Digital BW, The Print

This is my first post to the list as I've not acquired a digital printer of professional standards, 
but have an opportunity to get an Epson 4000 for $250.  The seller, who is local, says he 
hasn't used it in a month, some inks are very low and one is empty so there's no chance to 
test it really.
Given the price it's quite tempting really, but I am wondering what those experienced users 
here think would be a nightmare scenario I could get myself into.
Thanks and below is the seller's description.
Eric
"This printer was last used about 1 month ago and it worked fine. 
There are 2 empty ink cartridges and the other are very very low. 
So it will need new ink. Additionally you will probably need to run the nozzle cleanings 
because it has been sitting so long. 

There are no cover doors for the ink slots. 
There is no paper roll feed in the back either. 
Although you can use roll paper if you make your own paper stand. 

This printer does have the network card installed."

Hi. I have had the 4000 since they first came out. $250 is a great
price, but keep in mind the following. Depending on how bad the
nozzles are clogged, you may need to do several cleanings. You may
even need to do a "power flush" which uses up about $60 worth of ink.
In order to do cleanings and/or a flush, you need a certain minumum
amount of ink still in the cartridge. So you will need to spend some
hundreds of dollars in order to see if you can get it going. It is a
great printer when it is running. It really does like to be used very
often, daily if possible. It is not a good printer if it only sees
occasional use. Hope this helps.

steve

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "emanmb"
<emanmb@...> wrote:
>
> This is my first post to the list as I've not acquired a digital
printer of professional standards, 
> but have an opportunity to get an Epson 4000 for $250.  The seller,
who is local, says he 
> hasn't used it in a month, some inks are very low and one is empty
so there's no chance to 
> test it really.
> Given the price it's quite tempting really, but I am wondering what
those experienced users 
> here think would be a nightmare scenario I could get myself into.
> Thanks and below is the seller's description.
> Eric
> "This printer was last used about 1 month ago and it worked fine. 
> There are 2 empty ink cartridges and the other are very very low. 
> So it will need new ink. Additionally you will probably need to run
the nozzle cleanings 

> because it has been sitting so long. 
> 
> There are no cover doors for the ink slots. 
> There is no paper roll feed in the back either. 
> Although you can use roll paper if you make your own paper stand. 
> 
> This printer does have the network card installed."
>

Thank you Steve and Richard for the input so far.  

One item I just learned about this printer is that before the printer was loaded w/Epson 
inks, it had been used with a dye sub ink set.  
The owner said he had used "a cleaner" to clean the heads and flush the system.  I have no 
idea if this is a "bad" thing or not or an indicator of possible misuse.  

Basically once I purchase this there is no warranty or return and I'd like to not have $250 
+ink printer that is useless.  
Is there a chance the ink heads could be damaged given the dye sub history?

Is there an obvious clue, given it's untestable state, to look for that by visual inspection 
should cause me to reject this purchase?

Or would buying the 110ml sized ink set and plugging them in be the only way to know 
for sure I'm not buying a lemon?

Thanks!

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "s.traudt" <steve@...> wrote:

>
> Hi. I have had the 4000 since they first came out. $250 is a great
> price, but keep in mind the following. Depending on how bad the
> nozzles are clogged, you may need to do several cleanings. You may
> even need to do a "power flush" which uses up about $60 worth of ink.
> In order to do cleanings and/or a flush, you need a certain minumum
> amount of ink still in the cartridge. So you will need to spend some
> hundreds of dollars in order to see if you can get it going. It is a
> great printer when it is running. It really does like to be used very
> often, daily if possible. It is not a good printer if it only sees
> occasional use. Hope this helps.
> 
> steve
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "emanmb"
> <emanmb@> wrote:
> >
> > This is my first post to the list as I've not acquired a digital
> printer of professional standards, 
> > but have an opportunity to get an Epson 4000 for $250.  The seller,
> who is local, says he 
> > hasn't used it in a month, some inks are very low and one is empty
> so there's no chance to 
> > test it really.
> > Given the price it's quite tempting really, but I am wondering what
> those experienced users 
> > here think would be a nightmare scenario I could get myself into.
> > Thanks and below is the seller's description.
> > Eric
> > "This printer was last used about 1 month ago and it worked fine. 
> > There are 2 empty ink cartridges and the other are very very low. 
> > So it will need new ink. Additionally you will probably need to run
> the nozzle cleanings 
> > because it has been sitting so long. 
> > 
> > There are no cover doors for the ink slots. 
> > There is no paper roll feed in the back either. 
> > Although you can use roll paper if you make your own paper stand. 
> > 
> > This printer does have the network card installed."
> >
>

At 10:37 PM 6/11/2007, emanmb wrote:

>Is there an obvious clue, given it's untestable state, to look for 
>that by visual inspection
>should cause me to reject this purchase?
>
>Or would buying the 110ml sized ink set and plugging them in be the 
>only way to know
>for sure I'm not buying a lemon?

Note that you don't need to immediately buy ink to replace those 
carts that are apparently full ... just the empties.

I sounds like a great price to me, with minimal risk.  If you want a 
17" printer, and will use it regularly, run, don't walk, to this deal.


	A r t h u r  .  F i n k  .  P h o t o g r a p h y
	-------------------------------------------------
	Ten New Island Avenue         . land 207.766.5722
	Peaks Island, Maine 04108     . cell 207.615.5722
	www.arthurfinkphoto.com  . af@...

	More dance images  www.f64gallery.com/arthur.html

Be mindful that the 4000 does not have the K3 ink set and therefore 
no Lt Lt Black. If you are going to print black & white images, 
forget it. Buy a 4800 which produces a much superior B&W image.

Gene

In a message dated 6/12/2007 1:41:20 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
emanmb@... writes:

Or would  buying the 110ml sized ink set and plugging them in be the only way 
to know  
for sure I'm not buying a  lemon?

Thanks!



Since this appears to be someone you know, invest in a set of cleaning  carts 
(Pantone sells them), and have your friend run them thru the printer.  
Apparently, from your first post, the printer WAS printing with the 220ml carts  
before being laid up. The 4000 is a very sturdy printer, but as Steve said, it's  
a machine that has to be used frequently. If you are not going to be printing 
on  a regular basis, one of the 13 inch desktops might be a better way to go.
 
Richard (Brooklyn)



************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

In a message dated 6/12/2007 9:10:37 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
elcoggins@... writes:

Be  mindful that the 4000 does not have the K3 ink set and therefore 
no Lt Lt  Black. If you are going to print black & white images, 
forget it. Buy  a 4800 which produces a much superior B&W  image.

Gene



For $250? I'll take THAT one!
 
Richard (Brooklyn)



************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I couldn't agree more.  For $250 I'd be tempted to have it shipped to me
here in the UK!

David Whistance

  -----Original Message-----
  From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of
CorrPro96@...
  Sent: 12 June 2007 14:25
  To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
  Subject: Re: [Digital BW] Re: Epson 4000 Purchase Question



  In a message dated 6/12/2007 9:10:37 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
  elcoggins@... writes:

  Be mindful that the 4000 does not have the K3 ink set and therefore
  no Lt Lt Black. If you are going to print black & white images,
  forget it. Buy a 4800 which produces a much superior B&W image.

  Gene

  For $250? I'll take THAT one!

  Richard (Brooklyn)

  ************************************** See what's free at
http://www.aol.com.

  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



  


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I don´t think the difference is *THAT* big on matte paper.

I compared a print i did on a 2400 (ABW) with a print (same image) on my 4000 with QTR 
and actually preferred the print done on the 4000. The 2400 print had deeper blacks though.

I know this doesnt prove anything, but the difference between the two did not blow me away.

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Eugene Coggins <elcoggins@...> 
wrote:

>
> Be mindful that the 4000 does not have the K3 ink set and therefore 
> no Lt Lt Black. If you are going to print black & white images, 
> forget it. Buy a 4800 which produces a much superior B&W image.
> 
> Gene
>

When something appears too good to be true...

You might ask the seller why it's being sold for less than the current 
market price for a used machine. There could be lots of valid reasons, 
e.g., lives in a cabin away from the markets, is a friend, want's a 
date, is fed up, and so on. Just ask; if he says he'll be happy to sell 
it for more, gently keep inquiring until he says something useful or 
says it's for personal reasons.

Thank you to all that replied to my question about the Epson 4000.  Learning that the K3 
inks can't be used was one of my deciding factors in passing on this offering.  All your 
comments were very helpful and informative.

In figuring out the startup costs, I realized that I would need to spend an extra $600-800 
just to find out IF the printer was operating to my specifications and IF it would work well, 
as basically there is no ink in the printer presently and it has been offline for a month or 
more.  
If I were to decide on this model printer in my first professional foray out of the analog 
darkroom, I would get one that is up and running that wouldn't cost much more.

Since many folks found this guy's offer as tempting as I did, here's the link to it.  Living in 
or near Chicago will probably be a necessity as I doubt he wants to ship an 85lb 
printer...but then maybe he would.  
http://chicago.craigslist.org/chc/sys/348053274.html

FYI, I don't know this person, he seemed very nice on the phone, I receive no renumeration 
for this referal, and I haven't seen this item in person.

Thanks again for all the help!

Eric  


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "michael3442" 
<michael3442@...> wrote:

>
> When something appears too good to be true...
> 
> You might ask the seller why it's being sold for less than the current 
> market price for a used machine. There could be lots of valid reasons, 
> e.g., lives in a cabin away from the markets, is a friend, want's a 
> date, is fed up, and so on. Just ask; if he says he'll be happy to sell 
> it for more, gently keep inquiring until he says something useful or 
> says it's for personal reasons.
>