Digital BW, The Print

I've noticed the same thing. It is much worse when the image first comes off
the printer, and seems to get better after a day or so. Running a custom
profile will help quite a bit.

>   After doing some reading, I decided to go with 250
> gsm Museo for my final sellable/exhibition prints.
> However, after making some prints with my sample pack,
> I noticed a sort of "water color" edge on some parts
> of the print.  Basically, anywhere the image quickly
> changed tone from light to dark, a very distinct hard
> line appeared, like a water color filter had been
> applied.
>   I'm using MIS pigs on a 1270 w/ NMC CIS on a PC &
> PS6.  I tried printing w/ different media settings,
> with the paper thickness switch set to +&0, with a
> profile, w/out a profile, but it kept printing the
> hard edge.  The same image on Epson Archival Matte
> prints fine.  BTW, I'm printing with "no color
> adjustment" checked.  I also did some print head
> alignments to no avail.
>   Has anyone experienced this with Museo?  Am I being
> too picky? (it's small, but still noticeable w/out a
> loupe) Or is this just a characteristic of cotton
> paper, yet another "trade off" for longevity?
>   I've posted my scanned prints here:
> http://www.tronicart.com/inks/museo.html
>   Any suggestions are greatly appreciated.  If I can't
> get this fixed, I'll try another paper.  Any
> suggestions for a rag paper free of optical righteners
> and available in 13x19, if possible?
>   Thanks for the help!

In a message dated 1/6/02 10:49:32 PM Eastern Standard Time, 
tronicart@... writes:

<< http://www.tronicart.com/inks/museo.html >>
Daniel, this will sound crazy, bit I was getting a similar effect when 
printing with the MIS pigs thu a CIS on LPM and Somerset enhanced.  The 
problem stopped with I went back to MIS Dyes.  I was using a 1280.
Thats one of the reasons I went back to DYES.
For what its worth???
David

Are those both cotton papers?  Museo is the only rag
paper I've tried, but I'm hoping there's at least one
out there that doesn't exhibit this effect (w/pigs).
  As an update, I printed a b&w image on Museo w/ my
MIS VM inks on my 1280 and saw the same thing.  Again,
the same image printed great on EAM. 
  Is Epson Archival Matte just too high of a standard
for comparing rag paper image quality?
  What paper measures up?  

 -Daniel

--- daschkenas@... wrote:
> In a message dated 1/6/02 10:49:32 PM Eastern
> Standard Time, 
> tronicart@... writes:
> 
> << http://www.tronicart.com/inks/museo.html >>
> Daniel, this will sound crazy, bit I was getting a
> similar effect when 
> printing with the MIS pigs thu a CIS on LPM and
> Somerset enhanced.  The 
> problem stopped with I went back to MIS Dyes.  I was
> using a 1280.
> Thats one of the reasons I went back to DYES.
> For what its worth???
> David
> 
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> 
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EAM is ok as a proofing paper but that is about it. Photorag probably gives
you the best blacks and tyonal balance that you can get. I've used it with
Piezo pigs and FS pigs and have no problems.

Julian
----- Original Message -----
From: "Daniel Perez" <tronicart@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, January 07, 2002 5:51 PM
Subject: Re: [Digital BW] MUSEO printing out watercolor edge ??


>   Are those both cotton papers?  Museo is the only rag
> paper I've tried, but I'm hoping there's at least one
> out there that doesn't exhibit this effect (w/pigs).
>   As an update, I printed a b&w image on Museo w/ my
> MIS VM inks on my 1280 and saw the same thing.  Again,
> the same image printed great on EAM.
>   Is Epson Archival Matte just too high of a standard
> for comparing rag paper image quality?
>   What paper measures up?
>
>  -Daniel
>
> --- daschkenas@... wrote:
> > In a message dated 1/6/02 10:49:32 PM Eastern
> > Standard Time,
> > tronicart@... writes:
> >
> > << http://www.tronicart.com/inks/museo.html >>
> > Daniel, this will sound crazy, bit I was getting a
> > similar effect when
> > printing with the MIS pigs thu a CIS on LPM and
> > Somerset enhanced.  The
> > problem stopped with I went back to MIS Dyes.  I was
> > using a 1280.
> > Thats one of the reasons I went back to DYES.
> > For what its worth???
> > David
> >
> > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> >
> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files,
> > Bookmarks, Polls and other resources as they are
> > often being updated. The page is at:
> >
> >
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> >
> > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > - Include your full name with your message.
> > - Include the address of your website, if you have
> > one.
> > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of
> > earlier messages to keep them short.
> > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to
> > change the subject header.
> > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal
> > attacks or "flames."
> > - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> > - Before posting a question, search the message
> > archives and the various resources on the homepage.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Send FREE video emails in Yahoo! Mail!
> http://promo.yahoo.com/videomail/
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and
other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - Include your full name with your message.
> - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
them short.
> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject header.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or "flames."
> - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the various
resources on the homepage.

>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>

Hahnemuller (sic) Photo Rag in either weight 0r the slightly cheaper renamed
packs from other suppliers.

I barely needed to adjust my VM curves on an 1160.

Superb paper - love it.

Tim A

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Daniel Perez [mailto:tronicart@...]
> Sent: January 7, 2002 9:51 AM
> To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [Digital BW] MUSEO printing out watercolor edge ??
>
>
>   Are those both cotton papers?  Museo is the only rag
> paper I've tried, but I'm hoping there's at least one
> out there that doesn't exhibit this effect (w/pigs).
>   As an update, I printed a b&w image on Museo w/ my
> MIS VM inks on my 1280 and saw the same thing.  Again,
> the same image printed great on EAM.
>   Is Epson Archival Matte just too high of a standard
> for comparing rag paper image quality?
>   What paper measures up?
>
>  -Daniel
>
> --- daschkenas@... wrote:
> > In a message dated 1/6/02 10:49:32 PM Eastern
> > Standard Time,
> > tronicart@... writes:
> >
> > << http://www.tronicart.com/inks/museo.html >>
> > Daniel, this will sound crazy, bit I was getting a
> > similar effect when
> > printing with the MIS pigs thu a CIS on LPM and
> > Somerset enhanced.  The
> > problem stopped with I went back to MIS Dyes.  I was
> > using a 1280.
> > Thats one of the reasons I went back to DYES.
> > For what its worth???
> > David
> >
> > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> >
> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files,
> > Bookmarks, Polls and other resources as they are
> > often being updated. The page is at:
> >
> >
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> >
> > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > - Include your full name with your message.
> > - Include the address of your website, if you have
> > one.
> > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of
> > earlier messages to keep them short.
> > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to
> > change the subject header.
> > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal
> > attacks or "flames."
> > - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> > - Before posting a question, search the message
> > archives and the various resources on the homepage.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Send FREE video emails in Yahoo! Mail!
> http://promo.yahoo.com/videomail/
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks,
> Polls and other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - Include your full name with your message.
> - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier
> messages to keep them short.
> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject header.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or "flames."
> - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the
> various resources on the homepage.
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

Daniel,
I suggest you write directly to Robert Rex of Crane papers.  He is a very nice, helpful, and knowledgeable
guy. If he does not personally know the answer, he usually goes to the techies at Crane to get it.

I believe he monitors this list, but his direct email address is:  chameleon@...

Hope this helps.

Harvey Ferdschneider
Partner, SKID Photography, NYC


>  (cross posted)
> Hello list,
>   After doing some reading, I decided to go with 250
> gsm Museo for my final sellable/exhibition prints.
> However, after making some prints with my sample pack,
> I noticed a sort of "water color" edge on some parts
> of the print.  Basically, anywhere the image quickly
> changed tone from light to dark, a very distinct hard
> line appeared, like a water color filter had been
> applied.
>   I'm using MIS pigs on a 1270 w/ NMC CIS on a PC &
> PS6.  I tried printing w/ different media settings,
> with the paper thickness switch set to +&0, with a
> profile, w/out a profile, but it kept printing the
> hard edge.  The same image on Epson Archival Matte
> prints fine.  BTW, I'm printing with "no color
> adjustment" checked.  I also did some print head
> alignments to no avail.
>   Has anyone experienced this with Museo?  Am I being
> too picky? (it's small, but still noticeable w/out a
> loupe) Or is this just a characteristic of cotton
> paper, yet another "trade off" for longevity?
>   I've posted my scanned prints here:
> http://www.tronicart.com/inks/museo.html
>   Any suggestions are greatly appreciated.  If I can't
> get this fixed, I'll try another paper.  Any
> suggestions for a rag paper free of optical righteners
> and available in 13x19, if possible?
>   Thanks for the help!
>
> -Daniel Perez
>





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Anyone know where I can pick up a sample pack of
Hahnemuhle PhotoRag?  How heavy is it?
Thanks again for the help.
 -Daniel
Also, does it come in 13x19?

--- Tim Atherton <timphoto@...> wrote:
> Hahnemuller (sic) Photo Rag in either weight 0r the
> slightly cheaper renamed
> packs from other suppliers.
> 
> I barely needed to adjust my VM curves on an 1160.
> 
> Superb paper - love it.
> 
> Tim A
> 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Daniel Perez [mailto:tronicart@...]
> > Sent: January 7, 2002 9:51 AM
> > To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: Re: [Digital BW] MUSEO printing out
> watercolor edge ??
> >
> >
> >   Are those both cotton papers?  Museo is the only
> rag
> > paper I've tried, but I'm hoping there's at least
> one
> > out there that doesn't exhibit this effect
> (w/pigs).
> >   As an update, I printed a b&w image on Museo w/
> my
> > MIS VM inks on my 1280 and saw the same thing. 
> Again,
> > the same image printed great on EAM.
> >   Is Epson Archival Matte just too high of a
> standard
> > for comparing rag paper image quality?
> >   What paper measures up?
> >
> >  -Daniel
> >
> > --- daschkenas@... wrote:
> > > In a message dated 1/6/02 10:49:32 PM Eastern
> > > Standard Time,
> > > tronicart@... writes:
> > >
> > > << http://www.tronicart.com/inks/museo.html >>
> > > Daniel, this will sound crazy, bit I was getting
> a
> > > similar effect when
> > > printing with the MIS pigs thu a CIS on LPM and
> > > Somerset enhanced.  The
> > > problem stopped with I went back to MIS Dyes.  I
> was
> > > using a 1280.
> > > Thats one of the reasons I went back to DYES.
> > > For what its worth???
> > > David
> > >
> > > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> > >
> > > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the
> Files,
> > > Bookmarks, Polls and other resources as they are
> > > often being updated. The page is at:
> > >
> > >
> >
>
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> > >
> > > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > > - Include your full name with your message.
> > > - Include the address of your website, if you
> have
> > > one.
> > > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions
> of
> > > earlier messages to keep them short.
> > > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to
> > > change the subject header.
> > > - Good manners are required at all time. No
> personal
> > > attacks or "flames."
> > > - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> > > - Before posting a question, search the message
> > > archives and the various resources on the
> homepage.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> > > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do You Yahoo!?
> > Send FREE video emails in Yahoo! Mail!
> > http://promo.yahoo.com/videomail/
> >
> >
> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the
> Files, Bookmarks,
> > Polls and other resources as they are often being
> updated. The page is at:
> >
> >
>
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> >
> > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > - Include your full name with your message.
> > - Include the address of your website, if you have
> one.
> > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of
> earlier
> > messages to keep them short.
> > - As the topic of a thread changes remember to
> change the subject header.
> > - Good manners are required at all time. No
> personal attacks or "flames."
> > - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> > - Before posting a question, search the message
> archives and the
> > various resources on the homepage.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
> 
> 
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> 
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files,
> Bookmarks, Polls and other resources as they are
> often being updated. The page is at:
> 
>
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> 
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - Include your full name with your message.
> - Include the address of your website, if you have
> one.
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of
> earlier messages to keep them short.
> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to
> change the subject header.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal
> attacks or "flames."
> - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> - Before posting a question, search the message
> archives and the various resources on the homepage. 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ 
> 
> 


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Here's one link to Hahn papers:
http://www.inkjetmall.com/store/conetech-photoarts.html
 Frank

-----Original Message-----
From: Daniel Perez [mailto:tronicart@...]
Sent: Monday, January 07, 2002 1:35 PM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Digital BW] MUSEO printing out watercolor edge ??

Anyone know where I can pick up a sample pack of
Hahnemuhle PhotoRag?  How heavy is it?
Thanks again for the help.
-Daniel
Also, does it come in 13x19?




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., Daniel Perez <tronicart@y...> wrote:
> Anyone know where I can pick up a sample pack of
> Hahnemuhle PhotoRag?  How heavy is it?
> Thanks again for the help.
>  -Daniel
> Also, does it come in 13x19?

Daniel,

Hahnemuehle papers are distributed under different names. Take a look in our 
Files section for more info. Besides inkjetmall, they are also available at 
mediastreet.com and digitalartsupplies.com among others. If you have 
FileMaker, you can download a database (also in our files section) that has 
more than you want to know about all this - though it is now a few months 
behind the times and about to be revised.

Antonis