a quadtone ink set. The closest I
have come is printing through Qimage using ICC profiles off,
photo-realistic and -5 magenta setting. This gives me the smoothest
and most neutral 21-step wedge I've seen from my 2200 so far (on EAM)
yet there is still some slight green in the highlights. Much less than
anything else I've tried, but still there. It is the only workflow
that has NOT given me green-magenta-green-magenta cast transitions
through the wedge and with blocked up 95%+ areas.
That said I still love my 2200 for toned B&W such as sepia or
coppery-toned B&W prints. And the 2880 dpi printing capability is
quite wonderful especially if I print with Qimage printing software.
But I'll be sticking to my 1160 with MIS FS-N inks for the time being
for neutral B&W. Much cheaper too since I use a CFS.
As for how it compares to the VM ink set I cannot tell as I have not
used it. I will say though that I have not been overly impressed with
the VM prints I have seen. I suspect it's user error as they have been
prints with different colors in different areas of the print and I
guess the workflow can be finicky. If so then the 2200 might be better
if color-toned B&W is your game.
Best regards,
Richard
mailto:richard@...
L i n k s t o m y g a l l e r i e s:
http://fujirangefinder.com/document.php?id=246
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 14
Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 12:27:18 EST
From: grdglass@...
Subject: Re: OPM - 2200 - black only tests - initial report
Antonis,
Thanks for the black-only profile, the 26-patch, and the methodology.
I just finished my tests and my observations are somewhat different, but
before I get into that, I want you to know that I emailed a scan of my OPM
problems to Charles at BowHaus. He sees what I am encountering and they are
going to try to reproduce the problems. Hopefully they will solve it.
OK, now to my tests using your methods.
1. Using the OPM black-only profile, I still get banding in the 100% patch.
My thinking is that if it's ink starvation, a faulty black cartridge, or a
bad black head, I would be seeing banding throughout your 26-step patch. Do
you agree?
2. Using black-only with the Epson driver, no banding.
My visual observations are somewhat different than yours:
1. You see a herringbone pattern in the Epson driver; I do not.
2. My Epson driver has a nice long tonal scale, unlike yours which dips
into
dark from 50-100. Like yours, the dots are most apparent in the midtones.
3. The OPM driver is more compressed. From 0 to 44, I see white striations
in the top part of the scale. I see these with my eye but cannot see them
under a loupe. Patches 68-84 seem to be the same tone. OPM's midtone dots
are less apparent than Epson's.
I will put everything under a densitometer later today or tomorrow and let
you know.
Helene
> Given reports that some here have seen banding in the black when printing
> with OPM but not when printing with the Epson driver, I did a test using
> the
> files I uploaded earlier: The black-only profile and the 26-patch test
> scale.
>
>
>
>
> Here is the methodology, so that others may do the same and we can then
> compare notes:
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 15
Date: Fri, 04 Apr 2003 18:08:27 -0000
From: "Antonis Ricos" <antonisphoto@...>
Subject: Re: What is linearization?
Daniel,
linearization in general, means bringing a printer to behave consistently
across a scale from white to black. In prepress, that would mean that the
50%
dot should be made up of half ink and half paper white, and likewise, a 10%
dot would have 90% paper white etc.
In color managment and profile making, linearization is the first step,
before
profiling: you want a printer to behave well and reproduce each color scale
in
the same consistent way from 100% to paper white. That's a "linear"
behaviour. You then create and apply a profile "on top" of that.
In the case of OpenPrintmaker (OPM) and InkjetControl (IJC) a printer is
brought to behave consistently across the grayscale based on a set of
predefined "Ideal Densities" or "Aims". In that sense, profiling and
linearizing
are wrapped in one. Because inkjets and their behaviour is closer to
continuous tone devices than to traditional halftones, the approach to
linearization is closer to how you would approach darkroom densitometry.
There are no "dot percents" to talk about (dithers are closer to stochastic
screens, that's another topic...).
If you have a densitometer and IJC, you are able to read the grayscale
target
that the program generates. Once you read the paper white and the 100%
black, IJC will give you ("generate") the 24 intermediate densities that
your
scale should match. By using the controls in the program, you can then
"linearize", or match those densities to your printed output. Once you've
done
that and confirmed it by reading the linearized print of the 26-patch scale
and
comparing to the Aims, you save the settings as a "profile" (or
"calibration" or
whatever you want to call it since it is not an ICC-based profile).
>From this point on, as long as your printer / ink / paper conbination
remains
the same, that profile will be valid and will produce accurate, smooth tonal
transitions in your images. In theory, the same profile may work for
someone
else using the exact same combo, but for them it would only be a "canned"
profile, unless they can edit it (using IJC) to "linearize" their particular
output.
Ultimately, the purpose of linearization is to preserve all those delicate
tonal
transitions in your digital files, and the best way to do it is to have a
densitometer and check your system before an important print job. Anything
else - eyeballed, canned etc will be "decent" enough, but not accurate and
consistent across systems or over time. Not that much different, really,
than a
meticulous darkroom practitioner who plots characteristic curves for their
film
and paper and matches them up.
Antonis
--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "danielstaver"
<daniel@p...> wrote:
> It seems like everybody here knows this already, but I need to ask:
> What is linearization and how is it done? I'm pretty sure it's
> something related to calibration and densitometers, but I've never
> read the exact definition of the process. Apparently I will be
> borrowing a good densitometer next week, so I think this could be
> useful information. I'd be grateful for any clarifying answers. Thanks!
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 16
Date: Wed, 02 Apr 2003 10:51:29 -0800
From: Robert Morrison <rmorrison@...>
Subject: Re: Re: Brightcube semi-matte similars
On 3/31/03 6:46 PM, "Andr\ufffd Vallejo" <avs@...> wrote:
> I\ufffdm using the FS-BW from MIS,guess it\ufffds old stuff,but as I want neutral
> prints,not warm or cool,looks like it\ufffds the best choice.Could I change the
> 100% black ink for the photo black only? Guess so.
No you can't . All of the FS inks including the grays are incompatible with
the glossy/semi-matte papers. You will need to change to all Ultra-Quad
inks including the photo black to make the inks truly compatible with the
paper. You will be much more likely to get neutral prints by using the
Ultra-Quads with the Semi-Matte paper. MIS FS is very warm of neutral on
the BC semi-matte. FS-N is closer to neutral on this paper...but with the
ultra-quads and a driver like the ink jet control software you should be
able to get something that is exactly neutral (whatever that is for you)
with the BC semi-matte.
Robert
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 17
Date: Wed, 02 Apr 2003 10:57:23 -0800
From: Robert Morrison <rmorrison@...>
Subject: Re: Densitometer or Spectrophotometer?
Sorry about that...if price is no option it shouldn't be a problem to use a
high-end spectrophotometer to measure 21 step wedges. The specs of the unit
that you give below seem to be completely adequate. My main concern was for
people on a budget...where the used densitometers seem to give much better
performance than the lower-end new spectrophotometers.
Robert
On 3/31/03 11:19 AM, "Dimitri Katsaros" <dcka@...> wrote:
> Yes, but if you recall, I did specify that you forget about price
> differences. So, the spectrophotometer I had in mind was the
> Spectrolino. Alternatively, the people at X-Rite suggested the 508,
> but the downside with the 508 is that it cannot be used with a
> monitor (to my knowledge) nor can I see a way for it to be fitted to
> a device similar to the spectroscan. OTOH, the 508 is slightly more
> accurate (0-2.0D +/-.005D and 2.0-2.5 +/-.010D).
>
> Dimitri
>
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Robert Morrison
> <rmorrison@p...> wrote:
>> The problem with many of the pro-sumer level spectrophotometers is
> that they
>> don't have strong enough light sources to measure black patches
> with low
>> reflectance (high dmax). As a result, several of us have found
> that these
>> devices are not good for readings above 1.6 or so. This is a
> problem for
>> determining accurate shadows on many matte papers and causes
> considerable
>> problems if you plan to work with coatings or print on glossy or RC
> papers.
>> As such, buying a used professional densitometer, like the X-rite
> 810, which
>> several of us have, makes more sense for measuring step wedges for
> BW work.
>>
>> Robert
>>
>>
>> On 3/30/03 9:28 PM, "Dimitri Katsaros" <dcka@y...> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> I was wondering if, forgetting for a moment about any
>>> price differences, a dedicated densitometer is, in
>>> general, any more accurate that using a
>>> spectrophotometer for measuring a 21-step wedge. I
>>> know that there are variances between models and
>>> brands, but I am also wondering if there would be any
>>> advantage in owning both.
>>>
>>> Thank you
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Message: 18
Date: Fri, 04 Apr 2003 18:33:34 -0000
From: "Antonis Ricos" <antonisphoto@...>
Subject: Re: OPM - 2200 - black only tests - initial report
Helene,
glad to see you ran the test, so we can compare notes. Some of mine to
follow
yours:
> 1. Using the OPM black-only profile, I still get banding in the 100%
patch.
> My thinking is that if it's ink starvation, a faulty black cartridge, or a
> bad black head, I would be seeing banding throughout your 26-step patch.
Do
> you agree?
Yes, that seems logical.... The mystery, of course, is that I don't see that
behaviour on _my_ 2200. So it remains worth exploring further....
> 1. You see a herringbone pattern in the Epson driver; I do not.
That may well be differences in head alignment (since presumably you are
using the exact same Epson driver settings). I should re-visit that
procedure
on my printer, perhaps.
>
> 2. My Epson driver has a nice long tonal scale, unlike yours which dips
into
> dark from 50-100. Like yours, the dots are most apparent in the midtones.
Hmm.... that makes no sense: we should be getting identical density results
for
identical driver settings. Do you mind double-checking that your page setup
and other print settings in PS were the exact same as mine?
As for the dots themselves, we are in agreement.
>
> 3. The OPM driver is more compressed. From 0 to 44, I see white
striations
> in the top part of the scale. I see these with my eye but cannot see them
> under a loupe.
We see the same there. The highlight dots are too scattered up close to see
the striations under a loupe. The "top" part of the scale, presumably means
the
continuous gray ramp that appears above the individual patches as they are
laid out horizontally.
I don't know if these breaks or "striations" are a result of the particular
profile,
though. I didn't spend time exploring that further. I just made sure the
patches
came in at the proper densities. Tiny moves in the profile may make a big
difference here, don't know....
OPM's midtone dots
> are less apparent than Epson's.
We agree on that too. Hence my conclusion that in a real bw print
situation,
it's the mid tone dot that matters most for partitioned gray inks.
Interesting comparisons.... thanks for reporting back.
Antonis
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