Yahoo Groups archive

Digital BW, The Print

Index last updated: 2026-04-28 22:56 UTC

Thread

New signing pen for RC and matte papers

New signing pen for RC and matte papers

2007-02-11 by Steven Karafyllakis

I was hunting for the right pencil for Hahnemuhle papers a few days 
back, and my eye fell on something labeled ' graphite pencil' It looked 
like a ball-point pen disguised as a pencil, complete with eraser on 
the back. It turns out to work quite well with RC papers, if they 
haven't been sprayed first. It produces what looks very much like a no. 
3 pencil shade of gray, but is much easier to write with than the 
Marsmatic drafting pen/inkjet ink I had been using. Also works well on 
the Hahnemuhle papers, though it is a bit darker there. It is almost 
too dark on most other matte papers, though still much better than a 
black ball-point pen which I find completely unacceptable. At $3.00 for 
two, its definitely worth a try. 

The full name is the Foray Graphite Pencil, and I found it at office 
Depot, though it may be available in most office supply houses.

Steve Karafyllakis

Re:New signing pen for RC and matte papers

2007-02-11 by David Keenan

>The full name is the Foray Graphite Pencil

I thought that "regular" pencil was the preferred method to sign matte
papers. That's what I use anyway the few times that I don't make final
prints on Innova Fiba-Gloss F.

I will check out this pencil for signing the Innova.

Dave.

-- 
Web Site: www.david-keenan.com
2007 PAW: www.david-keenan.com/paw
2006 EuroBlog: www.david-keenan.com/euroblog


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re:New signing pen for RC and matte papers

2007-02-11 by Murray DeJager

Hello Everyone,

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "David Keenan" 
><ausdlk@...> wrote:
> 
> I thought that "regular" pencil was the preferred method to sign
> matte papers. That's what I use anyway the few times that I don't
> make final prints on Innova Fiba-Gloss F.
> 
> I will check out this pencil for signing the Innova.
> 
> Dave.


Perfect timing for this message to show up. I have just begun the 
process of finalizing a collection of B&W photos from the late '70s 
to early '80s for limited edition printing on an Epson 2400. I've 
decided on Museo Silver Rag as the paper and the only subject I've 
been grappling with is the signing of the individual prints.

Reading through the achives and also reading some very recent posts 
on the subject of whether one could use a "scanned signature" as a 
replacement for the real thing I decided that, despite having a 
signature that gets worse the more I have to think about it, I would 
do my best and sign my prints with a pencil.

Then I did a practice run and actually tried to sign a Silver Rag 
print... it can't be done! At least not in pencil. So I tried a 
couple of different types of pen... over my dead body! The results 
look awful!

So I'm back to using a scanned signature. But I've also decided that 
I'd sign the back of the print to make up for not actually signing 
the front.

What do the other members of this list thing about that?

Murray DeJager

Re:New signing pen for RC and matte papers

2007-02-11 by Murray DeJager

Hello,

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "David Keenan" 
<ausdlk@...> wrote:
>
> I thought that "regular" pencil was the preferred method to sign matte
> papers. That's what I use anyway the few times that I don't make final
> prints on Innova Fiba-Gloss F.
> 
> I will check out this pencil for signing the Innova.
> 
> Dave.


Oops, forgive me, it wasn't on this list that recent discussions of 
using a digital signature took place.

Murray DeJager

Re: [Digital BW] Re:New signing pen for RC and matte papers

2007-02-11 by Mark Savoia

How about a signature embosser?
Mark
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Feb 11, 2007, at 3:53 PM, Murray DeJager wrote:

> Hello Everyone,
>
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "David Keenan"
>> <ausdlk@...> wrote:
>>
>> I thought that "regular" pencil was the preferred method to sign
>> matte papers. That's what I use anyway the few times that I don't
>> make final prints on Innova Fiba-Gloss F.
>>
>> I will check out this pencil for signing the Innova.
>>
>> Dave.
>
>
> Perfect timing for this message to show up. I have just begun the
> process of finalizing a collection of B&W photos from the late '70s
> to early '80s for limited edition printing on an Epson 2400. I've
> decided on Museo Silver Rag as the paper and the only subject I've
> been grappling with is the signing of the individual prints.
>
> Reading through the achives and also reading some very recent posts
> on the subject of whether one could use a "scanned signature" as a
> replacement for the real thing I decided that, despite having a
> signature that gets worse the more I have to think about it, I would
> do my best and sign my prints with a pencil.
>
> Then I did a practice run and actually tried to sign a Silver Rag
> print... it can't be done! At least not in pencil. So I tried a
> couple of different types of pen... over my dead body! The results
> look awful!
>
> So I'm back to using a scanned signature. But I've also decided that
> I'd sign the back of the print to make up for not actually signing
> the front.
>
> What do the other members of this list thing about that?
>
> Murray DeJager
>
>
>
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other  
> resources as they are often being updated.
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you  
> wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by  
> visiting this same page.
>
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages  
> to keep them short.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or  
> flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed  
> from the membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital  
> B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be  
> removed from the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules  
> and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the  
> group Owner and Moderators. See “Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines”  
> in the Files section:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
>
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE  
> “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL  
> NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL,  
> CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO,  
> DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER  
> INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL  
> BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF  
> SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE  
> THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO  
> OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR  
> CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO  
> GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE  
> PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>

Re: [Digital BW] Re:New signing pen for RC and matte papers

2007-02-11 by Carl Schofield

I always use a digital scan of my signature, printed at the lower  
right print margin.

Carl
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Feb 11, 2007, at 4:00 PM, Murray DeJager wrote:

> Hello,
>
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "David Keenan"
> <ausdlk@...> wrote:
>>
>> I thought that "regular" pencil was the preferred method to sign  
>> matte
>> papers. That's what I use anyway the few times that I don't make  
>> final
>> prints on Innova Fiba-Gloss F.
>>
>> I will check out this pencil for signing the Innova.
>>
>> Dave.
>
>
> Oops, forgive me, it wasn't on this list that recent discussions of
> using a digital signature took place.
>
> Murray DeJager

Re: [Digital BW] Re:New signing pen for RC and matte papers

2007-02-11 by Tina Manley

At 03:53 PM 2/11/2007, you wrote:
>What do the other members of this list thing about that?
>
>Murray DeJager

I use a digital scan of my signature in the lower left-hand 
corner.  In light gray, it looks just like a pencil signature.

Tina

Tina Manley, ASMP, NPPA
http://www.pbase.com/tinamanley/portfolio

Re: [Digital BW] Re:New signing pen for RC and matte papers

2007-02-11 by Tina Manley

That should be lower right-hand corner.  I'm not really dyslexic.

Tina

At 03:53 PM 2/11/2007, you wrote:
>What do the other members of this list thing about that?
>
>Murray DeJager

I use a digital scan of my signature in the lower left-hand 
corner.  In light gray, it looks just like a pencil signature.

Tina

Tina Manley, ASMP, NPPA
http://www.pbase.com/tinamanley/portfolio

Re: [Digital BW] Re:New signing pen for RC and matte papers

2007-02-11 by Steve Gledhill

I use an Edding 1800 Profipen 0.3 - pigment ink - or so they say!  I've 
had it for years now and it's still going strong.  It's very BLACK - not 
at all subtle!  And it writes my signature very clearly on Silver Rag.
Steve Gledhill
http://www.virtuallygrey.co.uk/

> Murray DeJager wrote:
>>
>> Hello Everyone,
>>
>> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com 
>> <mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint%40yahoogroups.com>, "David Keenan"
>> ><ausdlk@...> wrote:
>> >
>> > I thought that "regular" pencil was the preferred method to sign
>> > matte papers. That's what I use anyway the few times that I don't
>> > make final prints on Innova Fiba-Gloss F.
>> >
>> > I will check out this pencil for signing the Innova.
>> >
>> > Dave.
>>
>> Perfect timing for this message to show up. I have just begun the
>> process of finalizing a collection of B&W photos from the late '70s
>> to early '80s for limited edition printing on an Epson 2400. I've
>> decided on Museo Silver Rag as the paper and the only subject I've
>> been grappling with is the signing of the individual prints.
>>
>> Reading through the achives and also reading some very recent posts
>> on the subject of whether one could use a "scanned signature" as a
>> replacement for the real thing I decided that, despite having a
>> signature that gets worse the more I have to think about it, I would
>> do my best and sign my prints with a pencil.
>>
>> Then I did a practice run and actually tried to sign a Silver Rag
>> print... it can't be done! At least not in pencil. So I tried a
>> couple of different types of pen... over my dead body! The results
>> look awful!
>>
>> So I'm back to using a scanned signature. But I've also decided that
>> I'd sign the back of the print to make up for not actually signing
>> the front.
>>
>> What do the other members of this list thing about that?
>>
>> Murray DeJager
>>

		
___________________________________________________________ 
All New Yahoo! Mail \ufffd Tired of Vi@gr@! come-ons? Let our SpamGuard protect you. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html

[Digital BW] Re:New signing pen for RC and matte papers

2007-02-11 by dlruckus

Signed in exactly the same way you sign checks and legal documents ?
Maybe not so good ;-)

Regards Duane



--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Carl Schofield
<list@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> I always use a digital scan of my signature, printed at the lower  
> right print margin.
> 
> Carl
> 
> On Feb 11, 2007, at 4:00 PM, Murray DeJager wrote:
> 
> > Hello,
> >
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "David Keenan"
> > <ausdlk@> wrote:
> >>
> >> I thought that "regular" pencil was the preferred method to sign  
> >> matte
> >> papers. That's what I use anyway the few times that I don't make  
> >> final
> >> prints on Innova Fiba-Gloss F.
> >>
> >> I will check out this pencil for signing the Innova.
> >>
> >> Dave.
> >
> >
> > Oops, forgive me, it wasn't on this list that recent discussions of
> > using a digital signature took place.
> >
> > Murray DeJager
>

Re: [Digital BW] Re:New signing pen for RC and matte papers

2007-02-11 by Tina Manley

At 05:53 PM 2/11/2007, you wrote:

>Signed in exactly the same way you sign checks and legal documents ?
>Maybe not so good ;-)
>
>Regards Duane

Why not?  If anybody wanted to, they could take a digital photo of 
your actual signature on a print and use it the same way?  What 
difference would it make?

Tina

Tina Manley, ASMP, NPPA
http://www.pbase.com/tinamanley/portfolio

Re: [Digital BW] Re:New signing pen for RC and matte papers

2007-02-11 by Carl Schofield

No, I use my Artist's sig :-)
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Feb 11, 2007, at 5:53 PM, dlruckus wrote:

> Signed in exactly the same way you sign checks and legal documents ?
> Maybe not so good ;-)
>
> Regards Duane
>

[Digital BW] Eboni or K3 MK

2007-02-11 by Hans & Chia

Hi,

I have been printing for a while using only Epson K3 inks (SP9800,  
ABW and HPR 308) and I don't like the way black surfaces are printed.
They look flat and dead compared to the prints I did earlier using  
MIS UT (Eboni) and SP7500 where I got a much more deep black and a  
velvet like feeling. Is this an ink only or an ink/printer question?
When looking through the archive I understand that some of you  
prefere Eboni because of slightly better dmax and a bit cooler tone.
But what about the velvet feeling.

Any opinions are welcome

Hans

Re: New signing pen for RC and matte papers

2007-02-11 by jean wall penland

i just found a small family owned company (in florida) online and now i 
have a wonderful longreach embosser with my handwritten name logo (jno) 
which was reasonable in cost and the owner of the company was very 
helpful       you can email me personally and i will give you info       
i can adjust the pressure (without guides) to suit all the way from 
light papers (EEM) to mat board!    perfect subtle solution      this is 
not their usual order but is by far the most reasonably priced and you 
can get varied inserts       or they can typeset your name if you 
prefer, or even add a copyright     jwp, lurker with 
not-very-well-maintained or slick site

http://www.penlandia.com   


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Re: New signing pen for RC and matte papers

2007-02-12 by Peter Marquis-Kyle

jean wall penland wrote:
> i just found a small family owned company (in florida) online and now i 
> have a wonderful longreach embosser with my handwritten name logo (jno) 
> which was reasonable in cost and the owner of the company was very 
> helpful       you can email me personally and i will give you info       


Come on Jean, don't tease us like that! Just tell us the URL...

Peter Marquis-Kyle

Re:New signing pen for RC and matte papers

2007-02-12 by Clayton Jones

Hello Murray,

>...Museo Silver Rag 
>...couple of different types of pen... over my dead body! The results 
>look awful!
> What do the other members of this list thing about that?

This subject has come up here before.  Best I can remember, most SR
users use some sort of ink pen.  I (and several others) am using a
Staedtler Marsmatic 700 filled with some MIS R2-W LC (basically an
LLK). It is not too dark and not too light, dries almost instantly. 
These pens can be found on Ebay in sets of 4 for around $15.


Regards,
Clayton


Info on black and white digital printing at    
http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm

Re:New signing pen for RC and matte papers

2007-02-12 by David Keenan

>So I'm back to using a scanned signature

My last two exhibits of 30+ prints each have a scanned signature printed on
them along with the place/time of the photograph.

I think it looks just fine. Better than my actual signature since it is the
same each time and semi-legible when compared to my everyday scratch.

Dave.

-- 
Web Site: www.david-keenan.com
2007 PAW: www.david-keenan.com/paw
2006 EuroBlog: www.david-keenan.com/euroblog


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re:New signing pen for RC and matte papers

2007-02-12 by Steven Karafyllakis

Hi David;

Yes, regular pencil is good when it works, but I've had a hard time 
finding just the right softnes for the Han. William Turner, which for 
some reason just doesn't work well with even a soft no. 2. That was 
my intent-I poted about the graphite pencil becuase it works well on 
RC as well, which is another kettle of fish.

As for printing your signature, I've had several customers ask me 
outright if I printed it or actually signed, and they sounded 
prepared to get upset over a printed signature. And anyway, come on 
guys & girls-that's just plain lazy, don't you think?

Steve Karafyllakis

 --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "David Keenan" 
<ausdlk@...> wrote:
>
> >The full name is the Foray Graphite Pencil
> 
> I thought that "regular" pencil was the preferred method to sign 
matte
> papers. That's what I use anyway the few times that I don't make 
final
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> prints on Innova Fiba-Gloss F.
> 
> I will check out this pencil for signing the Innova.
> 
> Dave.
> 
> -- 
> Web Site: www.david-keenan.com
> 2007 PAW: www.david-keenan.com/paw
> 2006 EuroBlog: www.david-keenan.com/euroblog
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Re:New signing pen for RC and matte papers

2007-02-12 by David Keenan

>And anyway, come on guys & girls-that's just plain lazy, don't you think?

Lazy, perhaps.

But if one's "natural" signature is ugly or whatever and/or there is a
chance to ruin a finished print by botching it with a pen or
pencil (which is a real possibility for me) then why not digitally sign?

Dave.

-- 
Web Site: www.david-keenan.com
2007 PAW: www.david-keenan.com/paw
2006 EuroBlog: www.david-keenan.com/euroblog


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Digital BW] Re:New signing pen for RC and matte papers

2007-02-12 by Murray DeJager

Thanks to all those who replied,

I was afraid that what I was doing might be considered an absolutely 
criminal act in the art world, but I see now that it's probably not a 
huge deal so I'm going to continue on with the final printing using my 
scanned signature. As you stated Tina when scanned light grey it looks 
just like a pencil signature anyway.

As someone said, It might be lazy but in reality I was actually 
thinking of printing 3 prints for every final one print in anticipation 
that my signature would ruin two of the three prints! Plus, I think it 
acutally takes longer to put my signature in place in photoshop than it 
would actually take to sign it with a pencil.

Two members mentioned the embossed method, I like that idea also and I 
think I'll look into that for future use.


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Tina Manley 
<images@...> wrote:
>
> That should be lower right-hand corner.  I'm not really dyslexic.
> 
> Tina

But like me you may be ambidextrous! I always have to think about which 
hand is my left hand vs. my right hand.

Thanks to all,

Murray DeJager

Re:New signing pen for RC and matte papers

2007-02-13 by Steven Karafyllakis

Yeah, I'll admit to having botched the occasional print, but I'm 
finding my signature, which used to be quite ugly, is getting less so. 
Practice, practice. I take you're in Australia? my first two years of 
schooling was in Australia, as a child. When we moved back to Greece I 
was surprised to find one of the classes in school was...caligraphy. An 
entire hour, everyday, of trying to make that basically 
incomprehensible Greek script legible. After 3 years of that, my 
writing was still abysmal! So signing digitally is a temptation, 
believe me.

Steve Karafyllakis

(a good Irish name!)
> 
> But if one's "natural" signature is ugly or whatever and/or there is a
> chance to ruin a finished print by botching it with a pen or
> pencil (which is a real possibility for me) then why not digitally 
sign?
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> 
> Dave.
> 
> -- 
> Web Site: www.david-keenan.com
> 2007 PAW: www.david-keenan.com/paw
> 2006 EuroBlog: www.david-keenan.com/euroblog
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Re:New signing pen for RC and matte papers

2007-02-13 by David Keenan

>I take you're in Australia?

No. Austin, Texas. Never been down under... Way too long of a bus ride for
me.

Dave.
-- 
Web Site: www.david-keenan.com
2007 PAW: www.david-keenan.com/paw
2006 EuroBlog: www.david-keenan.com/euroblog


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Move to quarantaine

This moves the raw source file on disk only. The archive index is not changed automatically, so you still need to run a manual refresh afterward.