Digital BW, The Print

Hello Cyril
I've used lyson small gamut inks for about 6 months of so
and I' had a lot of problems with the inks
The continuos feed system work well but the inks didn't give me the gama or
the tones I wanted.
Also most prints turned green after a few day or somtimes weeks. and to make
things worse the prints realy suffered from materism, or however its called.
I dont recommend the lyson small gamut.
John tencza
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cyril H. Walker" <cyril@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2003 10:48 AM
Subject: Re: [Digital BW] Lyson BW


> In message <000301c3bc21$8fdb9160$1a75fea9@andre>, Andr\ufffd Vallejo
> <avs@...> writes
> >Has anyone here experience with Lyson BW inks and Small Gamut inks
> >printing
> >neutral BW images? As they are available for the Canon 9100 now,I'd like
> >to
> >know how they stand in face of MIS FS inks,the brand I have experience
> >with...
> >Andr\ufffd Vallejo
> >http://andrevallejo.net
> >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
> I have used Lyson Small Gamut for 12 months.  Within their limitations
> very happily. They print well on Lyson glossy, lustre and llford Classic
> Pearl using the Lyson suggested setting for near neutral prints of Hue
> 210 Sat 5(4) Lightness 0 and colorise, with minimum metamerism. I cannot
> comment on longevity but have had no problems myself. Help from
> Marrutt's (UK distributors) very good.
> --
> Cyril H. Walker
>
>
>
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Has anyone here experience with Lyson BW inks and Small Gamut inks printing
neutral BW images? As they are available for the Canon 9100 now,I'd like to
know how they stand in face of MIS FS inks,the brand I have experience
with...



Andr\ufffd Vallejo
http://andrevallejo.net

Andre;

About a year ago I did some printing with Lyson SG inks in my Epson  
1280. I was able to get good tonality and print both on glossy and  
matte papers , a very nice attribute. The downside of the SG inks is  
that they do exhibit some metamerism  ( the level varies from paper to  
paper ). Also keep in mind that these inks are Dye based so they will  
fade / shift much sooner than the MIS FS inks.

-Jeff

On Saturday, December 6, 2003, at 12:51 PM, André Vallejo wrote:

> Has anyone here experience with Lyson BW inks and Small Gamut inks  
> printing
> neutral BW images? As they are available for the Canon 9100 now,I'd  
> like to
> know how they stand in face of MIS FS inks,the brand I have experience
> with...
>
>
>
> André Vallejo
> http://andrevallejo.net
>
>
>
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>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other  
> resources as they are often being updated.
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish  
> to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting  
> this same page.
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to  
> keep them short.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or  
> flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from  
> the membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital  
> B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be  
> removed from the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and  
> guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group  
> Owner and Moderators. See “Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines” in the  
> Files section:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
>
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE “OWNER”  
> AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE  
> LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL,  
> CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO,  
> DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE  
> LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT  
> YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES),  
> RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW,  
> THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF  
> YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD  
> PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER  
> MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to  
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

In message <000301c3bc21$8fdb9160$1a75fea9@andre>, Andr\ufffd Vallejo 
<avs@...> writes
>Has anyone here experience with Lyson BW inks and Small Gamut inks
>printing
>neutral BW images? As they are available for the Canon 9100 now,I'd like
>to
>know how they stand in face of MIS FS inks,the brand I have experience
>with...
>Andr\ufffd Vallejo
>http://andrevallejo.net
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
I have used Lyson Small Gamut for 12 months.  Within their limitations 
very happily. They print well on Lyson glossy, lustre and llford Classic 
Pearl using the Lyson suggested setting for near neutral prints of Hue 
210 Sat 5(4) Lightness 0 and colorise, with minimum metamerism. I cannot 
comment on longevity but have had no problems myself. Help from 
Marrutt's (UK distributors) very good.
-- 
Cyril H. Walker

I personally love them for the uses I put them to.. Like the MIS inks 
they aren't perfect with every paper.. With  pigment based inks, some RC 
papers will give you big problems.. With the Lyson SG inks, you'll find 
some metamerism on matte papers that have not had their coatings tweaked 
to the Lyson dyes. However, Lyson gets tweaked versions and rebrands 
them as Lyson papers for products in these lines..  Papers like 
PhotoRag, German Etching, and other stock Hahnemuhle papers gave me the 
most trouble.  Which isn't a real issue as the Lyson Fine Art papers are 
coating tweaked versions of the Hahnemuhle media..

The SGs do a GREAT job on RC papers and unlike, say, EPSON OEM dye-based 
inks, I haven't seen any great color shift or fade..




 
Keith Krebs

"Just some guy," caretaker of the Multiverse's largest EPSON printer 
User Community (highly recommended by Vogon Poets and MegaDodo 
Publications), at:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EPSON_Printers/
and  the Multiverse's largest Canon printer User  Community at:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Canon-printers
"For the rest of you out there, the secret is to bang the rocks together 
guys"

You get nice tonalities but prints fade quite fast and they suffer 
from metamerism. I don't use them anymore

Cristian

You get nice tonalities but prints fade quite fast and they suffer 
from metamerism. I don't use them anymore

Cristian

In message <000201c29e19$62565030$6eeac043@imagesurban>, Jon Tencza 
<ericten@...> writes
>Hello Cyril
>I've used lyson small gamut inks for about 6 months of so
>and I' had a lot of problems with the inks
>The continuos feed system work well but the inks didn't give me the gama
>or
>the tones I wanted.
>Also most prints turned green after a few day or somtimes weeks. and to
>make
>things worse the prints realy suffered from materism, or however its called.
>I dont recommend the lyson small gamut.
>John tencza
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Cyril H. Walker" <cyril@...>
>To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
>Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2003 10:48 AM
>Subject: Re: [Digital BW] Lyson BW
>
Dear John
I have prints from 12months ago which have shown no colour change and 
have been lying round the house on view and unprotected.  The gamma is 
as good as a wet process Ilford multigradeIV  paper without selenium 
toning. (I tested before committing to a CIS). I have heard that Lyson 
inks are "tuned" to Lyson paper and that they have the coatings 
specially adapted for their inks. I use their profiles downloaded from 
their site with a little lightening in "curves" and if they are on 
display(no glass!), use "Print Guard". We do not have that much sun here 
but plenty of damp. This may be a factor. Metamerism seems to be heavily 
dependant on the paper used but is slight on the papers I listed in the 
e-mail. As I have retired and am not selling fine art prints I just want 
the best results without an archival 100yrs. but I expect the quality to 
equal my darkroom work.
--Best wishes
Cyril H. Walker

Cyril H. Walker wrote:

>In message <000201c29e19$62565030$6eeac043@imagesurban>, Jon Tencza 
><ericten@...> writes
>  
>
>>Hello Cyril
>>I've used lyson small gamut inks for about 6 months of so
>>    
>>
<snip>

>>The continuos feed system work well but the inks didn't give me the gama
>>or
>>the tones I wanted.
>>

Hmmmm.. Maybe that's why they are called SMALL Gamut?

IF you're expecting to get ultra-saturated monotone colors  you're gonna 
need a full-gamut set (and accept the lesser degree of individual tonal 
control and potentially higher metameric issues) or you'll have to 
design and mix a tone specific one from available carriers, dyes, and 
pigments.

It's just a thought...


 
Keith Krebs

"Just some guy," caretaker of the Multiverse's largest EPSON printer 
User Community (highly recommended by Vogon Poets and MegaDodo 
Publications), at:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EPSON_Printers/
and  the Multiverse's largest Canon printer User  Community at:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Canon-printers
"For the rest of you out there, the secret is to bang the rocks together 
guys"