Digital BW, The Print

It's clear I'll never be able to get rid of the color cast when trying 
to print grayscale (or grayscale in rgb mode) sketch images with my 
Canon S9000.

I also need inks that won't fade and change color.  Seem to be led to 
Epson, because I have to print on card stock.

Questions:  Can I print edge to edge on 8.5 x 11 paper on an Epson 
whose maximum size s 8.5 x 11?

Will I be able to get archival pigment continuous feed inks for most 
Epson models?

Is there a FAST archival Epson printer?

Which models should I look at?  Ink recommendations.

Here's the type of image I have to print:  http://www.pbase.
com/image/14098372

TIA

Isabel

Hi Isabel,

Don't give up yet. I print grayscale stuff very successfully with my S9000.
I use inkjet goodies ink which I think is for all intents every bit as good
as canon and a variety of glossy papers. I also print on a number of matte
papers with very satisfactory results but I have no idea what kind of
longevity I can expect. That having been said, there is significant
metamerism with dye inks so they will appear somewhat different depending on
the light source the image is viewed with. What is imperative is to have a
good profile for the ink - paper set that you are using.  All dye inks will
fade with time depending on light, environmental conditions and the like.
Canon suggests a 25 year life time with theirs if you use the expensive
canon glossy paper.

I use Epson for serious B&W work using the MIS FSN archival inkset and an
ancient Epson 860.  I have used the MIS archival color inks inks very
successfully in an Epson 1200. They don't have the gamut that color dye inks
do but the result isn't at all bad. The Epson printers are abysmally slow
compared to the canon.

If you want to go with the Epson and you want archival inks then the 2200 is
probably the way to go. For that matter with the 2200 and a decent rip you
can print superb B&W images as well.

Roger

  -----Original Message-----
  From: Isabel Cutler [mailto:billswife_1999@...]
  Sent: Monday, August 04, 2003 5:30 PM
  To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
  Subject: [Digital BW] Printer Advice for Printing Sketch Cards


  It's clear I'll never be able to get rid of the color cast when trying
  to print grayscale (or grayscale in rgb mode) sketch images with my
  Canon S9000.

  I also need inks that won't fade and change color.  Seem to be led to
  Epson, because I have to print on card stock.

  Questions:  Can I print edge to edge on 8.5 x 11 paper on an Epson
  whose maximum size s 8.5 x 11?

  Will I be able to get archival pigment continuous feed inks for most
  Epson models?

  Is there a FAST archival Epson printer?

  Which models should I look at?  Ink recommendations.

  Here's the type of image I have to print:  http://www.pbase.
  com/image/14098372

  TIA

  Isabel


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Thanks for the input, Roger.
I'm really concerned about fading, since in just a
short while I see color shifts in the supposed black
ink on my cards printed on both Georgia Pacific
Cardstock and laid card stock.
I wish there were a solution to the cast problem with
the S9000 with a 3rd party ink with some longevity.

Isabel

=====
http://www.pbase.com/isabel95

The problem with the canon at this time is that all of the inks available
for it are dye based. There are rumors that canon is working on pigment
based inks but I don't think i will hold my breath waiting. Jon Cone of
inkjetmall is suppossssedly working on a pigmented B&W set for the s9000 but
it hasn't surfaced yet even though it was promised for May...

At this point I can't see any way around getting a Epson if you want long
term (75 yr+ years) longevity. The other thing you might want to be
concerned with is the paper you are using since I don't think that either of
those are acid free archival products.

Roger

  -----Original Message-----
  From: Isabel Cutler [mailto:billswife_1999@...]
  Sent: Monday, August 04, 2003 7:47 PM
  To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
  Subject: RE: [Digital BW] Printer Advice for Printing Sketch Cards - Roger


  Thanks for the input, Roger.
  I'm really concerned about fading, since in just a
  short while I see color shifts in the supposed black
  ink on my cards printed on both Georgia Pacific
  Cardstock and laid card stock.
  I wish there were a solution to the cast problem with
  the S9000 with a 3rd party ink with some longevity.

  Isabel

  =====
  http://www.pbase.com/isabel95

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  Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and
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  If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same
page.

  Please follow these basic guidelines:
  - Include your full name with your message.
  - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
  - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
them short.
  - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject header.
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  - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the various
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Isabel,

An option would be the Epson c82 - pigmented inks,
prints relatively fast, and Niagra continuous ink
supply is available for this printer - so you would
have a variety of inks to choose from.  Close to the
edge printing - but no edge to edge printing except
for 4x6 size.


--- Isabel Cutler <billswife_1999@...> wrote:
> It's clear I'll never be able to get rid of the
> color cast when trying 
> to print grayscale (or grayscale in rgb mode) sketch
> images with my 
> Canon S9000.
> 
> I also need inks that won't fade and change color. 
> Seem to be led to 
> Epson, because I have to print on card stock.
> 
> Questions:  Can I print edge to edge on 8.5 x 11
> paper on an Epson 
> whose maximum size s 8.5 x 11?
> 
> Will I be able to get archival pigment continuous
> feed inks for most 
> Epson models?
> 
> Is there a FAST archival Epson printer?
> 
> Which models should I look at?  Ink recommendations.
> 
> Here's the type of image I have to print: 
> http://www.pbase.
> com/image/14098372
> 
> TIA
> 
> Isabel
> 
> 


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month!
http://sbc.yahoo.com

I knew that Cone was working on inks for the Canon and
just checked their website.  Nothing seems to be
happening.
My only other alternative is to have the cards printed
commercially, since they aren't really photos.
That would probably cost more than I'm charging for
them!
Thanks.
Isabel

=====
http://www.pbase.com/isabel95

I discovered that c52 today...will have to check it
out further.  Thanks.
Isabel

=====
http://www.pbase.com/isabel95

Hello Isabel,

I was pleased to see your post here in this forum.  By chance just a
few days ago I came across your web galleries and was admiring the
effects you are getting.  I'm just beginning to look more seriously
into digital cameras, after years of BW film work.  I'm just down the
road from you in West Palm Beach.


>Will I be able to get archival pigment continuous feed inks for most 
>Epson models?

Some models yes, some no, so do the homework.


>Is there a FAST archival Epson printer?

Lots of people say the 2200 is faster that other models.  I don't know
how it compares to a Canon.

 
>Ink recommendations.

The MIS ultratones (all black) are getting the best reviews these
days, in terms of stability and longevity.  They are supposedly ready
for the 2200 soon.


>Here's the type of image I have to print:  

The pencil sketch style might look good with Black Only (BO) printing
- it's worth a try.  It has a unique look which I think would work
well with that.  And with just the pure carbon black ink the prints
have excellent longevity when printed on 100% cotton papers.  The
Epson printer drivers do a fine job with BO.  There is info about the
method on my web site (see link below) along with other useful
information.

Regards,
Clayton


Info on black and white digital printing at    
http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm

West Palm just down the road from Western NC?????

I'm so frustrated!  I have to print a few hundred note
cards for a dog specialty show and commercial printing
is out of the question pricewise.

No matter how I fiddle with the S900 I get either
magenta or green prints with no real deep black
possible...and I have to print b/w sketches.

The glacially slow Epson does not appeal at all.

Isabel

=====
http://www.pbase.com/isabel95

So sorry...I'm always in a hurry!

I will read your website and hopefully find some
encouraging information!
Thank you so much for your input

Isabel

=====
http://www.pbase.com/isabel95

Well...you certainly nailed my problems with the color
shifts...and covered all the bases with which I was
concerned...continuous ink systems chief among them.
I expect in a couple of years all these problems will
be ironed out by the march of technology...hopefully
Canon will come out with inks that produce better
grayscale on non-photo paper.
Thanks again.
Isabel

=====
http://www.pbase.com/isabel95

The Epson Stylus Photo 2200 has a maximum print size of 13X19, but it takes any size paper up to that and has an accessory to hold roll paper in the size of your sketch cards. It is the best printer that Epson or anyone makes because of it's ability to be totally controllable, it's use of pigment inks with a life of over 75 years, and it's true photo quality. Add to this, it's speed and it is the best printer for what you want to do. The downside is the cost. It costs $699, Oh, it also prints borderless on just about any paper. I own one of these and I am not sorry. Color is fantastic. 
     The problm with neutral black and white images is a nagging one. It can be cured with the installation of RIP software. Most places charge a steep price for this but you can get  one called Quadtone RIP free of charge from Roy Harrington, online. He will help you with the installation.
     The 2200 uses 7 inks also. That is very nice when only one runs out.
Cartridges are $8.90 each.

Re
gards,
Russ Martin


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Thanks for the input...I was hoping for something that
wouldn't cost more than I would make from filling that
particular card order!
Seems as soon as I think I'm caught up on equipment
and couldn't possibly need another thing something new
crops up.  Arghhhhhhhhhhh!

Isabel

=====
http://www.pbase.com/isabel95

Isabel.
      There is a Yahoo group for the 2200. Right now, they are talking about RIPsoftware and other unusual things, but it's a good place to go to get familiear with it.

Russ 

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/epson2200/?yguid=11031382


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Thanks...the yahoo group for the 2200 will be just the
thing!
Isabel

=====
http://www.pbase.com/isabel95

Hello Isabel,

>West Palm just down the road from Western NC?????

I thought I saw somewhere in your galleries that you live in Pt. St.
Lucie, Fla.  Sorry, my mistake.


> Well...you certainly nailed my problems with the color
> shifts...and covered all the bases with which I was
> concerned...continuous ink systems chief among them.
> I expect in a couple of years all these problems will
> be ironed out by the march of technology

Yes, that's the one thing we can count on, that technology won't stand
still.  Good luck on your search.

Regards,
Clayton


Info on black and white digital printing at    
http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm

> Oh, it also prints borderless on just about any paper.

I'm not so sure about that.  (I'm at work, so can't check for sure).
But I seem to remember wanting to print borderless on some smaller
non-standard size paper and it wouldn't do it - or at least, the
"Borderless" check-box was grayed-out.

And for sure it will not print borderless when in "matte" mode
(the matte-black cartridge installed).

John