Yahoo Groups archive

Digital BW, The Print

Index last updated: 2026-04-28 22:56 UTC

Thread

FAQ? HP 8750 vs. Epson R2400 for B&W

FAQ? HP 8750 vs. Epson R2400 for B&W

2005-09-04 by Richard

I have a 1280 for 4+ years now, for large size color prints. Last year I 
bought a refurbished HP 7960 for 8x10 B&W and indeed it is stunning.

I am looking into getting a wide format printer solely for larger B&W. The 
1280 still works fine (albeit it clogs like mad) for color. Is there an 
opinion whether the 8750 or the R2400 is better for B&W work? I would use 
both glossy and matt fine arts paper.

Thanks.

// richard (This email is for mailing lists. To reach me directly, please 
use richard at imagecraft.com)

RE: [Digital BW] FAQ? HP 8750 vs. Epson R2400 for B&W

2005-09-05 by Paul Roark

The HP 8750 gets impressive Wilhelm ratings for a dye printer, but dyes have
to be on special swellable emulsion paper to achieve these 100+ year
ratings.  On rag paper, they will, I believe, be very bad.  Even on the
swellable paper, I fade tested the HP B&W inks and, while good for dyes,
they were not in the same class with the carbon pigments that were in that
same test.  So, especially if you intend to print on matte, rag paper, the
pigments of the Epson 2400 would be the better choice, in my view.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com 
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> -----Original Message-----
> From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Richard
> Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 3:13 AM
> To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Digital BW] FAQ? HP 8750 vs. Epson R2400 for B&W
> 
> I have a 1280 for 4+ years now, for large size color prints. Last year I
> bought a refurbished HP 7960 for 8x10 B&W and indeed it is stunning.
> 
> I am looking into getting a wide format printer solely for larger B&W. The
> 1280 still works fine (albeit it clogs like mad) for color. Is there an
> opinion whether the 8750 or the R2400 is better for B&W work? I would use
> both glossy and matt fine arts paper.
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> // richard (This email is for mailing lists. To reach me directly, please
> use richard at imagecraft.com)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as
> they are often being updated.
> 
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> 
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
> unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same
> page.
> 
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
> them short.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames.
> Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
> membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W
> printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from
> the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and
> guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner
> and Moderators. See Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines in the Files
> section:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
> 
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
> YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE OWNER AND
> MODERATORS OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO
> YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR
> EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF
> PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE
> OWNER AND MODERATORS OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN
> ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE
> OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii)
> UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii)
> STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
> YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE
> PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
> 
>

Re: [Digital BW] FAQ? HP 8750 vs. Epson R2400 for B&W

2005-09-05 by Mark Hahn

I recently hung some work from my 7660 and two 8x12" prints (hinged 
behind 8-ply mats) popped up and adhered to the glass:(  I fear 
larger prints would be worse on this paper.  

mark

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Roark" 
<paul.roark@v...> wrote:
> The HP 8750 gets impressive Wilhelm ratings for a dye printer, but 
dyes have
> to be on special swellable emulsion paper to achieve these 100+ year
> ratings.  On rag paper, they will, I believe, be very bad.  Even on 
the
> swellable paper, I fade tested the HP B&W inks and, while good for 
dyes,
> they were not in the same class with the carbon pigments that were 
in that
> same test.  So, especially if you intend to print on matte, rag 
paper, the
> pigments of the Epson 2400 would be the better choice, in my view.
> 
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com 
> 
> 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> > [mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf 
Of Richard
> > Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 3:13 AM
> > To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: [Digital BW] FAQ? HP 8750 vs. Epson R2400 for B&W
> > 
> > I have a 1280 for 4+ years now, for large size color prints. Last 
year I
> > bought a refurbished HP 7960 for 8x10 B&W and indeed it is 
stunning.
> > 
> > I am looking into getting a wide format printer solely for larger 
B&W. The
> > 1280 still works fine (albeit it clogs like mad) for color. Is 
there an
> > opinion whether the 8750 or the R2400 is better for B&W work? I 
would use
> > both glossy and matt fine arts paper.
> > 
> > Thanks.
> > 
> > // richard (This email is for mailing lists. To reach me 
directly, please
> > use richard at imagecraft.com)
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other 
resources as
> > they are often being updated.
> > 
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> > 
> > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you 
wish to
> > unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting 
this same
> > page.
> > 
> > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier 
messages to keep
> > them short.
> > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or 
flames.
> > Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
> > membership without notice.
> > - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of 
digital B&W
> > printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be 
removed from
> > the membership.
> > - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules 
and
> > guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the 
group Owner
> > and Moderators. See Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines in the 
Files
> > section:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
> > 
> > BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, 
THE PRINT
> > YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE OWNER 
AND
> > MODERATORS OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE 
LIABLE TO
> > YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL 
OR
> > EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS 
OF
> > PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF 
THE
> > OWNER AND MODERATORS OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP 
HAVE BEEN
> > ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) 
THE USE
> > OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; 
(ii)
> > UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR 
DATA; (iii)
> > STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE 
PRINT
> > YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, 
THE
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> > PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> > 
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >

Re: FAQ? HP 8750 vs. Epson R2400 for B&W

2005-09-06 by dailydonut2000

Richard,
     I think you have answered your own question,and it is a move I 
also will be making. Yes,the HP does a much better job of printing 
B&W,and you (we) can say goodby to clogged heads and wasteful 
cleaning cycles. The 8750 should do as good a job as the smaller HP 
as it uses the same Photo Gray setup. As long as the HP paper is 
used, the prints should last a real long time. And since the prints 
aren't made using color inks there will be no color shifts, since 
there is no color to begin with. I think all these people using 
color inks to get B&W images are going to be in for a nasty surprise 
later,though how much later is anyone's guess. The only negative 
that I see is that the paper selection is much more limited using 
the HP printers vs the Epsons, but since the images are,to me,much 
better,who cares? I am really looking forward to this move. If I am 
concerned with the print stability decades from now I will just give 
the buyer the file. Years from now the equipment and inks will 
surely be even better than they are today, and then the buyer can 
either sub the print out to a lab or print it her/himself. My images 
are really good,but they ain't going to be in MOMA,and neither are 
99% of the images out there. So if a buyer were to get sneaky and 
print up a bunch of the images,human nature being what it is,that is 
their ethical screw up. In these days of digital reproduction, 
anyone can duplicate pretty much anything at anytime. The idea is 
that you shouldn't,and I am content to let it go at that. As far as 
the prints warping, frame and mat anything wrong and you will have 
problems.Steve.








--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Richard 
<richard-lists@i...> wrote:
> I have a 1280 for 4+ years now, for large size color prints. Last 
year I 
> bought a refurbished HP 7960 for 8x10 B&W and indeed it is 
stunning.
> 
> I am looking into getting a wide format printer solely for larger 
B&W. The 
> 1280 still works fine (albeit it clogs like mad) for color. Is 
there an 
> opinion whether the 8750 or the R2400 is better for B&W work? I 
would use 
> both glossy and matt fine arts paper.
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> // richard (This email is for mailing lists. To reach me directly, 
please 
> use richard at imagecraft.com)

Re: FAQ? HP 8750 vs. Epson R2400 for B&W

2005-09-07 by bghess_sp

I used to have an HP 7960 myself and was impressed with the B&W
quality. I then went to a Epson 2200 using MIS inks and was also
impressed. I now have an Epson 4800 (bigger brother to the 2400) and
it blows them all away. I think the Epson B&W prints outperform
everything else so far, even the completely nuetral HP prints.  Just
my opinion.

Ben

Re: FAQ? HP 8750 vs. Epson R2400 for B&W

2005-09-08 by Mark Hahn

ok, I was the one who mentioned HP Premium Plus Glossy puckering up and 
contacting the glass when hinged behind an 8-ply museum mat.  If a 
traditional archival hinged mat sandwich is the wrong way to mount this 
paper, what are you saying is the right way to do it?

mark

...
> As far as 
> the prints warping, frame and mat anything wrong and you will have 
> problems.Steve.
...

Move to quarantaine

This moves the raw source file on disk only. The archive index is not changed automatically, so you still need to run a manual refresh afterward.