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Digital BW, The Print

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BW Print-Off

BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by Amadou Diallo

I'm cross posting this to the Piezo and QTR groups. Is anyone interested in getting together 
in NYC during PhotoPlus? I'm thinking specifically of a bw "print-off" where we could 
compare images made with various bw printer, software and ink combinations. This is an 
exciting time for bw output with all of the new (and existing) options available. I thought it 
might be interesting to view output side by side.
I'd be willing to organize and host it. If the response is around 20 or so we could do this in 
my studio in Brooklyn and throw the prints up on the viewing wall. If it gets much larger than 
that, I could see about getting a more appropriate space.
I was thinking maybe we could all print the same image on a common paper, edited to taste. 
But I'm open to suggestions. I don't see this as a scientific approach with strict controls, but 
as a way to see how an image responds to different output.
If there is interest then I will give the details more thought, set up an RSVP procedure, etc etc.
Thanks

amadou diallo 
diallo photography

Re: [Digital BW] BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by Mark Savoia

Just make it for Saturday and I can attend.
Mark
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Oct 3, 2006, at 6:07 AM, Amadou Diallo wrote:

> I'm cross posting this to the Piezo and QTR groups. Is anyone  
> interested in getting together
> in NYC during PhotoPlus? I'm thinking specifically of a bw "print- 
> off" where we could
> compare images made with various bw printer, software and ink  
> combinations. This is an
> exciting time for bw output with all of the new (and existing)  
> options available. I thought it
> might be interesting to view output side by side.
> I'd be willing to organize and host it. If the response is around  
> 20 or so we could do this in
> my studio in Brooklyn and throw the prints up on the viewing wall.  
> If it gets much larger than
> that, I could see about getting a more appropriate space.
> I was thinking maybe we could all print the same image on a common  
> paper, edited to taste.
> But I'm open to suggestions. I don't see this as a scientific  
> approach with strict controls, but
> as a way to see how an image responds to different output.
> If there is interest then I will give the details more thought, set  
> up an RSVP procedure, etc etc.
> Thanks
>
> amadou diallo
> diallo photography
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other  
> resources as they are often being updated.
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you  
> wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by  
> visiting this same page.
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages  
> to keep them short.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or  
> flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed  
> from the membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital  
> B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be  
> removed from the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules  
> and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the  
> group Owner and Moderators. See “Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines”  
> in the Files section:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
>
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE  
> “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL  
> NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL,  
> CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO,  
> DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER  
> INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL  
> BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF  
> SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE  
> THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO  
> OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR  
> CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO  
> GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Re: [Digital BW] BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by CorrPro96@aol.com

You can count me in.
 
Richard Massie


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by wolarsky

I'm interested.
Evan


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Amadou Diallo" 
<amadiallo2001@...> wrote:
>
> I'm cross posting this to the Piezo and QTR groups. Is anyone 
interested in getting together 
> in NYC during PhotoPlus? I'm thinking specifically of a bw "print-
off" where we could 
> compare images made with various bw printer, software and ink 
combinations. This is an 
> exciting time for bw output with all of the new (and existing) 
options available. I thought it 
> might be interesting to view output side by side.
> I'd be willing to organize and host it. If the response is around 
20 or so we could do this in 
> my studio in Brooklyn and throw the prints up on the viewing wall. 
If it gets much larger than 
> that, I could see about getting a more appropriate space.
> I was thinking maybe we could all print the same image on a common 
paper, edited to taste. 
> But I'm open to suggestions. I don't see this as a scientific 
approach with strict controls, but 
> as a way to see how an image responds to different output.
> If there is interest then I will give the details more thought, 
set up an RSVP procedure, etc etc.
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> Thanks
> 
> amadou diallo 
> diallo photography
>

Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by john dean

When is Photo Plus?



--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "wolarsky"
<wolarsky@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> I'm interested.
> Evan
> 
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Amadou Diallo" 
> <amadiallo2001@> wrote:
> >
> > I'm cross posting this to the Piezo and QTR groups. Is anyone 
> interested in getting together 
> > in NYC during PhotoPlus? I'm thinking specifically of a bw "print-
> off" where we could 
> > compare images made with various bw printer, software and ink 
> combinations. This is an 
> > exciting time for bw output with all of the new (and existing) 
> options available. I thought it 
> > might be interesting to view output side by side.
> > I'd be willing to organize and host it. If the response is around 
> 20 or so we could do this in 
> > my studio in Brooklyn and throw the prints up on the viewing wall. 
> If it gets much larger than 
> > that, I could see about getting a more appropriate space.
> > I was thinking maybe we could all print the same image on a common 
> paper, edited to taste. 
> > But I'm open to suggestions. I don't see this as a scientific 
> approach with strict controls, but 
> > as a way to see how an image responds to different output.
> > If there is interest then I will give the details more thought, 
> set up an RSVP procedure, etc etc.
> > Thanks
> > 
> > amadou diallo 
> > diallo photography
> >
>

Re: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by Mark Savoia

Nov 2-4
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Oct 3, 2006, at 8:21 AM, john dean wrote:

> When is Photo Plus?
>
>
>
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "wolarsky"
> <wolarsky@...> wrote:
>>
>> I'm interested.
>> Evan
>>
>>
>> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Amadou Diallo"
>> <amadiallo2001@> wrote:
>>>
>>> I'm cross posting this to the Piezo and QTR groups. Is anyone
>> interested in getting together
>>> in NYC during PhotoPlus? I'm thinking specifically of a bw "print-
>> off" where we could
>>> compare images made with various bw printer, software and ink
>> combinations. This is an
>>> exciting time for bw output with all of the new (and existing)
>> options available. I thought it
>>> might be interesting to view output side by side.
>>> I'd be willing to organize and host it. If the response is around
>> 20 or so we could do this in
>>> my studio in Brooklyn and throw the prints up on the viewing wall.
>> If it gets much larger than
>>> that, I could see about getting a more appropriate space.
>>> I was thinking maybe we could all print the same image on a common
>> paper, edited to taste.
>>> But I'm open to suggestions. I don't see this as a scientific
>> approach with strict controls, but
>>> as a way to see how an image responds to different output.
>>> If there is interest then I will give the details more thought,
>> set up an RSVP procedure, etc etc.
>>> Thanks
>>>
>>> amadou diallo
>>> diallo photography
>>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other  
> resources as they are often being updated.
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you  
> wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by  
> visiting this same page.
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages  
> to keep them short.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or  
> flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed  
> from the membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital  
> B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be  
> removed from the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules  
> and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the  
> group Owner and Moderators. See “Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines”  
> in the Files section:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
>
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE  
> “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL  
> NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL,  
> CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO,  
> DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER  
> INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL  
> BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF  
> SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE  
> THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO  
> OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR  
> CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO  
> GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

[Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by john dean

I think it is a great idea. I'll try to be there.

John



--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Mark Savoia
<mark@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> Nov 2-4
> 
> On Oct 3, 2006, at 8:21 AM, john dean wrote:
> 
> > When is Photo Plus?
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "wolarsky"
> > <wolarsky@> wrote:
> >>
> >> I'm interested.
> >> Evan
> >>
> >>
> >> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Amadou Diallo"
> >> <amadiallo2001@> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> I'm cross posting this to the Piezo and QTR groups. Is anyone
> >> interested in getting together
> >>> in NYC during PhotoPlus? I'm thinking specifically of a bw "print-
> >> off" where we could
> >>> compare images made with various bw printer, software and ink
> >> combinations. This is an
> >>> exciting time for bw output with all of the new (and existing)
> >> options available. I thought it
> >>> might be interesting to view output side by side.
> >>> I'd be willing to organize and host it. If the response is around
> >> 20 or so we could do this in
> >>> my studio in Brooklyn and throw the prints up on the viewing wall.
> >> If it gets much larger than
> >>> that, I could see about getting a more appropriate space.
> >>> I was thinking maybe we could all print the same image on a common
> >> paper, edited to taste.
> >>> But I'm open to suggestions. I don't see this as a scientific
> >> approach with strict controls, but
> >>> as a way to see how an image responds to different output.
> >>> If there is interest then I will give the details more thought,
> >> set up an RSVP procedure, etc etc.
> >>> Thanks
> >>>
> >>> amadou diallo
> >>> diallo photography
> >>>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other  
> > resources as they are often being updated.
> >
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> >
> > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you  
> > wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by  
> > visiting this same page.
> >
> > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages  
> > to keep them short.
> > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or  
> > flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed  
> > from the membership without notice.
> > - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital  
> > B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be  
> > removed from the membership.
> > - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules  
> > and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the  
> > group Owner and Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines"  
> > in the Files section:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
> >
> > BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> > PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE  
> > "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL  
> > NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL,  
> > CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO,  
> > DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER  
> > INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL  
> > BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF  
> > SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE  
> > THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO  
> > OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR  
> > CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO  
> > GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> > PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>

Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by Tyler Boley

Count me in, I can't make it but Anil will be there bearing prints by
us... various kinds...
Tyler

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@...m, "Amadou Diallo"
<amadiallo2001@...> wrote:
>
> I'm cross posting this to the Piezo and QTR groups. Is anyone
interested in getting together 
> in NYC during PhotoPlus? I'm thinking specifically of a bw
"print-off" where we could 
> compare images made with various bw printer, software and ink
combinations. This is an 
> exciting time for bw output with all of the new (and existing)
options available. I thought it 
> might be interesting to view output side by side.
> I'd be willing to organize and host it. If the response is around 20
or so we could do this in 
> my studio in Brooklyn and throw the prints up on the viewing wall.
If it gets much larger than 
> that, I could see about getting a more appropriate space.
> I was thinking maybe we could all print the same image on a common
paper, edited to taste. 
> But I'm open to suggestions. I don't see this as a scientific
approach with strict controls, but 
> as a way to see how an image responds to different output.
> If there is interest then I will give the details more thought, set
up an RSVP procedure, etc etc.
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> Thanks
> 
> amadou diallo 
> diallo photography
>

Re: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by Walker Blackwell

You'll need to let me know within 1 week though for the print-off.  
I'm booked almost up to Nov 1st right now.

take care, Walker

Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by Greg

This is a great idea, unfortunately I won't be able to be there.

But I do have a suggestion... Maybe a common image from the FSA 
archives? One of the high res scans of course.

Re: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by Mark Savoia

Those are not great scans.
Mark
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Oct 3, 2006, at 12:46 PM, Greg wrote:

> This is a great idea, unfortunately I won't be able to be there.
>
> But I do have a suggestion... Maybe a common image from the FSA
> archives? One of the high res scans of course.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other  
> resources as they are often being updated.
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you  
> wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by  
> visiting this same page.
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages  
> to keep them short.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or  
> flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed  
> from the membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital  
> B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be  
> removed from the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules  
> and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the  
> group Owner and Moderators. See “Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines”  
> in the Files section:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
>
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE  
> “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL  
> NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL,  
> CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO,  
> DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER  
> INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL  
> BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF  
> SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE  
> THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO  
> OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR  
> CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO  
> GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by scott_now_coming

Great idea Greg.
I vote for Dorothea Lange's "Migrant Mother".

Scott

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Greg" 
<dfaprinting@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> This is a great idea, unfortunately I won't be able to be there.
> 
> But I do have a suggestion... Maybe a common image from the FSA 
> archives? One of the high res scans of course.
>

RE: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by John Moody

I also like the idea.
What would be really interesting is making two prints.  One where only a
curve adjustment is made, and anything goes for the other, like burning,
dodging, local contrast, etc.

Best regards,
John Moody
Show quoted textHide quoted text
-----Original Message-----
From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of
scott_now_coming
Sent: Tuesday, October 03, 2006 12:57 PM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

Great idea Greg.
I vote for Dorothea Lange's "Migrant Mother".

Scott


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by Carl Schofield

Migrant Mother is a powerful image and full of emotion, but  
technically rather poor.  The woman's face and eyes in particular are  
not sharply focused.  Walker Evan's portrait of Floyd Burroghs is an  
equally powerful image and technically much better with razor sharp,  
fine detail.

Carl
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Oct 3, 2006, at 12:56 PM, scott_now_coming wrote:

> Great idea Greg.
> I vote for Dorothea Lange's "Migrant Mother".
>
> Scott
>
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Greg"
> <dfaprinting@...> wrote:
>>
>> This is a great idea, unfortunately I won't be able to be there.
>>
>> But I do have a suggestion... Maybe a common image from the FSA
>> archives? One of the high res scans of course.
>>
>

[Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by Amadou Diallo

Do you guys have a link to the Lange scans? If, as Mark says, the quality is poor it would 
obviously be of little use. 
Thoughts:
I could drum scan a neg and provide a DSLR image each in two versions. Version A, already 
edited for print. No image adjustments or color space conversions allowed except for profile 
rendering at print, of course. This could highlight the inherent differences in hw,sw and ink 
interpretation. Version B, a non-adjusted image we could all edit at will and print with our 
full bag of tricks. The only thing I would ask is for detailed printer, ink and driver settings so 
we could see what effects we are looking at. I could easily whip up a form to document this.

One thing that may help is if all those interested list the following info: printer, driver (OEM 
or RIP) and ink set they would use. It would be cool if we got a range of the hardware, 
software and ink options. I'm looking at probably getting one of the HPs before too long.
Anyway, that' s what would excite me...

[Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by john dean

I have to lean toward the concept of using a large format 4x5 neg
scanned on a drum scanner as apposed to using some flatbed or Imacon
scan compressed for online download, if that is what the LOC has
available. From what I've seen of dslr files, they really suffer in
the extremes and comparitavily have quite a bit of noise in those
really subtle areas. Isn't  what one really wants to show in a
comparison the best possible output from the best possibe file?

John

Re: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by Walker Blackwell

I agree with John. I would like to work with good input. I'm fine  
printing whatever photo as long as its a good scan.

How does a 20x24 (ish) size feel? Too big? Too small? I'm thinking  
about plane travel.

take care, Walker

On Oct 3, 2006, at 2:25 PM, john dean wrote:

> I have to lean toward the concept of using a large format 4x5 neg
> scanned on a drum scanner as apposed to using some flatbed or Imacon
> scan compressed for online download, if that is what the LOC has
> available. From what I've seen of dslr files, they really suffer in
> the extremes and comparitavily have quite a bit of noise in those
> really subtle areas. Isn't what one really wants to show in a
> comparison the best possible output from the best possibe file?
>
> John
>
>
> 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by Mark Savoia

I think before we all jump on this we should set a day and time, some  
people are signed up for workshops, meetings, etc already and may not  
be able to attend.
Mark
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Oct 3, 2006, at 3:50 PM, Walker Blackwell wrote:

> I agree with John. I would like to work with good input. I'm fine
> printing whatever photo as long as its a good scan.
>
> How does a 20x24 (ish) size feel? Too big? Too small? I'm thinking
> about plane travel.
>
> take care, Walker
>
> On Oct 3, 2006, at 2:25 PM, john dean wrote:
>
>> I have to lean toward the concept of using a large format 4x5 neg
>> scanned on a drum scanner as apposed to using some flatbed or Imacon
>> scan compressed for online download, if that is what the LOC has
>> available. From what I've seen of dslr files, they really suffer in
>> the extremes and comparitavily have quite a bit of noise in those
>> really subtle areas. Isn't what one really wants to show in a
>> comparison the best possible output from the best possibe file?
>>
>> John
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other  
> resources as they are often being updated.
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you  
> wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by  
> visiting this same page.
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages  
> to keep them short.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or  
> flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed  
> from the membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital  
> B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be  
> removed from the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules  
> and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the  
> group Owner and Moderators. See “Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines”  
> in the Files section:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
>
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE  
> “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL  
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> BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF  
> SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE  
> THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO  
> OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR  
> CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO  
> GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
>
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>

[Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by Tyler Boley

Second thoughts Amadou? <G>

Much as I would love 20x24 Walker, I have SilverRag Portriga clones,
Ftype Gloss Seagul clones, different permutations and blends of Ptones
on matte (gee, and how many papers?)...
I guess I'd vote for a bit smaller, we're running out of time already...

Tyler

Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by wolarsky

I would hope that the print size would allow those of us non-
professionals using the Epson 2400 or similar printers to 
participate. 
Evan


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Walker 
Blackwell <wblackwell@...> wrote:
>
> I agree with John. I would like to work with good input. I'm fine  
> printing whatever photo as long as its a good scan.
> 
> How does a 20x24 (ish) size feel? Too big? Too small? I'm 
thinking  
> about plane travel.
> 
> take care, Walker
> 
> On Oct 3, 2006, at 2:25 PM, john dean wrote:
> 
> > I have to lean toward the concept of using a large format 4x5 neg
> > scanned on a drum scanner as apposed to using some flatbed or 
Imacon
> > scan compressed for online download, if that is what the LOC has
> > available. From what I've seen of dslr files, they really suffer 
in
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> > the extremes and comparitavily have quite a bit of noise in those
> > really subtle areas. Isn't what one really wants to show in a
> > comparison the best possible output from the best possibe file?
> >
> > John
> >
> >
> > 
> 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

[Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by Amadou Diallo

How about Friday Nov 3 at 1pm or Sat Nov 4 at 3pm? For size how about 11x14 image size? 
That might be easier to fly with.

[Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by Tyler Boley

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Amadou Diallo"
<amadiallo2001@...> wrote:
...
> One thing that may help is if all those interested list the
following info: printer, driver (OEM 
> or RIP) and ink set they would use.

9800 UCK3 StudioPrint
9600 Piezotone StudioPrint

Tyler

Re: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by Mark Savoia

How about you set up a pole with all the choices and we can vote?
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Oct 3, 2006, at 4:15 PM, Amadou Diallo wrote:

> How about Friday Nov 3 at 1pm or Sat Nov 4 at 3pm? For size how  
> about 11x14 image size?
> That might be easier to fly with.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other  
> resources as they are often being updated.
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you  
> wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by  
> visiting this same page.
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
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> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or  
> flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed  
> from the membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital  
> B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be  
> removed from the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules  
> and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the  
> group Owner and Moderators. See “Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines”  
> in the Files section:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
>
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> PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE  
> “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL  
> NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL,  
> CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO,  
> DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER  
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> BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF  
> SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE  
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> OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR  
> CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO  
> GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Re: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by Walker Blackwell

Both times work for me. 11x14 as well.

StudioPrint Piezotone Quad and Split

see you all then,
Walker


On Oct 3, 2006, at 3:15 PM, Amadou Diallo wrote:

> How about Friday Nov 3 at 1pm or Sat Nov 4 at 3pm? For size how  
> about 11x14 image size?
> That might be easier to fly with.
>
>
> 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by john dean

That sounds fine for me, but I'm totally open to anything since I
don't have specific plans that week. 

I can bring NK6 from an Epson 7000 and hopefully by the a 10K as well.
Also Ultrachrome K2. All out of QTR.

Amadou, you have a good scanner, since it's your baby why don't you
pick a neg and let us download it ftp?

John



--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Amadou Diallo"
<amadiallo2001@...> wrote:
>
> How about Friday Nov 3 at 1pm or Sat Nov 4 at 3pm? For size how
about 11x14 image size? 
> That might be easier to fly with.
>

[Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by john dean

But someone needs to find a way to do the file with one of the new HP
Z printers. It would be a shame to have to wait a year for that to happen.

John

[Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by wolarsky

Either time works for me.
Plain vanilla 2400.
Evan


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Amadou Diallo" 
<amadiallo2001@...> wrote:
>
> How about Friday Nov 3 at 1pm or Sat Nov 4 at 3pm? For size how 
about 11x14 image size? 
> That might be easier to fly with.
>

RE: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by Eric Neilsen Photo

I would love to clear my schedule and get in on the fun. I'd go with a good
"easy" high quality file and one of lessor quality to show what we all do
under the more challenging times of our printing life. 

I am running Piezotone Sepia with IP 6.0 and a 4800 with K3 inks and ??,  I
use several output schemes; Qimage, QTR, ABW/Epson.  

 

Eric

 

Eric Neilsen Photography

4101 Commerce Street, Suite 9

Dallas, TX 75226

214-827-8301

http://ericneilsenphotography.com

 

Skype : ejprinter

  _____  
Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of john dean
Sent: Tuesday, October 03, 2006 3:53 PM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

 

But someone needs to find a way to do the file with one of the new HP
Z printers. It would be a shame to have to wait a year for that to happen.

John

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by bwinkjet

Hi,
Need to delete space between the first two forward slashes (after http:

 In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Walker Blackwell 
<wblackwell@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> http://memory.loc.gov/pnp/ppmsc/00200/00244u.tif
> 
> :-)
>

Re: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-03 by Walker Blackwell

It's really not very good quality though . . . . bad re-touch job too.

this is the largest file I could find related to that particular  
photo shoot.

http://memory.loc.gov/pnp/ppmsc/00200/00242u.tif

But it was flat-bed scanned as far as I can tell. Blurry as hell.  
11x14 might be fine though . . .

Walker

RE: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-04 by Ken Carney

I wish there was a high-res download of Allie Burroughs.  I have printed 10
of the FSA images for my office (tired of my own stuff), and they're pretty
amazing.  All done on Innova Smooth White with IP6 neutral grayscale.

Ken
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> -----Original Message-----
> From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Carl
> Schofield
> Sent: Tuesday, October 03, 2006 2:09 PM
> To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off
> 
> Migrant Mother is a powerful image and full of emotion, but
> technically rather poor.  The woman's face and eyes in particular are
> not sharply focused.  Walker Evan's portrait of Floyd Burroghs is an
> equally powerful image and technically much better with razor sharp,
> fine detail.
> 
> Carl
> 
> 
> On Oct 3, 2006, at 12:56 PM, scott_now_coming wrote:
> 
> > Great idea Greg.
> > I vote for Dorothea Lange's "Migrant Mother".
> >
> > Scott
> >
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Greg"
> > <dfaprinting@...> wrote:
> >>
> >> This is a great idea, unfortunately I won't be able to be there.
> >>
> >> But I do have a suggestion... Maybe a common image from the FSA
> >> archives? One of the high res scans of course.
> >>
> >
> 
> 
> 
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as
> they are often being updated.
> 
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> 
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
> unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same
> page.
> 
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
> them short.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames.
> Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
> membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W
> printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from
> the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and
> guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner
> and Moderators. See Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines in the Files
> section:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
> 
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
> YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE OWNER AND
> MODERATORS OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO
> YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR
> EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF
> PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE
> OWNER AND MODERATORS OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN
> ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE
> OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii)
> UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii)
> STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
> YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE
> PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>

[Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-04 by Clayton Jones

Here's a suggestion - this link is to a 2.5 mg zip file containing the
technical.tif (9.6 mg) that Thomas Fors provided a few years ago for
the Technical Print Exchange.  It contains Paul's enhanced step wedge
plus 4 perfectly exposed pics originally from the Epson web site (I
think) - landscape, portrait and two still lifes that challenge the
full range of any printer.  It would be perfect for this.

   http://www.cjcom.net/files/technical.zip



Regards,
Clayton


Info on black and white digital printing at    
http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm

Re: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-04 by Mark Savoia

Agree.
Mark
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Oct 4, 2006, at 8:21 AM, Clayton Jones wrote:

> Here's a suggestion - this link is to a 2.5 mg zip file containing the
> technical.tif (9.6 mg) that Thomas Fors provided a few years ago for
> the Technical Print Exchange.  It contains Paul's enhanced step wedge
> plus 4 perfectly exposed pics originally from the Epson web site (I
> think) - landscape, portrait and two still lifes that challenge the
> full range of any printer.  It would be perfect for this.
>
>    http://www.cjcom.net/files/technical.zip
>
>
>
> Regards,
> Clayton
>
>
> Info on black and white digital printing at
> http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm
>
>
>
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other  
> resources as they are often being updated.
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you  
> wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by  
> visiting this same page.
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages  
> to keep them short.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or  
> flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed  
> from the membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital  
> B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be  
> removed from the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules  
> and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the  
> group Owner and Moderators. See “Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines”  
> in the Files section:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
>
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE  
> “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL  
> NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL,  
> CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO,  
> DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER  
> INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL  
> BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF  
> SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE  
> THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO  
> OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR  
> CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO  
> GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Re: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-04 by CDTobie@aol.com

In a message dated 10/3/06 4:30:50 PM, amadiallo2001@... writes:


> How about Friday Nov 3 at 1pm or Sat Nov 4 at 3pm?
> 

I'd love to be there; but it would have to be an evening event; I have 
responsibilities during show hours...

C. David Tobie
Product Technology Manager
ColorVision Business Unit
Datacolor Inc.
CDTobie@...
www.colorvision.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-04 by Tyler Boley

Clayton, I recall this file from before. Sorry but I can't recommend
it. It's untagged, the histo in the grad portion is broken, the
stepwedge portion is not clean, there are non-white artifacts around
the line test section, and (less important) it's 8 bit.
Other than that, it's perfect!!!
Interestingly, with a less than ideal file, the more precise systems
may make the least appealing prints.
Tyler

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Clayton Jones"
<cj@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> Here's a suggestion - this link is to a 2.5 mg zip file containing the
> technical.tif (9.6 mg) that Thomas Fors provided a few years ago for
> the Technical Print Exchange.  It contains Paul's enhanced step wedge
> plus 4 perfectly exposed pics originally from the Epson web site (I
> think) - landscape, portrait and two still lifes that challenge the
> full range of any printer.  It would be perfect for this.
> 
>    http://www.cjcom.net/files/technical.zip
> 
> 
> 
> Regards,
> Clayton
> 
> 
> Info on black and white digital printing at    
> http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm
>

RE: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-04 by Eric Neilsen Photo

Tyler, then you can see what the operator or printer REALLY adds to the
process instead of what the techno is making happen even if one first was
required to calibrate. Now that is a challenge; not just reading and
executing directions on calibration. That is why I suggest doing two types
of files. 

 

Eric Neilsen Photography

4101 Commerce Street, Suite 9

Dallas, TX 75226

214-827-8301

http://ericneilsenphotography.com

 

Skype : ejprinter

  _____  
Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tyler
Boley
Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 11:14 AM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

 

Clayton, I recall this file from before. Sorry but I can't recommend
it. It's untagged, the histo in the grad portion is broken, the
stepwedge portion is not clean, there are non-white artifacts around
the line test section, and (less important) it's 8 bit.
Other than that, it's perfect!!!
Interestingly, with a less than ideal file, the more precise systems
may make the least appealing prints.
Tyler

--- In DigitalBlackandWhit
<mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint%40yahoogroups.com>
eThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Clayton Jones"
<cj@...> wrote:
>
> Here's a suggestion - this link is to a 2.5 mg zip file containing the
> technical.tif (9.6 mg) that Thomas Fors provided a few years ago for
> the Technical Print Exchange. It contains Paul's enhanced step wedge
> plus 4 perfectly exposed pics originally from the Epson web site (I
> think) - landscape, portrait and two still lifes that challenge the
> full range of any printer. It would be perfect for this.
> 
> http://www.cjcom. <http://www.cjcom.net/files/technical.zip>
net/files/technical.zip
> 
> 
> 
> Regards,
> Clayton
> 
> 
> Info on black and white digital printing at 
> http://www.cjcom. <http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm>
net/digiprnarts.htm
>

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-04 by john dean

He's right. When you create a histogram of that Tiff it really isn't
smooth at all. We need a 16 bit file from a good scan that hasn't been
compressed if possible.

It's up to Amadou, he's in charge, but I still think a drum scan from
a real world photograph from a large format black and white neg of a
full range subject with a decent amount of total black would be best.
Second  best would be a medium or large format direct digtal capture
from a really good back. I don't have the perfect negative or I would
offer to supply it.

John

Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-04 by wolarsky

I agree with John. My interest is in seeing how members of this forum 
produce great prints with their systems, rather than seeing which 
printer produces the best stepwedge.
Evan

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "john dean" 
<deanwork2003@...> wrote:
>
> He's right. When you create a histogram of that Tiff it really isn't
> smooth at all. We need a 16 bit file from a good scan that hasn't 
been
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> compressed if possible.
> 
> It's up to Amadou, he's in charge, but I still think a drum scan from
> a real world photograph from a large format black and white neg of a
> full range subject with a decent amount of total black would be best.
> Second  best would be a medium or large format direct digtal capture
> from a really good back. I don't have the perfect negative or I would
> offer to supply it.
> 
> John
>

Re: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-04 by Mark Savoia

Observation, not criticism.

Who thought this was going to turn out like this? What is going to  
happen if we all get in the same room? I think we need to check the  
attitudes and realize that there are all levels of printers (people)  
in this group and we will do the best job we can by what is given to  
us. This is after all what we do everyday, ....if it's a bad scan  
supplied, bad digital capture, etc. that is out of our control.

Let's keep it fun.
:)
Mark
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Oct 4, 2006, at 1:09 PM, wolarsky wrote:

> I agree with John. My interest is in seeing how members of this forum
> produce great prints with their systems, rather than seeing which
> printer produces the best stepwedge.
> Evan
>
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "john dean"
> <deanwork2003@...> wrote:
>>
>> He's right. When you create a histogram of that Tiff it really isn't
>> smooth at all. We need a 16 bit file from a good scan that hasn't
> been
>> compressed if possible.
>>
>> It's up to Amadou, he's in charge, but I still think a drum scan from
>> a real world photograph from a large format black and white neg of a
>> full range subject with a decent amount of total black would be best.
>> Second  best would be a medium or large format direct digtal capture
>> from a really good back. I don't have the perfect negative or I would
>> offer to supply it.
>>
>> John
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other  
> resources as they are often being updated.
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you  
> wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by  
> visiting this same page.
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages  
> to keep them short.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or  
> flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed  
> from the membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital  
> B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be  
> removed from the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules  
> and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the  
> group Owner and Moderators. See “Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines”  
> in the Files section:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
>
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE  
> “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL  
> NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL,  
> CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO,  
> DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER  
> INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL  
> BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF  
> SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE  
> THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO  
> OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR  
> CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO  
> GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

[Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-04 by john dean

We all just gave our opinions and personal suggestions so that we
could learn the most from this. Amadou knows what he is doing, and
we'll all do what he tells us to do because he started it and he's in
charge, and it will all be cool. I don't see this as a competition but
rather an opportunity to see what everyone is up to and it will be fun
regardless of the files he uses.

John





--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Mark Savoia
<mark@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> Observation, not criticism.
> 
> Who thought this was going to turn out like this? What is going to  
> happen if we all get in the same room? I think we need to check the  
> attitudes and realize that there are all levels of printers (people)  
> in this group and we will do the best job we can by what is given to  
> us. This is after all what we do everyday, ....if it's a bad scan  
> supplied, bad digital capture, etc. that is out of our control.
> 
> Let's keep it fun.
> :)
> Mark
> 
> On Oct 4, 2006, at 1:09 PM, wolarsky wrote:
> 
> > I agree with John. My interest is in seeing how members of this forum
> > produce great prints with their systems, rather than seeing which
> > printer produces the best stepwedge.
> > Evan
> >
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "john dean"
> > <deanwork2003@> wrote:
> >>
> >> He's right. When you create a histogram of that Tiff it really isn't
> >> smooth at all. We need a 16 bit file from a good scan that hasn't
> > been
> >> compressed if possible.
> >>
> >> It's up to Amadou, he's in charge, but I still think a drum scan from
> >> a real world photograph from a large format black and white neg of a
> >> full range subject with a decent amount of total black would be best.
> >> Second  best would be a medium or large format direct digtal capture
> >> from a really good back. I don't have the perfect negative or I would
> >> offer to supply it.
> >>
> >> John
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other  
> > resources as they are often being updated.
> >
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> >
> > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you  
> > wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by  
> > visiting this same page.
> >
> > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages  
> > to keep them short.
> > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or  
> > flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed  
> > from the membership without notice.
> > - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital  
> > B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be  
> > removed from the membership.
> > - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules  
> > and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the  
> > group Owner and Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines"  
> > in the Files section:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
> >
> > BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> > PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE  
> > "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL  
> > NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL,  
> > CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO,  
> > DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER  
> > INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL  
> > BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF  
> > SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE  
> > THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO  
> > OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR  
> > CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO  
> > GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> > PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>

[Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-04 by Amadou Diallo

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Mark Savoia
<mark@...> wrote:
>
> Observation, not criticism.
>
> Who thought this was going to turn out like this? What is going to
> happen if we all get in the same room? I think we need to check the
> attitudes and realize that there are all levels of printers (people)
> in this group and we will do the best job we can by what is given to
> us. This is after all what we do everyday, ....if it's a bad scan
> supplied, bad digital capture, etc. that is out of our control.
>
> Let's keep it fun.
> :)
> Mark
>
> On Oct 4, 2006, at 1:09 PM, wolarsky wrote:
>
> > I agree with John. My interest is in seeing how members of this
forum
> > produce great prints with their systems, rather than seeing which
> > printer produces the best stepwedge.
> > Evan
> >
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "john dean"
> > deanwork2003@ wrote:
> >>
> >> He's right. When you create a histogram of that Tiff it really
isn't
> >> smooth at all. We need a 16 bit file from a good scan that hasn't
> > been
> >> compressed if possible.
> >>
> >> It's up to Amadou, he's in charge, but I still think a drum scan
from
> >> a real world photograph from a large format black and white neg of
a
> >> full range subject with a decent amount of total black would be
best.
> >> Second  best would be a medium or large format direct digtal
capture
> >> from a really good back. I don't have the perfect negative or I
would
> >> offer to supply it.
> >>
> >> John
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other
> > resources as they are often being updated.
> >
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> >
> > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you
> > wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by
> > visiting this same page.
> >
> > Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages
> > to keep them short.
> > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or
> > flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed
> > from the membership without notice.
> > - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital
> > B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be
> > removed from the membership.
> > - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules
> > and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the
> > group Owner and Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and
Guidelines"
> > in the Files section:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
> >
> > BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE
> > PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE
> > "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
YAHOO GROUP SHALL
> > NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL,
> > CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO,
> > DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER
> > INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  "OWNER" AND
"MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> > BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF
> > SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE
> > THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO
> > OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR
> > CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO
> > GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE
> > PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>

[Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-04 by Amadou Diallo

There's a lot of conflicting, but valid approaches mentioned. But to simplify things I am 
going to drum scan a 4x5 neg, tag it with a color space and send email links for download. 
There will be two file versions, one edited and sharpened for output, the other a flat "raw" 
scan for you all to interpret. I should have the file and print instructions ready over the 
weekend. I'll also include directions to my studio. 

I have also heard both on and offline from those who have full day duties at the Expo. So I 
am proposing a new time: Saturday Nov 4 at 6pm. There are some great restaurants in the 
neighborhood (Fort Greene) and I could make a dinner reservation for afterwards if the 
group stays small. Here is the list I have of members willing to participate:
Mark Savoia
Wolarsky
John Dean
Tyler Boley/Anil Kapahi
Walker Blackwell
Eric Neilsen
Richard Massie
C David Tobie
Some of you have participated in the discussion but not stated explicitly whether you are 
attending. If you don't see your name on this list please email me amadou at 
diallophotography dot com
I believe I have a line on one of the new Canon printers to include and am working on 
access to a Z series HP.
Thanks everyone for your input and enthusiasm. It should be fun.

Re: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-04 by Walker Blackwell

I will be there Sat Nov. 4 at 6pm.  Sounds great on the 4x5 neg raw  
and visualized. I agree. Need good input to start.

This will be very good fun and I hope to meet/see you all in NY in a  
month! :-)

The same goes for all you printers who come through Chicago. If you  
want to stop by the studio you can get my contact info at Black  
Point's website www.blackpointeditions.com.  Just give me a buzz and  
stop in for a chat/looksie. We've finally moved into a new and much  
larger space. I was pretty ashamed of how little space we had last  
year so I never really invited anyone over. :-)

take care, Walker Blackwell

RE: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-04 by David Whistance

Would you be willing to post a summary of everyones views after the meeting
so that those of us who are too far away to attend can benefit from the
lessons learned?

Regards

David Whistance
Show quoted textHide quoted text
  -----Original Message-----
  From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Amadou
Diallo
  Sent: 04 October 2006 18:44
  To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
  Subject: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off


  There's a lot of conflicting, but valid approaches mentioned. But to
simplify things I am
  going to drum scan a 4x5 neg, tag it with a color space and send email
links for download.
  There will be two file versions, one edited and sharpened for output, the
other a flat "raw"
  scan for you all to interpret. I should have the file and print
instructions ready over the
  weekend. I'll also include directions to my studio.

  I have also heard both on and offline from those who have full day duties
at the Expo. So I
  am proposing a new time: Saturday Nov 4 at 6pm. There are some great
restaurants in the
  neighborhood (Fort Greene) and I could make a dinner reservation for
afterwards if the
  group stays small. Here is the list I have of members willing to
participate:
  Mark Savoia
  Wolarsky
  John Dean
  Tyler Boley/Anil Kapahi
  Walker Blackwell
  Eric Neilsen
  Richard Massie
  C David Tobie
  Some of you have participated in the discussion but not stated explicitly
whether you are
  attending. If you don't see your name on this list please email me amadou
at
  diallophotography dot com
  I believe I have a line on one of the new Canon printers to include and am
working on
  access to a Z series HP.
  Thanks everyone for your input and enthusiasm. It should be fun.



  


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-04 by Amadou Diallo

Sure. And I have no doubt that those in attendence will share their individual conclusions as 
well.
--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "David Whistance" 
<david.whistance@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> Would you be willing to post a summary of everyones views after the meeting
> so that those of us who are too far away to attend can benefit from the
> lessons learned?

RE: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-04 by David Whistance

Many thanks - I look forward to the results.  Hope everyone enjoys the
Print-Off and get together.

David Whistance
Show quoted textHide quoted text
  -----Original Message-----
  From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Amadou
Diallo
  Sent: 04 October 2006 20:02
  To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
  Subject: [Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off


  Sure. And I have no doubt that those in attendence will share their
individual conclusions as
  well.
  --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "David Whistance"
  <david.whistance@...> wrote:
  >
  > Would you be willing to post a summary of everyones views after the
meeting
  > so that those of us who are too far away to attend can benefit from the
  > lessons learned?



  


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-04 by Tyler Boley

well, there'll be an NDA to sign along with ours, so...
Tyler

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Amadou Diallo"
<amadiallo2001@...> wrote:
>
> Sure. And I have no doubt that those in attendence will share their
individual conclusions as 
> well.
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "David Whistance" 
> <david.whistance@> wrote:
> >
> > Would you be willing to post a summary of everyones views after
the meeting
> > so that those of us who are too far away to attend can benefit
from the
> > lessons learned?
>

[Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-04 by Clayton Jones

Tyler,

>It's untagged, the histo in the grad portion is broken, the
>stepwedge portion is not clean, there are non-white artifacts around
>the line test section, and (less important) it's 8 bit.
>Other than that, it's perfect!!!

Wow, and all for free.  Such a deal <g>.  We should rename it to
RodneyDangerfield.tif

Regards,
Clayton


Info on black and white digital printing at    
http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm

[Digital BW] Re: BW Print-Off

2006-10-04 by Tyler Boley

I expect this sort of thing when I have to pay for it, but this was
free! I mean COME ON!
Tyler

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Clayton Jones"
<cj@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> Tyler,
> 
> >It's untagged, the histo in the grad portion is broken, the
> >stepwedge portion is not clean, there are non-white artifacts around
> >the line test section, and (less important) it's 8 bit.
> >Other than that, it's perfect!!!
> 
> Wow, and all for free.  Such a deal <g>.  We should rename it to
> RodneyDangerfield.tif
> 
> Regards,
> Clayton
> 
> 
> Info on black and white digital printing at    
> http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm
>

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