Digital BW, The Print

Tyler:  I agree with your sentiment about looking at the beauty of the print etc. but the 
statements about Dmax indicate a misunderstanding of the term.  Looking at the other 
replies it looks that you are not alone.

The dictionary of film and digital Photography defines Dmax as follows:
"Dmax: Maximum Density.  The most dense area that a medium or image capturing device can 
record."
Matt papers along with matte black ink can record the densest blacks, much more so than 
glossy prints.  Which paper has the greater Dmax?   What I think you meant is that the 
dynamic range of glossy exceeds that of matte.  Glossy papers do have a greater dynamic 
range and are capable of greater separation of tones than matte.

Some here might argue that the numbers do not matter that the image is everything.  This 
is not right either, bad numbers can lead to a poor image.  An overexposed film will lack 
the richness of tones that a properly exposed film will have.  That said, the numbers 
alone do not define the pictorial quality of the image but that is no reason to ignore 
them.  Knowing the numbers and knowing how to get them give the talented photographer 
greater power, the means to an end.  Yet, the best tools are no assurance of artistic 
success.

Julio Fernandez

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Steve Kale
<stevekale@b...> wrote:

High dmax has never been one of the attributes of matte surface art,
when strictly compared to glossy photo prints. "Beautiful" blacks, on
the other hand, are and have been.

Hello Julio,

>I agree with your sentiment about looking at the beauty of the 
>print etc. but the statements about Dmax indicate a 
>misunderstanding of the term.  

>Knowing the numbers and knowing how to get them give the 
>talented photographer greater power, the means to an end.  
>Yet, the best tools are no assurance of artistic success.

PMFJI - Excellent points and all worth repeating, but I believe you
missed what Tyler was trying to say.  I think he knows very well what
Dmax means technically, and has as good a grasp on the numbers as
anyone here.  But I don't think that's what he was talking about.  


Regards,
Clayton


Info on black and white digital printing at    
http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm

Julio Fernanadez wrote, re a perceived misunderstanding of the 
term "D-Max":

<<The dictionary of film and digital Photography defines Dmax as 
follows:
"Dmax: Maximum Density. The most dense area that a medium or image 
capturing device can record."
Matt papers along with matte black ink can record the densest blacks, 
much more so than glossy prints. Which paper has the greater Dmax? 
What I think you meant is that the dynamic range of glossy exceeds 
that of matte. Glossy papers do have a greater dynamic range and are 
capable of greater separation of tones than matte.>>

Glossy paper generally has deeper blacks  - ie greater maximum
optical density or "D-Max" - than matte paper and therefore, as
Julio points out, greater 'dynamic range' (probably better called
'density range' in this case, where density range = D-Max -
D-Min). 
So where is the misunderstanding?

The quoted dictionary definition appears to be inadequate at best, but
that's another issue - or is it the source of the
'misunderstanding'?

Thanks,
Helen

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "JULIO FERNANDEZ"
<gluemax@s...> wrote:
....
> Matt papers along with matte black ink can record the densest
blacks, much more so than 
> glossy prints...

hmm...

Tyler

Yep, ahmmmm....

> From: Tyler Boley <tyler@...>
> Reply-To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 17:06:31 -0000
> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: [Digital BW] Re: Ink Jet prints DO the trick
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "JULIO FERNANDEZ"
> <gluemax@s...> wrote:
> ....
>> Matt papers along with matte black ink can record the densest
> blacks, much more so than
>> glossy prints...
> 
> hmm...
> 
> Tyler
>