Digital BW, The Print

Hi,

I have been doing only BO printing on an Epson 2200 with MIS ebony.

I have been using the QTR with ebony and results are pretty good.
Then again, I'm not new at this stuff so my judgement is not ideal.

I am looking to try some glossy printing.  You know I'm going after a 
more traditional dark room effect.

I am currently evaluating a purchase of one of the
following choices:

Epson Premium Semi Gloss
Epson Premium Luster
Epson Premium Semi Matte

I will be printing neutral and warm prints as I am currently testing 
QTR.  I also would like to use the paper to print color with the 
standard Epson driver.

Does anyone have a recommendation on the overall best choice for me?

I would love to hear the details about anyone's positive experiences
with any of these choices.

Thanks,
David

Couple suggestions from a non-expert:

1. If you can, try them all.  

2.  I have been printing just recently on Ilford Smooth Pearl (like 
Epson Luster - maybe between luster and semi-gloss).  I print with 
Permajet Oyster cool at 75% and warm at 25%.  Gives me a pretty 
neutral print.  The curves for premium semi-gloss give me brown 
prints on semi-gloss, gloss, luster, etc.  Oyster does the trick 
somehow.

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "David Sinai" 
<dsinai@y...> wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> I have been doing only BO printing on an Epson 2200 with MIS ebony.
> 
> I have been using the QTR with ebony and results are pretty good.
> Then again, I'm not new at this stuff so my judgement is not ideal.
> 
> I am looking to try some glossy printing.  You know I'm going 
after a 
> more traditional dark room effect.
> 
> I am currently evaluating a purchase of one of the
> following choices:
> 
> Epson Premium Semi Gloss
> Epson Premium Luster
> Epson Premium Semi Matte
> 
> I will be printing neutral and warm prints as I am currently 
testing 
> QTR.  I also would like to use the paper to print color with the 
> standard Epson driver.
> 
> Does anyone have a recommendation on the overall best choice for 
me?
> 
> I would love to hear the details about anyone's positive 
experiences

> with any of these choices.
> 
> Thanks,
> David

I'm getting good "neutral" results with Permajet Oyster curves too. 
I'm finding that for EPSG, 80-100% cool gives you a good neutral 
print.

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Andy" <andy-
j1959@m...> wrote:
> Couple suggestions from a non-expert:
> 
> 1. If you can, try them all.  
> 
> 2.  I have been printing just recently on Ilford Smooth Pearl 
(like 
> Epson Luster - maybe between luster and semi-gloss).  I print with 
> Permajet Oyster cool at 75% and warm at 25%.  Gives me a pretty 
> neutral print.  The curves for premium semi-gloss give me brown 
> prints on semi-gloss, gloss, luster, etc.  Oyster does the trick 
> somehow.
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "David Sinai" 
> <dsinai@y...> wrote:
> > Hi,
> > 
> > I have been doing only BO printing on an Epson 2200 with MIS 
ebony.
> > 
> > I have been using the QTR with ebony and results are pretty good.
> > Then again, I'm not new at this stuff so my judgement is not 
ideal.

> > 
> > I am looking to try some glossy printing.  You know I'm going 
> after a 
> > more traditional dark room effect.
> > 
> > I am currently evaluating a purchase of one of the
> > following choices:
> > 
> > Epson Premium Semi Gloss
> > Epson Premium Luster
> > Epson Premium Semi Matte
> > 
> > I will be printing neutral and warm prints as I am currently 
> testing 
> > QTR.  I also would like to use the paper to print color with the 
> > standard Epson driver.
> > 
> > Does anyone have a recommendation on the overall best choice for 
> me?
> > 
> > I would love to hear the details about anyone's positive 
> experiences
> > with any of these choices.
> > 
> > Thanks,
> > David

I'm using a C86 with MIS EZ inks, (Photo Black, Neutral, Neutral, Warm), 
and I like the image tone that I'm getting, but I haven't found a paper 
that I really like yet. So far I've tried Epson Premium Glossy, Kirkland 
Signature Glossy, Epson Enhanced Matte, and Permajet Alpha. The best 
results so far have been with EPG. The Kirkland paper looks good, except 
that it's too glossy. (I tried printing color photos with it on another 
C86 with Durabrite inks, and they looked horrible! The prints were way 
too contrasty and oversaturated.) The Permajet Alpha printed with 
blocked shadows with my test image, and while I love the luxurious feel 
of matte papers, I really miss the tonal snap of glossier papers. I'll 
have to get some more of this paper. Finally, I had some problems with 
posterization with the EEM. (This posterization didn't appear with the 
other papers.) 

So I'm looking into what to try next. One option would be to try premier 
art spray on the glossy papers.  What does this do to the gloss level of 
the papers? Another option would be to try some of the Epson premium 
semi-matte, luster, and semi-gloss.  I've seen prints on the luster, and 
they looked very good except that they had more texture than I'd like. 
Does anyone have any opinions on the semi-matte and semi-gloss?  
Finally, is there a way to get small samples of these papers?

Regards,
Peter De Smidt

sounds like alot of those problems are just incorrect profiling. 
Posterization is the fault of the settings, not the paper. It takes a 
while to get a paper dialed in. Plus all printers are a little 
diferent. Dont give up that easy. Anyways, the semimatte is definitely 
less glossy than kirkland, but I think that EPG is more glossy than 
kirkland. The Premium semi gloss has more texture than semimatte. You 
probably would like semimatte. Premium semi-matte profiles much 
diferently than Premium semi gloss of premium gloss, or Kirkland. 
(kirkland profiles similar to ilford Smooth.) You'll have to either 
make your own profiles for semi matte, or get them from somewhere. I 
like the look of semimatte, and so do others (like mr. Roark ((the 
man))..........You'll have some fun figuring it out, as long as you 
know it will take a while...Doug M
On May 8, 2005, at 4:58 PM, Peter De Smidt wrote:

> I'm using a C86 with MIS EZ inks, (Photo Black, Neutral, Neutral, 
> Warm),
>  and I like the image tone that I'm getting, but I haven't found a 
> paper
>  that I really like yet. So far I've tried Epson Premium Glossy, 
> Kirkland
>  Signature Glossy, Epson Enhanced Matte, and Permajet Alpha. The best
>  results so far have been with EPG. The Kirkland paper looks good, 
> except
>  that it's too glossy. (I tried printing color photos with it on 
> another
>  C86 with Durabrite inks, and they looked horrible! The prints were way
>  too contrasty and oversaturated.) The Permajet Alpha printed with
>  blocked shadows with my test image, and while I love the luxurious 
> feel
>  of matte papers, I really miss the tonal snap of glossier papers. I'll
>  have to get some more of this paper. Finally, I had some problems with
>  posterization with the EEM. (This posterization didn't appear with the


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I use the c86 for color prints of snapshots, and it works great but 
only on cheap epson glossy paper. All the other papers seem to have an 
incorrect color management issue going on. Even the durabrite glossy 
paper seems wrong. (all the papers are too blue) The cheap epson glossy 
paper looks perfect though. That is on a mac, with apple color 
management, using all the right media settings etc. in the epson 
driver. If you are using mis EZ inks, do you have two of these 
printers? One for Mono, and one for color?
I also forgot to say that the gloss of kirkland is cut down a lot when 
you spray with print shield. That may do the trick for you. Kirkland 
plus spray is pretty nice if you dont mind the extra step.
DM

On May 8, 2005, at 4:58 PM, Peter De Smidt wrote:

> (I tried printing color photos with it on another
>  C86 with Durabrite inks, and they looked horrible! The prints were way
>  too contrasty and oversaturated.)

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Douglas meeuwsen wrote:

><snip>If you are using mis EZ inks, do you have two of these 
>printers? One for Mono, and one for color?
>I also forgot to say that the gloss of kirkland is cut down a lot when 
>you spray with print shield. That may do the trick for you. Kirkland 
>plus spray is pretty nice if you dont mind the extra step.
>DM
>
>  
>
Thanks for your suggestions.  Yes, I have two C86's.  I bought the first 
one intending to convert it to MIS inks, but my daughter pursuaded me to 
keep a color printer, and so I had to buy another one.  I'll definitely 
try spraying the  Kirkland with print-shield.

-Peter