Digital BW, The Print

Hello all,

It was with great excitement that I say a message from Roy that the 
profile creation ability was now available for WinXP users. I 
downloaded the latest version of QTR/QTRGui and dove right into the 
process, but found that I had jumped into water deeper than I had 
ever been before. Knowing nothing about printer profiling, I was lost 
at sea at this point. I have printed out the calibration image and 
scanned it into Photoshop. Having done this I can read each square 
and get a resulting number. My question now is how do I relate that 
number to any of those in the curve creation panels. 
HHHHEEEEELLLLLPPPPP!!!!!

Your befuddled friend in Photography,

Johnny

Hi,

Tom Moore has written a really good introduction and tutorial on how to 
create curves for QuadToneRIP.

I see the tutorial didn't make it into this release, so I've made it 
available here:
http://download.petraflux.com/qtrtutorial.zip (367kb)

The tutorial is not really finished yet, and it's not updated to reflect 
the latest changes that was made to the interface in QTRgui. At the time 
of writing you still had to edit the ink descriptor files directly, but 
it should give you a good idea of how the various parameters interact 
with each other.

I encourage you to give your feedback on the tutorial and documentation 
in general so we can the neccessary improvements to make this more easy 
to understand for everyone.

--
Daniel Staver
http://daniel.staver.no


Johnny Eades wrote:

> 
> Hello all,
> 
> It was with great excitement that I say a message from Roy that the 
> profile creation ability was now available for WinXP users. I 
> downloaded the latest version of QTR/QTRGui and dove right into the 
> process, but found that I had jumped into water deeper than I had 
> ever been before. Knowing nothing about printer profiling, I was lost 
> at sea at this point. I have printed out the calibration image and 
> scanned it into Photoshop. Having done this I can read each square 
> and get a resulting number. My question now is how do I relate that 
> number to any of those in the curve creation panels. 
> HHHHEEEEELLLLLPPPPP!!!!!
> 
> Your befuddled friend in Photography,

Daniel, Roy, Johnny, Pieris and others

Thanks for the great news.  I downloaded earlier this morning and then
printed the 'Help' file (as I gether have several others) and having
read thru it am now especially pleased with Danial's message.  Will
next download the tutorial and try and get the messages to sink in.

Very much appreciated and thank you for the very hard work.

Fred Drury
Markland Imaging 


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Daniel Staver
<daniel@p...> wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Tom Moore has written a really good introduction and tutorial on how to 
> create curves for QuadToneRIP.
> 
> I see the tutorial didn't make it into this release, so I've made it 
> available here:
> http://download.petraflux.com/qtrtutorial.zip (367kb)
> 
> The tutorial is not really finished yet, and it's not updated to
reflect 
> the latest changes that was made to the interface in QTRgui. At the
time 

> of writing you still had to edit the ink descriptor files directly, but 
> it should give you a good idea of how the various parameters interact 
> with each other.
> 
> I encourage you to give your feedback on the tutorial and documentation 
> in general so we can the neccessary improvements to make this more easy 
> to understand for everyone.
> 
> --
> Daniel Staver
> http://daniel.staver.no
> 
> 
> Johnny Eades wrote:
> > 
> > Hello all,
> > 
> > It was with great excitement that I say a message from Roy that the 
> > profile creation ability was now available for WinXP users. I 
> > downloaded the latest version of QTR/QTRGui and dove right into the 
> > process, but found that I had jumped into water deeper than I had 
> > ever been before. Knowing nothing about printer profiling, I was lost 
> > at sea at this point. I have printed out the calibration image and 
> > scanned it into Photoshop. Having done this I can read each square 
> > and get a resulting number. My question now is how do I relate that 
> > number to any of those in the curve creation panels. 
> > HHHHEEEEELLLLLPPPPP!!!!!
> > 
> > Your befuddled friend in Photography,

Daniel,
I am unable to open your download.  I have had this happen before but 
do not remember what the issues were.  Clicking on your link 
automatically starts a download into my Temp folder.  When completed 
it automatically asks if you want to open.  If yes, the contents of 
the zip file are empty.  If no, all that is in the temp file is a 
short cut to the web location & the whole thing starts all over again.

Any suggestion?  I run Windows XP Pro.

Bruce Varner
http://mywebpages.comcast.net/btvarner/Bruce/photo.htm


> Tom Moore has written a really good introduction and tutorial on 
how to 
> create curves for QuadToneRIP.
> 
> I see the tutorial didn't make it into this release, so I've made 
it 
> available here:
> http://download.petraflux.com/qtrtutorial.zip (367kb)
> 
> The tutorial is not really finished yet, and it's not updated to 
reflect 
> the latest changes that was made to the interface in QTRgui. At the 
time 
> of writing you still had to edit the ink descriptor files directly, 
but 
> it should give you a good idea of how the various parameters 
interact 
> with each other.
> 
> I encourage you to give your feedback on the tutorial and 
documentation 
> in general so we can the neccessary improvements to make this more 
easy 

> to understand for everyone.
> 
> --
> Daniel Staver
> http://daniel.staver.no

I don't know what's going wrong. I'm also sitting in an external office 
now and just downloaded and extracted the file without any problems. I'm 
using Windows XP pro and Mozilla Firefox to download.

What program are you using to unzip your zip files?

Anyone else having trouble with this file?

--
Daniel Staver
http://daniel.staver.no

> Daniel,
> I am unable to open your download.  I have had this happen before but 
> do not remember what the issues were.  Clicking on your link 
> automatically starts a download into my Temp folder.  When completed 
> it automatically asks if you want to open.  If yes, the contents of 
> the zip file are empty.  If no, all that is in the temp file is a 
> short cut to the web location & the whole thing starts all over again.
> 
> Any suggestion?  I run Windows XP Pro.

Daniel, nope I downloaded fine. You need to use Stuffit though I think. Otherwise thanks for the tutorial
 
John

Daniel Staver <daniel@...> wrote:
I don't know what's going wrong. I'm also sitting in an external office 
now and just downloaded and extracted the file without any problems. I'm 
using Windows XP pro and Mozilla Firefox to download.

What program are you using to unzip your zip files?

Anyone else having trouble with this file?

--
Daniel Staver
http://daniel.staver.no



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hello Daniel,

I downloaded your QTR curve tutorial---and am completely lost in 
understanding it. I created the calibration curves and printed them 
at 10%, 85% 70% ink limits and still can't tell the maximum ink level 
to use to get the correct separation between the darkest end of the 
Black,Cyan, and Magenta to plug into the curve creation process. I 
cobbled up something just to see some type of results, and I get the 
darkest sepia image as the result. I think I need to learn all the 
terminology before jumpimg into this printer profile business. I'm 
not going to give up because when I do finally get proper results, 
I'll be a better man for it; having developed much more patience.

Still your frustrated friend in Photography,

Johnny

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Daniel Staver 
<daniel@p...> wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Tom Moore has written a really good introduction and tutorial on 
how to 
> create curves for QuadToneRIP.
> 
> I see the tutorial didn't make it into this release, so I've made 
it 
> available here:
> http://download.petraflux.com/qtrtutorial.zip (367kb)
> 
> The tutorial is not really finished yet, and it's not updated to 
reflect 
> the latest changes that was made to the interface in QTRgui. At the 
time 
> of writing you still had to edit the ink descriptor files directly, 
but 
> it should give you a good idea of how the various parameters 
interact 
> with each other.
> 
> I encourage you to give your feedback on the tutorial and 
documentation 
> in general so we can the neccessary improvements to make this more 
easy 
> to understand for everyone.
> 
> --
> Daniel Staver
> http://daniel.staver.no
> 
> 
> Johnny Eades wrote:
> > 
> > Hello all,
> > 
> > It was with great excitement that I say a message from Roy that 
the 
> > profile creation ability was now available for WinXP users. I 
> > downloaded the latest version of QTR/QTRGui and dove right into 
the 
> > process, but found that I had jumped into water deeper than I had 
> > ever been before. Knowing nothing about printer profiling, I was 
lost 
> > at sea at this point. I have printed out the calibration image 
and 
> > scanned it into Photoshop. Having done this I can read each 
square 
> > and get a resulting number. My question now is how do I relate 
that 

> > number to any of those in the curve creation panels. 
> > HHHHEEEEELLLLLPPPPP!!!!!
> > 
> > Your befuddled friend in Photography,

I don't think the profile creation on XP is quite functional yet. When
you click on the "Create Curve" button on the Curve Creator window you
get "Could not start QuadProfile.exe". The supplied profile for the
VMS inkset for the 1160 is very good though.

--nick

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Johnny Eades"
<jeades1@s...> wrote:

> 
> Hello all,
> 
> It was with great excitement that I say a message from Roy that the 
> profile creation ability was now available for WinXP users. I 
> downloaded the latest version of QTR/QTRGui and dove right into the 
> process, but found that I had jumped into water deeper than I had 
> ever been before. Knowing nothing about printer profiling, I was lost 
> at sea at this point. I have printed out the calibration image and 
> scanned it into Photoshop. Having done this I can read each square 
> and get a resulting number. My question now is how do I relate that 
> number to any of those in the curve creation panels. 
> HHHHEEEEELLLLLPPPPP!!!!!
> 
> Your befuddled friend in Photography,
> 
> Johnny

Hello Nick,

Thanks for the information about the QTR Curve creator feature. Now 
I'll just have to be a little more patient till it is enabled and 
docs written for it.

Your friend in Photography,

Johnny

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Nick H. Nugent" 
<nghin@p...> wrote:
> 
> I don't think the profile creation on XP is quite functional yet. 
When
> you click on the "Create Curve" button on the Curve Creator window 
you
> get "Could not start QuadProfile.exe". The supplied profile for the
> VMS inkset for the 1160 is very good though.
> 
> --nick
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Johnny Eades"
> <jeades1@s...> wrote:
 My question now is how do I relate that 

> > number to any of those in the curve creation panels. 
> > HHHHEEEEELLLLLPPPPP!!!!!
> > 
> > Your befuddled friend in Photography,
> > 
> > Johnny

> I don't think the profile creation on XP is quite functional yet. When
> you click on the "Create Curve" button on the Curve Creator window you
> get "Could not start QuadProfile.exe". The supplied profile for the
> VMS inkset for the 1160 is very good though.

Did you download QuadToneRIPSetup_2.2a.EXE from 
http://homepage.mac.com/royharrington/FileSharing2.html?

This is the version that has QuadProfile included. I see there's links 
to some older versions on Roy's site, so you have to make sure you get 
the correct one.

I just tested a clean install of this version and QuadProfile works as 
expected.

--
Daniel Staver
http://daniel.staver.no

Hi Daniel,

Thanks for pointing this out. For some reason I thought the 2.2a is
older than 2.1f ....  :(    Strange. Can't wait to check out this
capability on Windows. Your tutorial is very much appreciated.

--nick

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Daniel Staver
<daniel@p...> wrote:
> > I don't think the profile creation on XP is quite functional yet.
When
> > you click on the "Create Curve" button on the Curve Creator
window you
> > get "Could not start QuadProfile.exe". The supplied profile for
the
> > VMS inkset for the 1160 is very good though.
> 
> Did you download QuadToneRIPSetup_2.2a.EXE from 
> http://homepage.mac.com/royharrington/FileSharing2.html?
> 
> This is the version that has QuadProfile included. I see there's
links 
> to some older versions on Roy's site, so you have to make sure you
get 
> the correct one.
> 
> I just tested a clean install of this version and QuadProfile works
as 

> expected.
> 
> --
> Daniel Staver
> http://daniel.staver.no

Did you check the box for Custom Curve Creation Software when you installed
QuadToneRIP? Is the file QuadProfile.exe in the bin folder of QuadToneRIP?
 
Perhaps you should run the QTRCleanout program and re-install.
 
 
-Stephen
 www.sbillard.org/Stephen

-----Original Message-----
From: Nick H. Nugent [mailto:nghin@...] 
Sent: Tuesday, February 15, 2005 2:01 PM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Digital BW] Re: QTR with profile creation



I don't think the profile creation on XP is quite functional yet. When
you click on the "Create Curve" button on the Curve Creator window you
get "Could not start QuadProfile.exe". The supplied profile for the
VMS inkset for the 1160 is very good though.

--nick




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Daniel Staver wrote:
> I don't know what's going wrong. I'm also sitting in an external
> office
> now and just downloaded and extracted the file without any problems.
> I'm
> using Windows XP pro and Mozilla Firefox to download.
>
> What program are you using to unzip your zip files?
>
> Anyone else having trouble with this file?

No, it worked fine for me. (And thanks to you and others for the excellent
help).

Peter Marquis-Kyle

> In your message you say to "1. Print a 21 step wedge using a
> non-linearized curve." I don't understand the purpose of this step:
> is it to get a visually close print? How about if I don't use any
> curve? Is this a standard Photoshop-type curve?

Curve is perhaps a confusing term in this context. In QTR a profile is
called a curve. What I mean to say is "Print a 21 step wedge using a
non-linearized profile". Then you open the ink descriptor for that
profile, enter the linearization values and regenerate the profile.

--
Daniel Staver
http://daniel.staver.no

Daniel-

Not to be picky, but QTR (like the Bowhaus RIP) does not use profiles. They 
use print curves. Printing curves and printing profiles are not the same thing, 
although used properly they can both work for grayscale printing.



Bill Kennedy
Associate Professor of Photocommunications
St. Edward's University
512/448-8680


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Does tis mean that I may have created the proper items to print using 
the *.qdif files? I was under the impression the curve generated was 
one I would put in place of the paper curves. The print I made looked 
just like before using the grayscale LAB workspace.

Your starting to see the light friend in Photography,

Johnny


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, BKPhoto@a... 
wrote:
> Daniel-
> 
> Not to be picky, but QTR (like the Bowhaus RIP) does not use 
profiles. They 
> use print curves. Printing curves and printing profiles are not the 
same thing, 

> although used properly they can both work for grayscale printing.
> 
> 
> 
> Bill Kennedy
> Associate Professor of Photocommunications
> St. Edward's University
> 512/448-8680
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Yes, the curves magically appears in the 'Curves' drop-down menus once 
you push 'Create curve' in the Curve Creator. Curves are printer 
specific, so make sure you select the same 'Printing model' in the Curve 
Creator as what you use in QTRgui for general printing.

All the curves that come with QTR were created using this tool, except 
that before this release there was no GUI for the curve editing and the 
ink descriptors had to be edited as text files.

--
Daniel Staver
http://daniel.staver.no


Johnny Eades wrote:

> 
> Does tis mean that I may have created the proper items to print using 
> the *.qdif files? I was under the impression the curve generated was 
> one I would put in place of the paper curves. The print I made looked 
> just like before using the grayscale LAB workspace.
> 
> Your starting to see the light friend in Photography

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, BKPhoto@a... wrote:
> Daniel-
> 
> Not to be picky, but QTR (like the Bowhaus RIP) does not use profiles. They 
> use print curves. Printing curves and printing profiles are not the same thing, 
> although used properly they can both work for grayscale printing.
> 
> 
> 
> Bill Kennedy
> Associate Professor of Photocommunications
> St. Edward's University
> 512/448-8680

Bill,

A set of print curves is a profile, and visa versa. Just because QTR doesn't store its profiles in the International Color Consortium (ICC) standard file format, doesn't make the curves any less a profile. 

Its actually not that hard to translate from ICC to QTR to PhotoShop curves.

Ciao!

Joe

Hi Daniel,

I can't seem to be able to locate the Eye-One target reference files.
Specifically the QTR-21-gray, random, 51-gray, and 51-random. Can you
help?

Thanks,
--nick

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Daniel Staver
<daniel@p...> wrote:
> > In your message you say to "1. Print a 21 step wedge using a
> > non-linearized curve." I don't understand the purpose of this step:
> > is it to get a visually close print? How about if I don't use any
> > curve? Is this a standard Photoshop-type curve?
> 
> Curve is perhaps a confusing term in this context. In QTR a profile is
> called a curve. What I mean to say is "Print a 21 step wedge using a
> non-linearized profile". Then you open the ink descriptor for that
> profile, enter the linearization values and regenerate the profile.
> 
> --
> Daniel Staver
> http://danie

l.staver.no

For some reason I couldn't open the file after downloading.  The 
error message was "unable to load graphics conversion filter - MS 
Word 97 conversion."  I use WordPerfect 9 which also couldn't read 
the file.  I suggest that when the final version be distributed as a 
Pdf.

Andrew Unger

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Daniel Staver 
<daniel@p...> wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Tom Moore has written a really good introduction and tutorial on 
how to 
> create curves for QuadToneRIP.
> 
> I see the tutorial didn't make it into this release, so I've made 
it 

> available here:
> http://download.petraflux.com/qtrtutorial.zip (367kb)
> 
>

Joe-

Could you elaborate on this for me? I'd very much like to better understand 
this.



Bill Kennedy
Associate Professor of Photocommunications
St. Edward's University
512/448-8680


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]