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Best paper bargains?

Best paper bargains?

2005-05-18 by Scott McLoughlin

Economy is a life reality for me right now, and I'm wondering
what some of the better paper bargains (and suppliers, I suppose)
are out there right now.

To date, I've been using EEM and Matte Scrapbook in 8.5x11
on a C86/MIS combo. The latter seems to be a good value in a
cotton paper.

I have a new 2200, and note that Matte Scrapbook isn't available
in larger sheets.  I've been using EEM in my initial trials with QTR
GUI (I use PictureWindow Pro) (and printing color). 

For paper choices, I don't have the technology/know-how to create
custom profiles, so that may limit my paper choices, I imagine.

I note that Clayton's recently discussed Moab Kayenta (sp?) seems
a rather good value compared to EEM, and if it's archival properties
stand up, a very good value.

In 13x19, what papers might I consider balancing quality and value?
Should I simply forgo cotton fiber papers if economy is a major
consideration?

Thanks so much.

Scott

Re: Best paper bargains?

2005-05-18 by Andre

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Scott McLoughlin  
> In 13x19, what papers might I consider balancing quality and value?
> Should I simply forgo cotton fiber papers if economy is a major
> consideration?
> 
> Thanks so much.
> 
> Scott

Scott,

There is Premier Premium Matte which I  now use to replace EEM. Cost
about the same, DMAX as good or better. Brighter finish than EEM. But
best of all, its a 100% cotton acid free. 

I also use PremierArt 325gms - Heavy Weight, coated 2 sides. 100%
cotton, acid free, buffered. And no flaking. Has a warm look about it.

http://www.photowarehouse.biz/premier.html

Cheers,
André Moreau

RE: [Digital BW] Re: Best paper bargains?

2005-05-18 by Paul Roark

> > In 13x19, what papers might I consider balancing quality and value?
> > Should I simply forgo cotton fiber papers if economy is a major
> > consideration?
> >


 
> There is Premier Premium Matte which I  now use to replace EEM. Cost
> about the same, DMAX as good or better. Brighter finish than EEM. But
> best of all, its a 100% cotton acid free.


Premium Matte is acid free but not cotton.  It's a wood-based, buffered
paper.  Hopefully the lignin has been virtually eliminated.  It's almost
over-the-top on OBAs, but it does have a great dmax and is cheap.



> 
> I also use PremierArt 325gms - Heavy Weight, coated 2 sides. 100%
> cotton, acid free, buffered. And no flaking. Has a warm look about it.
> 
> http://www.photowarehouse.biz/premier.html


The 205 weight version of PremierArt Hot Press is a good value and coated on
both sides.  These papers are quite durable.

Consider also Innova Ultra Smooth FibaPrint.  It's an alpha cellulose paper
that has more reasonable OBA load than Premier Premium Matte and is about my
favorite weight at 280 gsm.  (See www.shadesofpaper.com) FibaPrint has a
better dmax than the PremierArt Hot Press papers.

In rolls, Epson Premium Semimatte is reasonably cheap.  I think I paid less
than $100 for a 100 foot 24 inch wide roll.

Now if 8x10 is the target, Kirkland Pro Glossy is the champ of cheap and
good.  It can be bought be non-members of Costco online.

All of the above papers have a minimum of flaking and other such problems.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Best paper bargains?

2005-05-18 by Scott McLoughlin

Wow, certainly a good price for 50 sheets of 13x19. Thanks!

Scott

Andre wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Scott McLoughlin
> > In 13x19, what papers might I consider balancing quality and value?
> > Should I simply forgo cotton fiber papers if economy is a major
> > consideration?
> >
> > Thanks so much.
> >
> > Scott
>
> Scott,
>
> There is Premier Premium Matte which I now use to replace EEM. Cost
> about the same, DMAX as good or better. Brighter finish than EEM. But
> best of all, its a 100% cotton acid free.
>
> I also use PremierArt 325gms - Heavy Weight, coated 2 sides. 100%
> cotton, acid free, buffered. And no flaking. Has a warm look about it.
>
> http://www.photowarehouse.biz/premier.html
>
> Cheers,
> Andr\ufffd Moreau
>
>
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other 
> resources as they are often being updated.
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish 
> to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting 
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>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
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> LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, 
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[Digital BW] Re: Best paper bargains?

2005-05-18 by tariqgibranstudio

EEM in 13x19 50 sheet box is around $36 at Atlex.com whereas this stuff is over $100 for 
50 sheets so unless I'm missing something here, looks to cost 3 times the price of EEM, 
hardly what I would call "about the same".  No doubt it's a fine paper though.  I have also 
been looking for a little nicer/thicker paper than EEM for close to the same price but in 
Rolls.  Just ordered some Moab Keyenta 205 dual sided so can proof on both sides.  It runs 
about $20-$30 more than EEM in 100 Ft rolls at 44 inches($139 for EEM at Atlex vs. $159 
Keyenta at Adorama or $169 at DTG with free shipping).  Not 100% cotton, but Alpha 
Cellulose acid free).  If it's nice, the Moab Entrada which is 100% Cotton uses the same 
coating and supposedly prints the same.

Tariq


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Scott McLoughlin <scott@a...> 
wrote:
> Wow, certainly a good price for 50 sheets of 13x19. Thanks!
> 
> Scott
> 
> Andre wrote:
> 
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Scott McLoughlin
> > > In 13x19, what papers might I consider balancing quality and value?
> > > Should I simply forgo cotton fiber papers if economy is a major
> > > consideration?
> > >
> > > Thanks so much.
> > >
> > > Scott
> >
> > Scott,
> >
> > There is Premier Premium Matte which I now use to replace EEM. Cost
> > about the same, DMAX as good or better. Brighter finish than EEM. But
> > best of all, its a 100% cotton acid free.
> >
> > I also use PremierArt 325gms - Heavy Weight, coated 2 sides. 100%
> > cotton, acid free, buffered. And no flaking. Has a warm look about it.
> >
> > http://www.photowarehouse.biz/premier.html
> >
> > Cheers,
> > André Moreau
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other 
> > resources as they are often being updated.
> >
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> >
> > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish 
> > to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting 
> > this same page.
> >
> > Please follow these basic guidelines:
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> > MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: [Digital BW] Re: Best paper bargains?

2005-05-18 by Scott McLoughlin

Let us know how the Moab paper works out. I'll take a gander at Atlex.com
to "recalibrate" my internal paper-pricing calculator :-)

Scott

tariqgibranstudio wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> EEM in 13x19 50 sheet box is around $36 at Atlex.com whereas this 
> stuff is over $100 for
> 50 sheets so unless I'm missing something here, looks to cost 3 times 
> the price of EEM,
> hardly what I would call "about the same". No doubt it's a fine paper 
> though. I have also
> been looking for a little nicer/thicker paper than EEM for close to 
> the same price but in
> Rolls. Just ordered some Moab Keyenta 205 dual sided so can proof on 
> both sides. It runs
> about $20-$30 more than EEM in 100 Ft rolls at 44 inches($139 for EEM 
> at Atlex vs. $159
> Keyenta at Adorama or $169 at DTG with free shipping). Not 100% 
> cotton, but Alpha
> Cellulose acid free). If it's nice, the Moab Entrada which is 100% 
> Cotton uses the same
> coating and supposedly prints the same.
>
> Tariq
>
>
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Scott McLoughlin 
> <scott@a...>
> wrote:
> > Wow, certainly a good price for 50 sheets of 13x19. Thanks!
> >
> > Scott
> >
> > Andre wrote:
> >
> > > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Scott McLoughlin
> > > > In 13x19, what papers might I consider balancing quality and value?
> > > > Should I simply forgo cotton fiber papers if economy is a major
> > > > consideration?
> > > >
> > > > Thanks so much.
> > > >
> > > > Scott
> > >
> > > Scott,
> > >
> > > There is Premier Premium Matte which I now use to replace EEM. Cost
> > > about the same, DMAX as good or better. Brighter finish than EEM. But
> > > best of all, its a 100% cotton acid free.
> > >
> > > I also use PremierArt 325gms - Heavy Weight, coated 2 sides. 100%
> > > cotton, acid free, buffered. And no flaking. Has a warm look about it.
> > >
> > > http://www.photowarehouse.biz/premier.html
> > >
> > > Cheers,
> > > Andr\ufffd Moreau
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other
> > > resources as they are often being updated.
> > >
> > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> > >
> > > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish
> > > to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting
> > > this same page.
> > >
> > > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to
> > > keep them short.
> > > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or
> > > flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed 
> from
> > > the membership without notice.
> > > - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital
> > > B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be
> > > removed from the membership.
> > > - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and
> > > guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group
> > > Owner and Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines" in the
> > > Files section:
> > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
> > >
> > > BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE
> > > PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE 
> "OWNER"
> > > AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE
> > > LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL,
> > > CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO,
> > > DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE
> > > LOSSES (EVEN IF THE "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
> > > YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES),
> > > RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW,
> > > THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF
> > > YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD
> > > PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER
> > > MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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>
>
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other 
> resources as they are often being updated.
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish 
> to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting 
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> Please follow these basic guidelines:
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> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or 
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> the membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital 
> B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be 
> removed from the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and 
> guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group 
> Owner and Moderators. See \ufffdGroup Topic, Rules and Guidelines\ufffd in the 
> Files section:
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>
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE 
> PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE \ufffdOWNER\ufffd 
> AND \ufffdMODERATORS\ufffd OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE 
> LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, 
> CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, 
> DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE 
> LOSSES (EVEN IF THE \ufffdOWNER\ufffd AND \ufffdMODERATORS\ufffd OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT 
> YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), 
> RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, 
> THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF 
> YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD 
> PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER 
> MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
>
>
>
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[Digital BW] Re: Best paper bargains?

2005-05-18 by Steven Karafyllakis

Best EEM price for letter-size is available at Buy.com. $12.05 a 
pack; if you buy over 25.00 worth the 'bargain' shipping is free, 
and usually takes only 3-4 days. Too bad they don't have bigger 
sizes.

Steve Karafyllakis


 --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Scott 
McLoughlin <scott@a...> wrote:
> Let us know how the Moab paper works out. I'll take a gander at 
Atlex.com
> to "recalibrate" my internal paper-pricing calculator :-)
> 
> Scott
> 
> tariqgibranstudio wrote:
> 
> > EEM in 13x19 50 sheet box is around $36 at Atlex.com whereas 
this 
> > stuff is over $100 for
> > 50 sheets so unless I'm missing something here, looks to cost 3 
times 
> > the price of EEM,
> > hardly what I would call "about the same". No doubt it's a fine 
paper 
> > though. I have also
> > been looking for a little nicer/thicker paper than EEM for close 
to 
> > the same price but in
> > Rolls. Just ordered some Moab Keyenta 205 dual sided so can 
proof on 
> > both sides. It runs
> > about $20-$30 more than EEM in 100 Ft rolls at 44 inches($139 
for EEM 
> > at Atlex vs. $159
> > Keyenta at Adorama or $169 at DTG with free shipping). Not 100% 
> > cotton, but Alpha
> > Cellulose acid free). If it's nice, the Moab Entrada which is 
100% 
> > Cotton uses the same
> > coating and supposedly prints the same.
> >
> > Tariq
> >
> >
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Scott 
McLoughlin 
> > <scott@a...>
> > wrote:
> > > Wow, certainly a good price for 50 sheets of 13x19. Thanks!
> > >
> > > Scott
> > >
> > > Andre wrote:
> > >
> > > > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Scott 
McLoughlin
> > > > > In 13x19, what papers might I consider balancing quality 
and value?
> > > > > Should I simply forgo cotton fiber papers if economy is a 
major
> > > > > consideration?
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks so much.
> > > > >
> > > > > Scott
> > > >
> > > > Scott,
> > > >
> > > > There is Premier Premium Matte which I now use to replace 
EEM. Cost
> > > > about the same, DMAX as good or better. Brighter finish than 
EEM. But
> > > > best of all, its a 100% cotton acid free.
> > > >
> > > > I also use PremierArt 325gms - Heavy Weight, coated 2 sides. 
100%
> > > > cotton, acid free, buffered. And no flaking. Has a warm look 
about it.
> > > >
> > > > http://www.photowarehouse.biz/premier.html
> > > >
> > > > Cheers,
> > > > André oreau
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other
> > > > resources as they are often being updated.
> > > >
> > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> > > >
> > > > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or 
you wish
> > > > to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by 
visiting
> > > > this same page.
> > > >
> > > > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > > > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier 
messages to
> > > > keep them short.
> > > > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks 
or
> > > > flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be 
removed 
> > from
> > > > the membership without notice.
> > > > - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of 
digital
> > > > B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts 
may be
> > > > removed from the membership.
> > > > - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group 
rules and
> > > > guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the 
group
> > > > Owner and Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and 
Guidelines" in the
> > > > Files section:
> > > > 
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
> > > >
> > > > BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL 
BW, THE
> > > > PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT 
THE 
> > "OWNER"
> > > > AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL 
NOT BE
> > > > LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL,
> > > > CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT 
LIMITED TO,
> > > > DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER 
INTANGIBLE
> > > > LOSSES (EVEN IF THE "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, 
THE PRINT
> > > > YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH 
DAMAGES),
> > > > RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE 
DIGITAL BW,
> > > > THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR 
ALTERATION OF
> > > > YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF 
ANY THIRD
> > > > PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY 
OTHER
> > > > MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > 
> > -----------------------------------------------------------------
-------
> > > > *Yahoo! Groups Links*
> > > >
> > > > * To visit your group on the web, go to:
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unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
> > subject=Unsubscribe>
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> > > > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
> > > >
> > > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other 
> > resources as they are often being updated.
> >
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> >
> > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you 
wish 
> > to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by 
visiting 
> > this same page.
> >
> > Please follow these basic guidelines:
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messages to 
> > keep them short.
> > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or 
> > flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be 
removed from 
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Re: [Digital BW] Re: Best paper bargains?

2005-05-18 by Peter De Smidt

Steven Karafyllakis wrote:

>Best EEM price for letter-size is available at Buy.com. $12.05 a 
>pack; if you buy over 25.00 worth the 'bargain' shipping is free, 
>and usually takes only 3-4 days. Too bad they don't have bigger 
>sizes.
>
>Steve Karafyllakis
>
>  
>
I've bought some stuff recently from Buy.com . I've gotten great prices 
and good service. I recommend them.

-Peter

[Digital BW] Re: Best paper bargains?

2005-05-18 by jymbo4600

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com,
"tariqgibranstudio" <tariqgibranstudio@y...> wrote:
> EEM in 13x19 50 sheet box is around $36 at Atlex.com whereas this
stuff is over $100 for 
> 50 sheets so unless I'm missing something here, looks to cost 3
times the price of EEM, 
> hardly what I would call "about the same".  No doubt it's a fine
paper though.  I have also 
> been looking for a little nicer/thicker paper than EEM for close to
the same price but in 
> Rolls.  Just ordered some Moab Keyenta 205 dual sided so can proof
on both sides.  It runs 
> about $20-$30 more than EEM in 100 Ft rolls at 44 inches($139 for
EEM at Atlex vs. $159 
> Keyenta at Adorama or $169 at DTG with free shipping).  Not 100%
cotton, but Alpha 
> Cellulose acid free).  If it's nice, the Moab Entrada which is 100%
Cotton uses the same 
> coating and supposedly prints the same.
> 
> Tariq
> 
> 
Tariq

I think you must be mixing up two different Premier Matte papers. If
you go to  Photowarehouse you will find the Premier Premium Matte in
13"x19" 50 sheet packs for $23.95. This is a dual sided paper so you
get 100 printable sides. I have the paper in 8 1/2" x 11" and it has
replaced EEM as my proof paper. Lovely Dmax and it's archival by all
accounts. The only problem I have had with it at all is the coating is
a bit dusty and my 2200 sometimes needs help grabbing it. Give it a
try and I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.

Best, Jim Weekes

[Digital BW] Re: Best paper bargains?

2005-05-18 by brucenorikane

"jymbo4600" <jymbo46@b...> wrote:
...

> I think you must be mixing up two different Premier Matte papers. If
> you go to  Photowarehouse you will find the Premier Premium Matte in
> 13"x19" 50 sheet packs for $23.95. This is a dual sided paper so you
> get 100 printable sides. I have the paper in 8 1/2" x 11" and it has
> replaced EEM as my proof paper. Lovely Dmax and it's archival by all
> accounts. The only problem I have had with it at all is the coating is
> a bit dusty and my 2200 sometimes needs help grabbing it. 

I think that's a common problem with 2-side coated papers.  I've had
several that coat the pickup rollers with white dust that has to be
cleaned off fairly frequently.

That's a great price on a paper like that.  I'll definitely try some
and dust off my roller cleaning stick.

Can you write on the back side with a regular ball point pen?  I often
use this type of paper for greeting cards and some coated stock won't
work.

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Best paper bargains?

2005-05-18 by Scott McLoughlin

The discription of this paper mentions "bright white proofs" or something
like that. Does this paper use OBA's ?

Scott

brucenorikane wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> "jymbo4600" <jymbo46@b...> wrote:
> ...
>
> > I think you must be mixing up two different Premier Matte papers. If
> > you go to Photowarehouse you will find the Premier Premium Matte in
> > 13"x19" 50 sheet packs for $23.95. This is a dual sided paper so you
> > get 100 printable sides. I have the paper in 8 1/2" x 11" and it has
> > replaced EEM as my proof paper. Lovely Dmax and it's archival by all
> > accounts. The only problem I have had with it at all is the coating is
> > a bit dusty and my 2200 sometimes needs help grabbing it.
>
> I think that's a common problem with 2-side coated papers. I've had
> several that coat the pickup rollers with white dust that has to be
> cleaned off fairly frequently.
>
> That's a great price on a paper like that. I'll definitely try some
> and dust off my roller cleaning stick.
>
> Can you write on the back side with a regular ball point pen? I often
> use this type of paper for greeting cards and some coated stock won't
> work.
>
>
>
>
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[Digital BW] Re: Best paper bargains?

2005-05-19 by brucenorikane

Paul mentioned "over the top OBA's" earlier in this thread.


 Scott McLoughlin <scott@a...> wrote:
> The discription of this paper mentions "bright white proofs" or
something
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> like that. Does this paper use OBA's ?
> 
> Scott
> 
> brucenorikane wrote:
> 
> > "jymbo4600" <jymbo46@b...> wrote:
> > ...
> >
> > > I think you must be mixing up two different Premier Matte papers. If
> > > you go to Photowarehouse you will find the Premier Premium Matte

[Digital BW] Re: Best paper bargains?

2005-05-19 by tariqgibranstudio

Thanks for setting me straight.  I was indeed looking at the more
expensive 100% cotton PremierArt 205 and not the Premier Premium
Matte.  The price you quote is for the really thin 110 but the 210 is
still very reasonable.  I will  have to give this a try as after going
back through the archives, I read some worrisome accounts of the Moab
Keyenta with regards to flaking and dust(so I canceled my order and
changed it to EEM).  I wonder if anyone else could coment on the dust
issue you mention with the Premier stuff.  

Tariq


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "jymbo4600"
<jymbo46@b...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com,
> "tariqgibranstudio" <tariqgibranstudio@y...> wrote:
> > EEM in 13x19 50 sheet box is around $36 at Atlex.com whereas this
> stuff is over $100 for 
> > 50 sheets so unless I'm missing something here, looks to cost 3
> times the price of EEM, 
> > hardly what I would call "about the same".  No doubt it's a fine
> paper though.  I have also 
> > been looking for a little nicer/thicker paper than EEM for close to
> the same price but in 
> > Rolls.  Just ordered some Moab Keyenta 205 dual sided so can proof
> on both sides.  It runs 
> > about $20-$30 more than EEM in 100 Ft rolls at 44 inches($139 for
> EEM at Atlex vs. $159 
> > Keyenta at Adorama or $169 at DTG with free shipping).  Not 100%
> cotton, but Alpha 
> > Cellulose acid free).  If it's nice, the Moab Entrada which is 100%
> Cotton uses the same 
> > coating and supposedly prints the same.
> > 
> > Tariq
> > 
> > 
> Tariq
> 
> I think you must be mixing up two different Premier Matte papers. If
> you go to  Photowarehouse you will find the Premier Premium Matte in
> 13"x19" 50 sheet packs for $23.95. This is a dual sided paper so you
> get 100 printable sides. I have the paper in 8 1/2" x 11" and it has
> replaced EEM as my proof paper. Lovely Dmax and it's archival by all
> accounts. The only problem I have had with it at all is the coating is
> a bit dusty and my 2200 sometimes needs help grabbing it. Give it a
> try and I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.
> 
> Best, Jim Weekes

RE: [Digital BW] Re: Best paper bargains?

2005-05-19 by Paul Roark

Tariq,


> ... after going
> back through the archives, I read some worrisome accounts of the Moab
> Keyenta with regards to flaking and dust(so I canceled my order and
> changed it to EEM).  I wonder if anyone else could coment on the dust
> issue you mention with the Premier stuff.
> 

I may not have had enough Premier Matte to have the feeding problems.  What
I saw was a relative lack of flaking.  I might add, however, that, in my
opinion, the dual coating is there in part to help with feed problems.  My
experiments with calcium carbonate, which is often used as the buffer in
papers, is that it will cause problems with the printer rollers.  I
speculate that a dual coating is part of a less expensive way to buffer
paper compared to other methods of controlling acidity.  (Also, I might add
that with dual coated papers, the convex side is often smoother.)

My main problem with the Premier Matte was the high OBAs and color.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

[Digital BW] Re: Best paper bargains?

2005-05-19 by tariqgibranstudio

Thanks very much Paul.  I think it was your account of Keyenta I read in the archives which 
mentioned dust and flaking issues(did you say it was the worst you had seen?).  In any 
case, the high OBA content of the Premier Matte might keep me from using it for any 
serious work but it still might be a decent replacement for EEM for some of the customers 
in my Print Business(Reproductions) who are are looking for very inexpensive alternatives 
to UltraSmooth and Hahnemule(which are my two favorites at the moment).  These 
customers have been getting EEM prints from a competitor and I was just looking to offer 
something better in that price range.

Tariq


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Roark" <paul.roark@v...> 
wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> Tariq,
> 
> 
> > ... after going
> > back through the archives, I read some worrisome accounts of the Moab
> > Keyenta with regards to flaking and dust(so I canceled my order and
> > changed it to EEM).  I wonder if anyone else could coment on the dust
> > issue you mention with the Premier stuff.
> > 
> 
> I may not have had enough Premier Matte to have the feeding problems.  What
> I saw was a relative lack of flaking.  I might add, however, that, in my
> opinion, the dual coating is there in part to help with feed problems.  My
> experiments with calcium carbonate, which is often used as the buffer in
> papers, is that it will cause problems with the printer rollers.  I
> speculate that a dual coating is part of a less expensive way to buffer
> paper compared to other methods of controlling acidity.  (Also, I might add
> that with dual coated papers, the convex side is often smoother.)
> 
> My main problem with the Premier Matte was the high OBAs and color.
> 
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com

Low Dmax SP11 & Epson 4000

2005-05-19 by John Custodio

Anybody using an Epson 4000 and Studio Print with
either PiezoTone Portfolio Black or Eboni Black on
Hahnemuehle Photo Rag? What kind of Dmax are you
getting?

I used to have an Epson 7000 and I was getting a Dmax
of around 1.74 on HPR with SP10 and PiezoTone
Portfolio Black. I recently changed to a 4000 and SP11
and can't get a Dmax higher than 1.6.

My 4000 has PiezoTone Selenium w/ Portfolio Black on
the left side (slots 1-4 Portfolio Black, Dark Gray,
Middle Gray and Light Gray in that order) and MIS FSN 
on the right side (slots 5-8 Eboni, Dark Gray, Middle
Gray, Light Gray in that order). These are hand loaded
carts. 

Two print environments are set up in SP11: 

PiezoTone with ink assignments for slots 1-4: black
(the matte black position), light black, light black
2, light black 3 in that order. Paper config is set to
Matte. 

FSN with ink assignments for slots 5-8: black (the
photo black position), light black, light black 2,
light black 3 in that order. Paper config is set to
Photo.

I'm certain the correct inks are in the indicated
carts. I can verify this by performing a "Print Ink
Assignment" under the ink assignment tab. This prints
a patch of the maximum ink in each channel.  8 patches
are printed, one for each channel. The patches printed
from left to right (slots 1-8) are black, a lighter
gray, still lighter gray, even still lighter gray
indicating the PiezoTone black, dark gray, middle gray
and light gray. Patch 5 corresponding to the Eboni in
slot 5 Photo Black position doesn't print. (This may
be a bug in SP). Patches 6-8 are a gray, lighter gray,
still lighter gray indicating the FSN dark gray,
middle gray, and light gray.

I have an Eye One spectrophotometer that I use for
density measurments.

Printiing a density adjustment target on HPR  using
$StandHiRes.pdn I get a Dmax in the last step of of
the target of between 1.59 and 1.61. Step 59 of the 60
steps printed is about 1.39, so there is a big jump
from step 59 to 60. I never saw this using SP10 on the
7000.  The space between the last steps was usually
.01 or .02. In addition, the black boxes which precede
each line are reading about 1.59. The Dmax should be
at or about 1.74. I get the same results from the
PiezoTone set as well as from the FSN set.

To find out whether or not there is a problem with the
printer or the ink, I made two prints of a grayscale
from Photoshop using the Epson driver printing black
only. One with a matte paper setting (thus using the
Portfolio Black which is located in the matte black
position) and the other with a photo paper setting
(thus using the Eboni Black which is located in the
Photo Black position). Measuring the 100% patch on the
grayscale I got 1.61 for the matte paper setting and
1.73 (which is what I would expect!) for the photo
paper setting. I suspect the difference is due to the
ink limit Epson has in their print driver for the 4000
when using a matte paper setting, (which was reported
in this forum maybe a week or two ago). This shows
that the printer/paper/ink combination is cabable of
reaching 1.73 - but only the Epson driver with the
photo paper setting is cabable of producing it.

Does anyone have any idea what's going on here?

-John




		
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