Digital BW, The Print

Mike, flush the epson inks with a flush cart. Install the new FS carts. Do
a clean cycle. Nozzle check. If ok fire away. If not do 4clean/wick cycles
(clean then park the head on the right for a couple of secs - this helps the
clean action), nozzle check. If bad, let sit for about 4 hours then repeat.
You will loose a lot in carts firing up a new system. Maybe you could get
some virgin empties from MIS plus some 4oz bottles and refill the carts.
Best of luck!
Julian
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Stone" <michaelstone@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, December 04, 2001 11:33 AM
Subject: [Digital BW] New ink new printer how long before I can use it ?


> Hello
>
> Todays deliveries included my repaired 1160, Epson had replaced both heads
> under warranty after terminal clogging from PiezographyBW inks. I also
> received a set of MIS FS cartridges.
>
> The question I ask those of you with more experience is: Should I let my
new
> carts sit a while before installing them and when I do install them should
I
> let the printer sit a while, run a cleaning cycle then let it sit before
> using it or just load up and fire away.
>
> The printer came back with epson carts installed and I have just done
nozzle
> and aligment checks and some test prints , all perfect.
>
> I'm itching to get started with the FS but don't want cock it up.
>
> Any advice gratefully received.
>
> Regards
>
> Mike Stone
>
> +44 (0)20 8365 7976
>
> michaelstone@...
>
> www.mikestonephotographer.com
>
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and
other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - Include your full name with your message.
> - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
them short.
> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject header.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or "flames."
> - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the various
resources on the homepage.

>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>

Julian

Thanks for the prompt reply. Sounds like a good plan to me.

I went for carts on a trial basis the plan is to go CIS when I find a combo
thats working for me though with my success rate at the moment that'll not
be any time soon.

Regards

Mike Stone

+44 (0)20 8365 7976

michaelstone@...

www.mikestonephotographer.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Julian Thomas" <julianthomas@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, December 04, 2001 10:38 AM
Subject: Re: [Digital BW] New ink new printer how long before I can use it ?


> Mike, flush the epson inks with a flush cart. Install the new FS carts. Do
> a clean cycle. Nozzle check. If ok fire away. If not do 4clean/wick cycles
> (clean then park the head on the right for a couple of secs - this helps
the
> clean action), nozzle check. If bad, let sit for about 4 hours then
repeat.
> You will loose a lot in carts firing up a new system. Maybe you could get
> some virgin empties from MIS plus some 4oz bottles and refill the carts.
> Best of luck!
> Julian
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mike Stone" <michaelstone@...>
> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, December 04, 2001 11:33 AM
> Subject: [Digital BW] New ink new printer how long before I can use it ?
>

> >
> > The question I ask those of you with more experience is: Should I let my
> new
> > carts sit a while before installing them and when I do install them
should

> I
> > let the printer sit a while, run a cleaning cycle then let it sit before
> > using it or just load up and fire away.
> >
> > The printer came back with epson carts installed and I have just done
> nozzle
> > and aligment checks and some test prints , all perfect.
> >
> > I'm itching to get started with the FS but don't want cock it up.
> >
> > Any advice gratefully received.
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Mike Stone

I'm going to investigate handfilling carts - I reckon that CIS maybe
responsable for a lot of Piezo problems. As no one seems to want my new set
of piezo inks, I'll probably get some carts and use those in my spare
printer.

Julian
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Stone" <michaelstone@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, December 04, 2001 12:03 PM
Subject: Re: [Digital BW] New ink new printer how long before I can use it ?


> Julian
>
> Thanks for the prompt reply. Sounds like a good plan to me.
>
> I went for carts on a trial basis the plan is to go CIS when I find a
combo
> thats working for me though with my success rate at the moment that'll not
> be any time soon.
>
> Regards
>
> Mike Stone
>
> +44 (0)20 8365 7976
>
> michaelstone@...
>
> www.mikestonephotographer.com
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Julian Thomas" <julianthomas@...>
> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, December 04, 2001 10:38 AM
> Subject: Re: [Digital BW] New ink new printer how long before I can use it
?
>
>
> > Mike, flush the epson inks with a flush cart. Install the new FS carts.
Do
> > a clean cycle. Nozzle check. If ok fire away. If not do 4clean/wick
cycles
> > (clean then park the head on the right for a couple of secs - this helps
> the
> > clean action), nozzle check. If bad, let sit for about 4 hours then
> repeat.
> > You will loose a lot in carts firing up a new system. Maybe you could
get
> > some virgin empties from MIS plus some 4oz bottles and refill the carts.
> > Best of luck!
> > Julian
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Mike Stone" <michaelstone@...>
> > To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Tuesday, December 04, 2001 11:33 AM
> > Subject: [Digital BW] New ink new printer how long before I can use it ?
> >
>
> > >
> > > The question I ask those of you with more experience is: Should I let
my
> > new
> > > carts sit a while before installing them and when I do install them
> should
> > I
> > > let the printer sit a while, run a cleaning cycle then let it sit
before
> > > using it or just load up and fire away.
> > >
> > > The printer came back with epson carts installed and I have just done
> > nozzle
> > > and aligment checks and some test prints , all perfect.
> > >
> > > I'm itching to get started with the FS but don't want cock it up.
> > >
> > > Any advice gratefully received.
> > >
> > > Regards
> > >
> > > Mike Stone
>
>
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and
other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - Include your full name with your message.
> - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
them short.
> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject header.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or "flames."
> - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the various
resources on the homepage.

>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>

Refilling carts still sounds messy and a fiddly, actually if I can get one
of these systems working a 3000 is probably the way to go for me.

The MIS carts are now in and some very smooth 21 step tests are coming out
via the Cone driver. I'll keep you posted

Regards

Mike Stone

+44 (0)20 8365 7976

michaelstone@...

www.mikestonephotographer.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Julian Thomas" <julianthomas@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, December 04, 2001 11:06 AM
Subject: Re: [Digital BW] New ink new printer how long before I can use it ?


> I'm going to investigate handfilling carts - I reckon that CIS maybe
> responsable for a lot of Piezo problems. As no one seems to want my new
set

> of piezo inks, I'll probably get some carts and use those in my spare
> printer.
>
> Julian

Julian-

My experience with the Piezo carts is killing me... I am about to 
quit trying to fix a persistent clog and send the 1160 to Epson.

I bought some FS carts to try... If that works, I'm going to try FS 
on a CIS. If that doesn't work, I'll go back to Piezo and try CIS and 
just learn to live with it.

Everyone I have talked with say that the CIS is really more stable 
than the carts... Once you learn to press the CIS carts down.

Tom O'Connell


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Julian Thomas" 
<julianthomas@t...> wrote:
> I'm going to investigate handfilling carts - I reckon that CIS maybe
> responsable for a lot of Piezo problems. As no one seems to want my 
new set
> of piezo inks, I'll probably get some carts and use those in my 
spare
> printer.
> 
> Julian
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mike Stone" <michaelstone@b...>
> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y...>
> Sent: Tuesday, December 04, 2001 12:03 PM
> Subject: Re: [Digital BW] New ink new printer how long before I can 
use it ?
> 
> 
> > Julian
> >
> > Thanks for the prompt reply. Sounds like a good plan to me.
> >
> > I went for carts on a trial basis the plan is to go CIS when I 
find a
> combo
> > thats working for me though with my success rate at the moment 
that'll not
> > be any time soon.
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Mike Stone
> >
> > +44 (0)20 8365 7976
> >
> > michaelstone@b...
> >
> > www.mikestonephotographer.com
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Julian Thomas" <julianthomas@t...>
> > To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y...>
> > Sent: Tuesday, December 04, 2001 10:38 AM
> > Subject: Re: [Digital BW] New ink new printer how long before I 
can use it
> ?
> >
> >
> > > Mike, flush the epson inks with a flush cart. Install the new 
FS carts.
> Do
> > > a clean cycle. Nozzle check. If ok fire away. If not do 
4clean/wick
> cycles
> > > (clean then park the head on the right for a couple of secs - 
this helps
> > the
> > > clean action), nozzle check. If bad, let sit for about 4 hours 
then
> > repeat.
> > > You will loose a lot in carts firing up a new system. Maybe you 
could
> get
> > > some virgin empties from MIS plus some 4oz bottles and refill 
the carts.
> > > Best of luck!
> > > Julian
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Mike Stone" <michaelstone@b...>
> > > To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y...>
> > > Sent: Tuesday, December 04, 2001 11:33 AM
> > > Subject: [Digital BW] New ink new printer how long before I can 
use it ?
> > >
> >
> > > >
> > > > The question I ask those of you with more experience is: 
Should I let
> my
> > > new
> > > > carts sit a while before installing them and when I do 
install them
> > should
> > > I
> > > > let the printer sit a while, run a cleaning cycle then let it 
sit
> before
> > > > using it or just load up and fire away.
> > > >
> > > > The printer came back with epson carts installed and I have 
just done
> > > nozzle
> > > > and aligment checks and some test prints , all perfect.
> > > >
> > > > I'm itching to get started with the FS but don't want cock it 
up.
> > > >
> > > > Any advice gratefully received.
> > > >
> > > > Regards
> > > >
> > > > Mike Stone
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, 
Polls and
> other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
> >
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> >
> > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > - Include your full name with your message.
> > - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier 
messages to keep
> them short.
> > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject 
header.
> > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks 
or "flames."
> > - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> > - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the 
various
> resources on the homepage.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

> >
> >
> >

----- Original Message -----

From: "tomoc" <tomoc@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, December 05, 2001 6:20 AM
Subject: Re: [Digital BW] New ink new printer how long before I can use it ?


> My experience with the Piezo carts is killing me... I am about to
> quit trying to fix a persistent clog and send the 1160 to Epson.
>> I bought some FS carts to try... If that works, I'm going to try FS
> on a CIS.

Tom,
sorry to hear about this kind of trouble, what I can tell you is that I am
running a CIS with MIS Full Spectrum inks and since the time I have
installed it (2 months maybe) I had exactly zero clogs. My impression is
that on switching on the printer it does cleaning cycles more often than
with Epson inks, but as  bulk inks are not too expensive, I don\ufffdt wory.
I have seen side to side comparisions of MIS FS and Piezo, and seen
virtually zero difference.

If you try it, you will probably not be unhappy. What I don\ufffdt know is how
much the 1160 heads (and nozzles) vary from sample to sample. Just can tell
that mine is fine.

Before the MIS inks I tried out a german quad black, there I had constantly
banding due to clogged nozzles.

Good luck, Bernhard

A follow up report now that the new inks are in the new printer.

I installed the new MIS FS carts into the repaired 1160 yesterday and had a
good nozzle check after 4 cleaning cycles. Spent a while playing with paper
settings in the Cone driver ran a few 21 step wedges and found that the MIS
FS ink is not far off the Piezo ink but the Somerset Photo Enhanced Satin
I'm using was showing compression in the 40%- 50% areas.

 Next I played with dot gain settings to get close to a good output and then
made an adjustment curve to fine tune the midtone compression which is
giving me an output that is pretty close to the screen.

I can't really make a print to print comparison with the Cone inks because I
was never able, on my set up, to get a really good print with them but this
combination of Cone driver MIS FS inks and the input and help from this
community is now letting me make some very nice prints.

Thank you all and I'll keep you posted.

p.s. whats the betting that now I've sent this email it all starts playing
up ;-)

Regards

Mike Stone

+44 (0)20 8365 7976

michaelstone@...

www.mikestonephotographer.com

Have you tried Chris Brandin's workflow for the 1160 (available 
on MIS web site)? I use it with MIS original quadtones on an 
1160 and get very good results with only minor curve tweaking. 
No fuss, no muss.

Jacques

>FS ink is not far off the Piezo ink but the Somerset Photo 
Enhanced Satin
> I'm using was showing compression in the 40%- 50% areas.
> 
>  Next I played with dot gain settings to get close to a good 
output and then
> made an adjustment curve to fine tune the midtone 
compression which is
> giving me an output that is pretty close to the screen.

Jacques

I have had a look but have not tried it yet. I do like the way the Cone
driver prints especially in the highlights.

Do you find that the Epson dither pattern is visible in highlights with the
Brandin workflow ?

Regards

Mike Stone

+44 (0)20 8365 7976

michaelstone@...

www.mikestonephotographer.com

----- Original Message -----

From: "jacques10040" <jacques10040@...>


> Have you tried Chris Brandin's workflow for the 1160 (available
> on MIS web site)? I use it with MIS original quadtones on an
> 1160 and get very good results with only minor curve tweaking.
> No fuss, no muss.
>

Bernard-

Thanks for the encouragement... I made my first FS prints yesterday 
and I'm very happy with them... Still some tweaking to do, some 
papers to try, but the great news was that once I loaded the carts, 
everthing went fine... No mulitple cleaning cycles etc... 

Do you use Cone or Epson drivers? What papers do you like best.

I find the FS considerably more neutral than piezo (can be good or 
bad)... So far the best prints for me are clearly on Epson Archival 
Matte (not my favorite paper but the blacks are perfect!!!

Do you use the John Wolf curves? Any advice on how to use them... 
That's something new to me.

This has me very encouraged... Thanks again.

Tom O'Connell


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., Bernhard.Schuerlein@t... 
wrote:
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "tomoc" <tomoc@y...>
> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y...>
> Sent: Wednesday, December 05, 2001 6:20 AM
> Subject: Re: [Digital BW] New ink new printer how long before I can 
use it ?
> 
> 
> > My experience with the Piezo carts is killing me... I am about to
> > quit trying to fix a persistent clog and send the 1160 to Epson.
> >> I bought some FS carts to try... If that works, I'm going to try 
FS
> > on a CIS.
> 
> Tom,
> sorry to hear about this kind of trouble, what I can tell you is 
that I am
> running a CIS with MIS Full Spectrum inks and since the time I have
> installed it (2 months maybe) I had exactly zero clogs. My 
impression is
> that on switching on the printer it does cleaning cycles more often 
than
> with Epson inks, but as  bulk inks are not too expensive, I don´t 
wory.
> I have seen side to side comparisions of MIS FS and Piezo, and seen
> virtually zero difference.
> 
> If you try it, you will probably not be unhappy. What I don´t know 
is how
> much the 1160 heads (and nozzles) vary from sample to sample. Just 
can tell
> that mine is fine.
> 
> Before the MIS inks I tried out a german quad black, there I had 
constantly

> banding due to clogged nozzles.
> 
> Good luck, Bernhard