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Epson Matte Paper Heavyweight compared to Epson EEM ??

Epson Matte Paper Heavyweight compared to Epson EEM ??

2005-08-06 by Tony Bonanno

Hi group,

Just picked up some Epson Matte Paper Heavyweight. Doing a quick
comparison print (with QTR B&W), I don't see much difference from
Epson Enhanced Matte.  Looking at the Wilhelm site, the Heavyweight
matte appears to have very good archival properties.  

Those of you in the know, help me out.  What am I missing about this
Heavyweight matte paper ???  Couldn't find much on the Epson site.

It is much more economical than EEM.  

Thanks,

Tony

RE: [Digital BW] Epson Matte Paper Heavyweight compared to Epson EEM ??

2005-08-06 by Paul Roark

> ... the Heavyweight
> matte appears to have very good archival properties.
> 

I think it is acidic also -- apparently better than EEM, but still probably
not "acid free" and truly "archival."  If I had a small piece I'd test it
with an acid test pen.

My memory is that EEM has a slight edge in terms of dmax, and EEM is a bit
thicker. 

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

Re: Epson Matte Paper Heavyweight compared to Epson EEM ??

2005-08-06 by John Vitollo

> Just picked up some Epson Matte Paper Heavyweight. Doing a quick
> comparison print (with QTR B&W), I don't see much difference from
> Epson Enhanced Matte.  Looking at the Wilhelm site, the Heavyweight
> matte appears to have very good archival properties.   
> Tony

Isn't Heavyweight Matte used with dye inks like the 1280, while EEM are for the UltraChrome 
Pigment inks?

Re: [Digital BW] Epson Matte Paper Heavyweight compared to Epson EEM ??

2005-08-06 by Elwood Spedden

Tony

You need to be careful. If you look at the Wilhelm
site, under either the 4000 or 9600, they state that
the permanence of EEM is right up there with HPR! I
posted this fact on the thread some weeks back and was
brought up short by Clayton who pointed out that,
regardless of the Wilhem data, EEM turns yellow very
quickly in the presence of sunlight and is unsuitable
for sale of fine art prints. I don't know the
specifics of heavyweight, but my point is only to warn
that the Wilhelm data may not tell the whole story.

Regards
Woody Spedden
--- Tony Bonanno <tbonanno-ranger2004@...>
wrote:


---------------------------------
Hi group,

Just picked up some Epson Matte Paper Heavyweight.
Doing a quick
comparison print (with QTR B&W), I don't see much
difference from
Epson Enhanced Matte.  Looking at the Wilhelm site,
the Heavyweight
matte appears to have very good archival properties.  

Those of you in the know, help me out.  What am I
missing about this
Heavyweight matte paper ???  Couldn't find much on the
Epson site.

It is much more economical than EEM.  

Thanks,

Tony





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Re: [Digital BW] Epson Matte Paper Heavyweight compared to Epson EEM ??

2005-08-06 by Tony Bonanno

Hi Paul, John, Elwood,

HMMM, very interesting.  Found some conflicting information regarding
suitability for pigment.  Latest info on Epson site shows it
recommended for R2400 (K3 pigment inks) in certain sizes and the R1800
and R800 Gloss pigment ink set.  But no mention of the 4000 or 4800
???? Seems weird that it would be okay with the 2400, but not the
standard UC ink set.  

I'm only using the paper with for B&W with QTR and BO prints, and so
far it looks quite good.  Guess I'll keep experimenting.  Certainly
seems like a no-brainer substitute for EEM for proofing, but as Elwood
points out, caution advised for sales prints.

Thanks guys,

Tony

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Elwood Spedden
<elwood@w...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> Tony
> 
> You need to be careful. If you look at the Wilhelm
> site, under either the 4000 or 9600, they state that
> the permanence of EEM is right up there with HPR! I
> posted this fact on the thread some weeks back and was
> brought up short by Clayton who pointed out that,
> regardless of the Wilhem data, EEM turns yellow very
> quickly in the presence of sunlight and is unsuitable
> for sale of fine art prints. I don't know the
> specifics of heavyweight, but my point is only to warn
> that the Wilhelm data may not tell the whole story.
> 
> Regards
> Woody Spedden
> --- Tony Bonanno <tbonanno-ranger2004@m...>
> wrote:
> 
> 
> ---------------------------------
> Hi group,
> 
> Just picked up some Epson Matte Paper Heavyweight.
> Doing a quick
> comparison print (with QTR B&W), I don't see much
> difference from
> Epson Enhanced Matte.  Looking at the Wilhelm site,
> the Heavyweight
> matte appears to have very good archival properties.  
> 
> Those of you in the know, help me out.  What am I
> missing about this
> Heavyweight matte paper ???  Couldn't find much on the
> Epson site.
> 
> It is much more economical than EEM.  
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Tony
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files,
> and other resources as they are often being updated.
> 
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> 
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily
> digest, or you wish to unsubscribe, please edit your
> Membership preferences by visiting this same page.
> 
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of
> earlier messages to keep them short.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal
> attacks or flames. Hostile, aggressive or
> argumentative users may be removed from the membership
> without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group
> topic of digital B&W printing. Users who persistently
> make off-topic posts may be removed from the
> membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the
> group rules and guidelines, and to abide by the
> actions and decisions of the group Owner and
> Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines" in
> the Files section:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
> 
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE
> DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY
> UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS"
> OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE
> LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL,
> SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING
> BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS,
> GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN
> IF THE  "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE
> PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY
> OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE
> INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO
> GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF
> YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR
> CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE
> PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING
> TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> 
> 
>   
>     
> ---------------------------------
>   YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
> 
>   
>     Visit your group "DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint" on
> the web.
>    
>     To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> 
> DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>    
>     Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
> Terms of Service.
> 
>   
> ---------------------------------

Re: [Digital BW] Epson Matte Paper Heavyweight compared to Epson EEM ??

2005-08-06 by john dean

IF you want a decent paper in this aprox price range try Innova Fiba
print, its better and thicker.

john




--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Tony Bonanno"
<tbonanno-ranger2004@m...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> Hi Paul, John, Elwood,
> 
> HMMM, very interesting.  Found some conflicting information regarding
> suitability for pigment.  Latest info on Epson site shows it
> recommended for R2400 (K3 pigment inks) in certain sizes and the R1800
> and R800 Gloss pigment ink set.  But no mention of the 4000 or 4800
> ???? Seems weird that it would be okay with the 2400, but not the
> standard UC ink set.  
> 
> I'm only using the paper with for B&W with QTR and BO prints, and so
> far it looks quite good.  Guess I'll keep experimenting.  Certainly
> seems like a no-brainer substitute for EEM for proofing, but as Elwood
> points out, caution advised for sales prints.
> 
> Thanks guys,
> 
> Tony
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Elwood Spedden
> <elwood@w...> wrote:
> > Tony
> > 
> > You need to be careful. If you look at the Wilhelm
> > site, under either the 4000 or 9600, they state that
> > the permanence of EEM is right up there with HPR! I
> > posted this fact on the thread some weeks back and was
> > brought up short by Clayton who pointed out that,
> > regardless of the Wilhem data, EEM turns yellow very
> > quickly in the presence of sunlight and is unsuitable
> > for sale of fine art prints. I don't know the
> > specifics of heavyweight, but my point is only to warn
> > that the Wilhelm data may not tell the whole story.
> > 
> > Regards
> > Woody Spedden
> > --- Tony Bonanno <tbonanno-ranger2004@m...>
> > wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > ---------------------------------
> > Hi group,
> > 
> > Just picked up some Epson Matte Paper Heavyweight.
> > Doing a quick
> > comparison print (with QTR B&W), I don't see much
> > difference from
> > Epson Enhanced Matte.  Looking at the Wilhelm site,
> > the Heavyweight
> > matte appears to have very good archival properties.  
> > 
> > Those of you in the know, help me out.  What am I
> > missing about this
> > Heavyweight matte paper ???  Couldn't find much on the
> > Epson site.
> > 
> > It is much more economical than EEM.  
> > 
> > Thanks,
> > 
> > Tony
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files,
> > and other resources as they are often being updated.
> > 
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> > 
> > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily
> > digest, or you wish to unsubscribe, please edit your
> > Membership preferences by visiting this same page.
> > 
> > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of
> > earlier messages to keep them short.
> > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal
> > attacks or flames. Hostile, aggressive or
> > argumentative users may be removed from the membership
> > without notice.
> > - Keep your posts and threads related to the group
> > topic of digital B&W printing. Users who persistently
> > make off-topic posts may be removed from the
> > membership.
> > - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the
> > group rules and guidelines, and to abide by the
> > actions and decisions of the group Owner and
> > Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines" in
> > the Files section:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
> > 
> > BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE
> > DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY
> > UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS"
> > OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE
> > LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL,
> > SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING
> > BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS,
> > GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN
> > IF THE  "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE
> > PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY
> > OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE
> > INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO
> > GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF
> > YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR
> > CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE
> > PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING
> > TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> > 
> > 
> >   
> >     
> > ---------------------------------
> >   YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
> > 
> >   
> >     Visit your group "DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint" on
> > the web.
> >    
> >     To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > 
> > DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> >    
> >     Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
> > Terms of Service.
> > 
> >   
> > ---------------------------------

Re: [Digital BW] Epson Matte Paper Heavyweight compared to Epson EEM ??

2005-10-30 by Sam McCandless

At 7:02 PM +0000 8/6/05, Tony Bonanno wrote:
>[snip]
>
>Just picked up some Epson Matte Paper Heavyweight. Doing a quick
>comparison print (with QTR B&W), I don't see much difference from
>Epson Enhanced Matte.  Looking at the Wilhelm site, the Heavyweight
>matte appears to have very good archival properties. 
>
>Those of you in the know, help me out.  What am I missing about this
>Heavyweight matte paper ???  Couldn't find much on the Epson site.
>
>It is much more economical than EEM.
>
>[snip]

A few years back, Tony, I believe EMPH was offered and promoted for 
use with Epson's dye-based ink set. While their Archival Matte, as it 
was then called, was said to be better for pigment-based inks, which 
I think might then have actually been hybrid, pigment- and dye-based, 
at least in the case of the K (to make it more black). But of course 
Archival Matte wasn't really archival. And under fire on that score, 
Epson changed its name to Enhanced Matte. I was never clear on 
whether and if so how the paper was changed, but I think I remember 
EEM having a slightly different weight, as well as a more defensible 
name.

Heavyweight Matte, I don't remember changing. I think it might still 
be recommended only for the dye-based inks, but perhaps only because 
EEM's coating is thought to be better for the pigmented inks. Both of 
these matte papers have, I believe, been used mostly for proofs. And 
I think EAM/EEH has gotten more use than EMPH partly because prints 
on EEM better mimic a final, show-and-sell version on more expensive 
paper which might really be archival, at least with pigment inks.

But EMPH might have changed without my noticing: I was surprised to 
see you say it has very good archival properties and that it's much 
more economical than EEM. Then I'd think it would have a lot of uses, 
and I need to do my homework on it. So I hope you'll post about your 
experience with it.
--
Sam

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