Digital BW, The Print

Anybody tried these carts?

http://www.efillink.com/Epson/EpsonCartridge.html

They seem to be readily available on Ebay, so I was thinking of buying
a couple sets. Obviously, if they are prone to issues, then I'd pass.

If you scroll to the bottom of the page, you'll see the empty carts.

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "guy_staley"
<guy_staley@...> wrote:

>
> Anybody tried these carts?
> 
> http://www.efillink.com/Epson/EpsonCartridge.html
> 
> They seem to be readily available on Ebay, so I was thinking of buying
> a couple sets. Obviously, if they are prone to issues, then I'd pass.
>

The carts sold by efillink are not empty.  I gather they had too many
problems with people not knowing how to fill them, so now they only
sell pre-filled carts.

If you look through this forum in recent days, you will see a thread
about the 2400 pre-filled refillables from this source.  They seem to
work for the 2400, but they do drop a bit of ink when first used.  For
some people it's not too bad, but others have had more drop than they
like.  You need to contact Ronnie for instructions about how to
prevent this, by getting some air into the vent chamber.  If you
refill in situ, it's a one time thing.

All these carts come from China, and there is a failure rate.  I would
plan on getting several sets to beat the odds, no matter where you buy
them from.  

If you want to refill in situ, you will need auto-reset chips on the
carts.  I do wonder if some of the problems you sometimes see reported
regarding MIS cart problems are caused by needing to remove them to
refill and reset them.

F_P

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "guy_staley"
<guy_staley@...> wrote:

>
> If you scroll to the bottom of the page, you'll see the empty carts.
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "guy_staley"
> <guy_staley@> wrote:
> >
> > Anybody tried these carts?
> > 
> > http://www.efillink.com/Epson/EpsonCartridge.html
> > 
> > They seem to be readily available on Ebay, so I was thinking of buying
> > a couple sets. Obviously, if they are prone to issues, then I'd pass.
> >
>

Sorry, I was getting confused about which forum I was in.  The thread
was in http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/EPSON_Printers/

F_P

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "ferdinand_paris"
<ferdinand_paris@...> wrote:
>
> The carts sold by efillink are not empty.  I gather they had too many
> problems with people not knowing how to fill them, so now they only
> sell pre-filled carts.
> 
> If you look through this forum in recent days, you will see a thread
> about the 2400 pre-filled refillables from this source.  They seem to
> work for the 2400, but they do drop a bit of ink when first used.  For
> some people it's not too bad, but others have had more drop than they
> like.  You need to contact Ronnie for instructions about how to
> prevent this, by getting some air into the vent chamber.  If you
> refill in situ, it's a one time thing.
> 
> All these carts come from China, and there is a failure rate.  I would
> plan on getting several sets to beat the odds, no matter where you buy
> them from.  
> 
> If you want to refill in situ, you will need auto-reset chips on the
> carts.  I do wonder if some of the problems you sometimes see reported
> regarding MIS cart problems are caused by needing to remove them to
> refill and reset them.
> 
> F_P
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "guy_staley"
> <guy_staley@> wrote:
> >
> > If you scroll to the bottom of the page, you'll see the empty carts.
> > 
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "guy_staley"
> > <guy_staley@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Anybody tried these carts?
> > > 
> > > http://www.efillink.com/Epson/EpsonCartridge.html
> > > 
> > > They seem to be readily available on Ebay, so I was thinking of
buying
> > > a couple sets. Obviously, if they are prone to issues, then I'd
pass.

> > >
> >
>

Thanks for the info.

Actually, they do sell empty carts. If you follow the link I gave and
scroll down to the bottom, you will see the empty carts(as per my
follow-up post). Also, these same carts are for sale(from the same
vendor) on Ebay for half the price of their website(i.e. - $25.00 for
a set of 7 cartridges).

What does it mean to "drop a bit of ink when first used"?

Also, who is "Ronnie"?

I think I may go ahead and order a few sets while they're still
available. At circa $3.50 per cart, it's worth the gamble to keep my
2200 running quad-tone inks for the foreseeable future.

Thanks again,
Guy


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "ferdinand_paris"
<ferdinand_paris@...> wrote:
>
> The carts sold by efillink are not empty.  I gather they had too many
> problems with people not knowing how to fill them, so now they only
> sell pre-filled carts.
> 
> If you look through this forum in recent days, you will see a thread
> about the 2400 pre-filled refillables from this source.  They seem to
> work for the 2400, but they do drop a bit of ink when first used.  For
> some people it's not too bad, but others have had more drop than they
> like.  You need to contact Ronnie for instructions about how to
> prevent this, by getting some air into the vent chamber.  If you
> refill in situ, it's a one time thing.
> 
> All these carts come from China, and there is a failure rate.  I would
> plan on getting several sets to beat the odds, no matter where you buy
> them from.  
> 
> If you want to refill in situ, you will need auto-reset chips on the
> carts.  I do wonder if some of the problems you sometimes see reported
> regarding MIS cart problems are caused by needing to remove them to
> refill and reset them.
> 
> F_P
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "guy_staley"
> <guy_staley@> wrote:
> >
> > If you scroll to the bottom of the page, you'll see the empty carts.
> > 
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "guy_staley"
> > <guy_staley@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Anybody tried these carts?
> > > 
> > > http://www.efillink.com/Epson/EpsonCartridge.html
> > > 
> > > They seem to be readily available on Ebay, so I was thinking of
buying
> > > a couple sets. Obviously, if they are prone to issues, then I'd
pass.

> > >
> >
>

I did purchase a set from eBay for my R1800.

Loaded only one cart with ink. I was not aware that they could "drop a
bit of ink when first used" at the time. When I printed with it, my
paper was smeared with ink on the borders. After 3-4 prints I
concluded that the cart was defective and removed it.

I have to say I will not try again as I don't like that amount of ink
leaking in my printer.

Denis Bouchard

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "guy_staley"
<guy_staley@...> wrote:

>

> 
> What does it mean to "drop a bit of ink when first used"?
> 

> >
>

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "the_des_bois" <thedesbois@...> 
wrote:
>
> I did purchase a set from eBay for my R1800.
> 
> Loaded only one cart with ink. I was not aware that they could "drop a
> bit of ink when first used" at the time. When I printed with it, my
> paper was smeared with ink on the borders. After 3-4 prints I
> concluded that the cart was defective and removed it.
> 
> I have to say I will not try again as I don't like that amount of ink
> leaking in my printer.

If you look at a clear cart for that design you see a spring loaded ball that should seat with 
pressure from the spring and close off all flow through the port when the cart is out.  In 
hydraulics it is known as a simple "spring loaded check ball".  When the cart is installed 
the check ball is lifted and the print head makes a seal with a rubber gasket.  Lifting the 
cart out the spring pressure should re-insert the ball into the seat and flow is cut off.

The seal is completely dependent on the seat and the ball and print head mating surfaces, 
both the seal made with the ball and seat, and the printhead and seat.  I haven't looked 
closely enough to see if the ball and  printhead seats are using the same piece of material 
or not.  I suspect that they are and it is simply a double sided seal.

That said, two things can happen, the rigid part of the seal, the ball or the print head are 
deformed and break the seal or the rubber seal is deformed or displaced and the seal is 
broken.  I suspect the rubber seal.

I found with MIS spongeless carts that that seal was bad on about ten percent of the carts.  
My  solution was to buy extra carts and remove them at the first sign of leakage and 
replace them and write off the cost.  They also tended to exhibit the leak almost 
immediately.

With this style of cart from the internet supplier mentioned in the thread (and they all look 
to be they same whether from Hong Kong or  other domestic suppliers) but are different 
from the MIS carts it might be nice to get a survey from the group as to what percentage 
might be leakers so that we can make a decision as to whether or not they are worth the 
trouble.

On another note Paul Roark has mentioned a few times that he has found that fiddling the 
ball and seat has stopped some leakers.  That would make perfect sense if the rubber seat 
has simply been installed sloppily and the fiddling pops some edge over a lip or 
something similar.  Personally I've got a stash of extra carts and hate fiddling with 'em.  
(it's too close to how I earn my living where this is supposed to be fun;)  but for those 
inclined that is surely worth a try.  As carts get more difficult to find we could all be there 
or back in Epson's pocket and dependent on the inks they want to give us.  I don't doubt 
that Epson has better quality control than knockoffs but we know what that costs.

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "guy_staley"
<guy_staley@...> wrote:
> Actually, they do sell empty carts. If you follow the link I gave
> and scroll down to the bottom, you will see the empty carts(as per 
> my follow-up post).

That's what I initially thought too.  The picture is of empty
cartridges, but the text says "Try our easyrefill cartridge
**prefilled** with our Archival Pigment Inks."  This would partly
explain the price difference.

> Also, these same carts are for sale(from the same
> vendor) on Ebay for half the price of their website(i.e. - $25.00 
> for a set of 7 cartridges).

efillink claim not to sell empties any more (people couldn't fill them
properly), so I'm not sure it's the same supplier.  There was an e-bay
seller I found, but who only sold 8 carts for R2400, i.e. you didn't
get both blacks, whereas efillink do supply 9.  I thus conclude that
it wasn't efillink in a different guise.  Have you got a link for this
e-bay site that you think is efillink's alter-ego?

> What does it mean to "drop a bit of ink when first used"?

The idea is to print a series of purge pattern pages.  If all goes
well, you will get a few drops of ink on the first few pages but them
it stops.  The issue is that the air intake passage below the vent
hole in the cart is supposed to be free of air in order to maintain
the negative pressure to keep the ink in the cart, but the prefilled
carts don't ship that way.  Ether it drains on the first few pages, or
you find a way to drain it before you start to use the cart.  To find
out how, talk to ...

> Also, who is "Ronnie"?

Owner of efillink.  He provides live help via Skype.

> I think I may go ahead and order a few sets while they're still
> available. At circa $3.50 per cart, it's worth the gamble to keep my
> 2200 running quad-tone inks for the foreseeable future.

For the 2200, I bought some carts from
http://www.mandev.co.uk/acatalog/Epson_2100_Empty_Carts.html, which
don't seem to have the initial leak problem.

F_P

Thanks FP for the thoughtful reply. I see now that you are right about
the efillink.com website cartridges: they are indeed pre-filled.

Here is a link to one of the ebay auctions to which I referred:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=260202114862&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=016

I'm pretty certain it's the same folks. In fact, in the seller's
feedback, someone even writes "Thanks Ronnie!" Also, there are links
to the efillink.com website in the listing, as well as pictures of
their CIS systems. If it's not efillink.com, then they are certainly
selling identical products/cartridges.

And thanks for the link to the alternate source of empty cartridges;
unfortunately, that company is located in the UK, and I'm afraid
shipping would be pretty costly.

Ciao!

-Guy

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "ferdinand_paris"
<ferdinand_paris@...> wrote:

>
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "guy_staley"
> <guy_staley@> wrote:
> > Actually, they do sell empty carts. If you follow the link I gave
> > and scroll down to the bottom, you will see the empty carts(as per 
> > my follow-up post).
> 
> That's what I initially thought too.  The picture is of empty
> cartridges, but the text says "Try our easyrefill cartridge
> **prefilled** with our Archival Pigment Inks."  This would partly
> explain the price difference.
> 
> > Also, these same carts are for sale(from the same
> > vendor) on Ebay for half the price of their website(i.e. - $25.00 
> > for a set of 7 cartridges).
> 
> efillink claim not to sell empties any more (people couldn't fill them
> properly), so I'm not sure it's the same supplier.  There was an e-bay
> seller I found, but who only sold 8 carts for R2400, i.e. you didn't
> get both blacks, whereas efillink do supply 9.  I thus conclude that
> it wasn't efillink in a different guise.  Have you got a link for this
> e-bay site that you think is efillink's alter-ego?
> 
> > What does it mean to "drop a bit of ink when first used"?
> 
> The idea is to print a series of purge pattern pages.  If all goes
> well, you will get a few drops of ink on the first few pages but them
> it stops.  The issue is that the air intake passage below the vent
> hole in the cart is supposed to be free of air in order to maintain
> the negative pressure to keep the ink in the cart, but the prefilled
> carts don't ship that way.  Ether it drains on the first few pages, or
> you find a way to drain it before you start to use the cart.  To find
> out how, talk to ...
> 
> > Also, who is "Ronnie"?
> 
> Owner of efillink.  He provides live help via Skype.
> 
> > I think I may go ahead and order a few sets while they're still
> > available. At circa $3.50 per cart, it's worth the gamble to keep my
> > 2200 running quad-tone inks for the foreseeable future.
> 
> For the 2200, I bought some carts from
> http://www.mandev.co.uk/acatalog/Epson_2100_Empty_Carts.html, which
> don't seem to have the initial leak problem.
> 
> F_P
>

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "guy_staley"
<guy_staley@...> wrote:
> I'm pretty certain it's the same folks. In fact, in the seller's
> feedback, someone even writes "Thanks Ronnie!" Also, there are links
> to the efillink.com website in the listing, as well as pictures of
> their CIS systems. If it's not efillink.com, then they are certainly
> selling identical products/cartridges.

You're 100% right.  It is efillink.  I searched for this but could not
find it.  Just lurv the e-bay search engine.
 
> And thanks for the link to the alternate source of empty cartridges;
> unfortunately, that company is located in the UK, and I'm afraid
> shipping would be pretty costly.

When I bought these, I was a very long way from the UK, and by post
they arrived quick and cheap.  Same way that efillink send theirs from
HK.  Things priced in pounds stirling can be expensive in some other
currencies, but it's still not that bad.

F_P

I ordered 2 sets of prefilled 2400 carts from the efillink internet 
site - They did not work well at all.  I had ink drops of numerous 
colors for most of the time I had them installed.  I followed the 
directions provided, even corresponded with Ronnie. Out of one set of 
carts, I got a total of one 11x14 and two 8x10s without ink blobs on 
them. I probably printed well over 50 purge patterns (all with ink 
blobs) trying to clear the problem. Then I noted that 4 carts were 
completely empty while others like Light Magenta (that I usually use 
most of) still had about 40-50% of the ink remaining. Much ink in the 
printer also; in fact most probably in the printer - I tried to soak 
up as much as I could with absorbant paper - thought maybe the leaks 
would eventually stop, as advertised. 
I liked the ink color; didn't like the carts.  Won't use the 2nd set 
of carts and the company apparently won't stand behind them.

dan

--- In 
DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "ferdinand_paris" 
<ferdinand_paris@...> wrote:
>
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "guy_staley"
> <guy_staley@> wrote:
> > Actually, they do sell empty carts. If you follow the link I gave
> > and scroll down to the bottom, you will see the empty carts(as 
per 
> > my follow-up post).
> 
> That's what I initially thought too.  The picture is of empty
> cartridges, but the text says "Try our easyrefill cartridge
> **prefilled** with our Archival Pigment Inks."  This would partly
> explain the price difference.
> 
> > Also, these same carts are for sale(from the same
> > vendor) on Ebay for half the price of their website(i.e. - $25.00 
> > for a set of 7 cartridges).
> 
> efillink claim not to sell empties any more (people couldn't fill 
them
> properly), so I'm not sure it's the same supplier.  There was an e-
bay
> seller I found, but who only sold 8 carts for R2400, i.e. you didn't
> get both blacks, whereas efillink do supply 9.  I thus conclude that
> it wasn't efillink in a different guise.  Have you got a link for 
this
> e-bay site that you think is efillink's alter-ego?
> 
> > What does it mean to "drop a bit of ink when first used"?
> 
> The idea is to print a series of purge pattern pages.  If all goes
> well, you will get a few drops of ink on the first few pages but 
them
> it stops.  The issue is that the air intake passage below the vent
> hole in the cart is supposed to be free of air in order to maintain
> the negative pressure to keep the ink in the cart, but the prefilled
> carts don't ship that way.  Ether it drains on the first few pages, 
or
> you find a way to drain it before you start to use the cart.  To 
find
> out how, talk to ...
> 
> > Also, who is "Ronnie"?
> 
> Owner of efillink.  He provides live help via Skype.
> 
> > I think I may go ahead and order a few sets while they're still
> > available. At circa $3.50 per cart, it's worth the gamble to keep 
my

> > 2200 running quad-tone inks for the foreseeable future.
> 
> For the 2200, I bought some carts from
> http://www.mandev.co.uk/acatalog/Epson_2100_Empty_Carts.html, which
> don't seem to have the initial leak problem.
> 
> F_P
>

Hello Dan,

>I ordered 2 sets of prefilled 2400 carts from the efillink internet 
>site - They did not work well at all.  I had ink drops of numerous 
>colors for most of the time I had them installed.  I followed the 
>directions provided, even corresponded with Ronnie. Out of one set 
>of carts, I got a total of one 11x14 and two 8x10s without ink blobs 
>on them. I probably printed well over 50 purge patterns (all with 
>ink blobs) trying to clear the problem. Then I noted that 4 carts 
>were completely empty while others like Light Magenta (that I 
>usually use most of) still had about 40-50% of the ink remaining. 

>Much ink in the printer also; in fact most probably in the printer -
>I tried to soak up as much as I could with absorbant paper - 
>thought maybe the leaks would eventually stop, as advertised. 

>I liked the ink color; didn't like the carts.  Won't use the 2nd set 
>of carts and the company apparently won't stand behind them.

Thanks for the report.  Hopefully this will help others avoid this trap.

Regards,
Clayton


Info on black and white digital printing at    
http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm
I-Trak

Ron:
How are you? I hope al is well with everyone.

Can you please explain this negative statement about efillink?

Thanks,

Charlie

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Clayton Jones 
  To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Sunday, January 27, 2008 7:13 PM
  Subject: [Digital BW] Bad Carts for 2400 (was Spongeless carts for 2200)


  Hello Dan,

  >I ordered 2 sets of prefilled 2400 carts from the efillink internet 
  >site - They did not work well at all. I had ink drops of numerous 
  >colors for most of the time I had them installed. I followed the 
  >directions provided, even corresponded with Ronnie. Out of one set 
  >of carts, I got a total of one 11x14 and two 8x10s without ink blobs 
  >on them. I probably printed well over 50 purge patterns (all with 
  >ink blobs) trying to clear the problem. Then I noted that 4 carts 
  >were completely empty while others like Light Magenta (that I 
  >usually use most of) still had about 40-50% of the ink remaining. 

  >Much ink in the printer also; in fact most probably in the printer -
  >I tried to soak up as much as I could with absorbant paper - 
  >thought maybe the leaks would eventually stop, as advertised. 

  >I liked the ink color; didn't like the carts. Won't use the 2nd set 
  >of carts and the company apparently won't stand behind them.

  Thanks for the report. Hopefully this will help others avoid this trap.

  Regards,
  Clayton

  Info on black and white digital printing at 
  http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm
  I-Trak



   


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

This is uncannily similar to my experience.

I too bought 2 sets of the cartridges.  I put in the first set.  I had
a lot of problems with ink leaking.  A lot.  Not just on the paper,
but also around the printer.  Just when I thought that the problem had
slowed after many days and many many purge patterns, I discovered that
the LM & LC carts had emptied themselves.  The rest were still over
half full.  I.e. same thing.

I put this down to bad luck at the time.  When you get a lot of ink
loss, you do things to try and understand why, (removing and
reinserting the carts, under-head cleaning - which prompts a vigorous
head clean when the printer is plugged in and turned on again), and I
thought perhaps that I had done something to exacerbate the problem. 

I tried to prime the second LM & LC carts before I used them, by
drawing some ink out of the fill holes in order to draw air into the
vent holes.  This seemed to work as efillink says it should.  There
were a few drips on the paper, but not many, and by printing a few
purge patterns over several days and avoiding head cleans, I
eventually had a good nozzle check.  I profiled the new inks and made
a print.  All seemed well.  However a few days later I found that the
LM and LK carts are empty!  These two carts have drained themselves. 
The LM for the second time!  The rest are still around half full,
except for the LC, which having been replaced was still nearly full.

This time I can't see where the ink has gone.  Not in drips on the
page and not around the printer, as far as I can see.  I can only
guess that they were drained when sitting on the cleaning station.  I
had turned the printer off, leaving the fill plugs in and the vent
plugs out, which is how I thought you were supposed to leave them. 
For the two replacement carts, the only head clean was the one that
the printer insists on when a new cart is inserted.  Otherwise it was
just purge patterns and nozzle checks. 

So what is going on?  It does seem to me, and Ronnie agrees, that some
of the carts are faulty.  The second experience suggests that there is
a small air leak somewhere, so that capillary action when the head was
parked on the cleaning station drained the carts.  In the first case
there was clearly a larger air leak such that the ink just drained out
of the LM & LC cartridges.

So, what leak?  There could have been a problem with the cartridge
seals around the ink nipples (the spikes that puncture the ink
cartridges), or there could be an internal leak so that air was being
drawn in bypassing the air intake passage that these carts have.  If
the air intake passage is bypassed, then the negative pressure that
this passage creates to keep the air in won't be created.

I am more inclined to suspect the seals.  The LK cart did not
initially drain.  When I realised the initial problem of the LC and LM
  carts having drained, I of course had to remove all the carts to
check the others, and the half-full LK only drained via the cleaning
station once reinserted.  I do wonder if a little Windex that I used
on the ink nipples might have affected the seals, but it's not
supposed to.

This is my first post here, but reading past messages, I have noted
some negative comments about Ronnie, who also posts here.  This is not
my experience.  He has been very generous with his time, via Skype and
email, to help me work through these problems.  I have lost faith in
the carts, but I have accepted a good offer on a CIS.  Some people
will think I am throwing good money after bad, but there are some very
good reports around about his CIS, particularly on French sites. 
Reading the forums, the current batch of CIS do see to have a better
reputation than the carts.

From reading past messages, I can't see that efillink is all that
different to MIS.  Both have problems with a small proportion of
defective carts.  This seems to be an occupational hazard with
ordering a large batch from China.  The leaks, when they do occur,
seem worse with efillink carts, but I have to say, having read the
reports of unresponsiveness from MIS, my experience of service from
efillink is better.  I could not agree with the statement that "the
company apparently won't stand behind them".

There are enough posts on this forum, including from three recent
users that I could count, to suggest that when the carts work, they do
work as advertised. Most of mine did.

I'm sorry about such a long posting on a B&W group which is not
specifically B&W.  There is an Epson group I understand, but there did
seem to be a bit of momentum here on this issue.

Brian D


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "dbhull97459"
<d_hull@...> wrote:

>
> I ordered 2 sets of prefilled 2400 carts from the efillink internet 
> site - They did not work well at all.  I had ink drops of numerous 
> colors for most of the time I had them installed.  I followed the 
> directions provided, even corresponded with Ronnie. Out of one set of 
> carts, I got a total of one 11x14 and two 8x10s without ink blobs on 
> them. I probably printed well over 50 purge patterns (all with ink 
> blobs) trying to clear the problem. Then I noted that 4 carts were 
> completely empty while others like Light Magenta (that I usually use 
> most of) still had about 40-50% of the ink remaining. Much ink in the 
> printer also; in fact most probably in the printer - I tried to soak 
> up as much as I could with absorbant paper - thought maybe the leaks 
> would eventually stop, as advertised. 
> I liked the ink color; didn't like the carts.  Won't use the 2nd set 
> of carts and the company apparently won't stand behind them.
> 
> dan

I thought I would conclude this topic by reporting on my experiences.
   I accepted a very generous offer from efillink to upgrade to a CIS.
 Both the CIS and inks were shipped (internationally) in days.  I've
installed the CIS, which went very smoothly by following the video and
printed instructions carefully.  I got a clean nozzle check and purge
pattern very quickly and easily.  I've been printing merrily for days
and am rather pleased with the system.  I guess time will tell, but so
far there's no clogging, banding, or dripping.  Just prints.  Also,
the CIS colour and styling match the R2400 rather well.

So the final score is a negative for the efillink refillable arts, a
plus the CIS and a double plus for the service and support from Ronnie
and efillink when I had a problem.  The CIS may also get a double plus
if it keeps behaving as it currently is.  Like many before them, I
gather that efillink is changing cartridge suppliers in light of the
problems that Dan & I have had.

One good thing about the efillink CIS is that the bottles are low and
wide.  What this means is that as the ink level in the CIS drops, it's
way easier to keep the level of the CIS correct relative to the
cartridges.

Brian D.


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "brian_downunda"
<brian_downunda@...> wrote:

>
> This is uncannily similar to my experience.
> 
> I too bought 2 sets of the cartridges.  I put in the first set.  I had
> a lot of problems with ink leaking.  A lot.  Not just on the paper,
> but also around the printer.  Just when I thought that the problem had
> slowed after many days and many many purge patterns, I discovered that
> the LM & LC carts had emptied themselves.  The rest were still over
> half full.  I.e. same thing.
> 
> I put this down to bad luck at the time.  When you get a lot of ink
> loss, you do things to try and understand why, (removing and
> reinserting the carts, under-head cleaning - which prompts a vigorous
> head clean when the printer is plugged in and turned on again), and I
> thought perhaps that I had done something to exacerbate the problem. 
> 
> I tried to prime the second LM & LC carts before I used them, by
> drawing some ink out of the fill holes in order to draw air into the
> vent holes.  This seemed to work as efillink says it should.  There
> were a few drips on the paper, but not many, and by printing a few
> purge patterns over several days and avoiding head cleans, I
> eventually had a good nozzle check.  I profiled the new inks and made
> a print.  All seemed well.  However a few days later I found that the
> LM and LK carts are empty!  These two carts have drained themselves. 
> The LM for the second time!  The rest are still around half full,
> except for the LC, which having been replaced was still nearly full.
> 
> This time I can't see where the ink has gone.  Not in drips on the
> page and not around the printer, as far as I can see.  I can only
> guess that they were drained when sitting on the cleaning station.  I
> had turned the printer off, leaving the fill plugs in and the vent
> plugs out, which is how I thought you were supposed to leave them. 
> For the two replacement carts, the only head clean was the one that
> the printer insists on when a new cart is inserted.  Otherwise it was
> just purge patterns and nozzle checks. 
> 
> So what is going on?  It does seem to me, and Ronnie agrees, that some
> of the carts are faulty.  The second experience suggests that there is
> a small air leak somewhere, so that capillary action when the head was
> parked on the cleaning station drained the carts.  In the first case
> there was clearly a larger air leak such that the ink just drained out
> of the LM & LC cartridges.
> 
> So, what leak?  There could have been a problem with the cartridge
> seals around the ink nipples (the spikes that puncture the ink
> cartridges), or there could be an internal leak so that air was being
> drawn in bypassing the air intake passage that these carts have.  If
> the air intake passage is bypassed, then the negative pressure that
> this passage creates to keep the air in won't be created.
> 
> I am more inclined to suspect the seals.  The LK cart did not
> initially drain.  When I realised the initial problem of the LC and LM
>   carts having drained, I of course had to remove all the carts to
> check the others, and the half-full LK only drained via the cleaning
> station once reinserted.  I do wonder if a little Windex that I used
> on the ink nipples might have affected the seals, but it's not
> supposed to.
> 
> This is my first post here, but reading past messages, I have noted
> some negative comments about Ronnie, who also posts here.  This is not
> my experience.  He has been very generous with his time, via Skype and
> email, to help me work through these problems.  I have lost faith in
> the carts, but I have accepted a good offer on a CIS.  Some people
> will think I am throwing good money after bad, but there are some very
> good reports around about his CIS, particularly on French sites. 
> Reading the forums, the current batch of CIS do see to have a better
> reputation than the carts.
> 
> From reading past messages, I can't see that efillink is all that
> different to MIS.  Both have problems with a small proportion of
> defective carts.  This seems to be an occupational hazard with
> ordering a large batch from China.  The leaks, when they do occur,
> seem worse with efillink carts, but I have to say, having read the
> reports of unresponsiveness from MIS, my experience of service from
> efillink is better.  I could not agree with the statement that "the
> company apparently won't stand behind them".
> 
> There are enough posts on this forum, including from three recent
> users that I could count, to suggest that when the carts work, they do
> work as advertised. Most of mine did.
> 
> I'm sorry about such a long posting on a B&W group which is not
> specifically B&W.  There is an Epson group I understand, but there did
> seem to be a bit of momentum here on this issue.
> 
> Brian D
> 
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "dbhull97459"
> <d_hull@> wrote:
> >
> > I ordered 2 sets of prefilled 2400 carts from the efillink internet 
> > site - They did not work well at all.  I had ink drops of numerous 
> > colors for most of the time I had them installed.  I followed the 
> > directions provided, even corresponded with Ronnie. Out of one set of 
> > carts, I got a total of one 11x14 and two 8x10s without ink blobs on 
> > them. I probably printed well over 50 purge patterns (all with ink 
> > blobs) trying to clear the problem. Then I noted that 4 carts were 
> > completely empty while others like Light Magenta (that I usually use 
> > most of) still had about 40-50% of the ink remaining. Much ink in the 
> > printer also; in fact most probably in the printer - I tried to soak 
> > up as much as I could with absorbant paper - thought maybe the leaks 
> > would eventually stop, as advertised. 
> > I liked the ink color; didn't like the carts.  Won't use the 2nd set 
> > of carts and the company apparently won't stand behind them.
> > 
> > dan
>

I have been using this system in my 2400 since 06/26/2007 with great results.
Charlie

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: brian_downunda 
  To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Monday, February 11, 2008 5:54 AM
  Subject: [Digital BW] Re: Spongeless carts for 2200...


  I thought I would conclude this topic by reporting on my experiences.
  I accepted a very generous offer from efillink to upgrade to a CIS.
  Both the CIS and inks were shipped (internationally) in days. I've
  installed the CIS, which went very smoothly by following the video and
  printed instructions carefully. I got a clean nozzle check and purge
  pattern very quickly and easily. I've been printing merrily for days
  and am rather pleased with the system. I guess time will tell, but so
  far there's no clogging, banding, or dripping. Just prints. Also,
  the CIS colour and styling match the R2400 rather well.

  So the final score is a negative for the efillink refillable arts, a
  plus the CIS and a double plus for the service and support from Ronnie
  and efillink when I had a problem. The CIS may also get a double plus
  if it keeps behaving as it currently is. Like many before them, I
  gather that efillink is changing cartridge suppliers in light of the
  problems that Dan & I have had.

  One good thing about the efillink CIS is that the bottles are low and
  wide. What this means is that as the ink level in the CIS drops, it's
  way easier to keep the level of the CIS correct relative to the
  cartridges.

  Brian D.

  --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "brian_downunda"
  <brian_downunda@...> wrote:
  >
  > This is uncannily similar to my experience.
  > 
  > I too bought 2 sets of the cartridges. I put in the first set. I had
  > a lot of problems with ink leaking. A lot. Not just on the paper,
  > but also around the printer. Just when I thought that the problem had
  > slowed after many days and many many purge patterns, I discovered that
  > the LM & LC carts had emptied themselves. The rest were still over
  > half full. I.e. same thing.
  > 
  > I put this down to bad luck at the time. When you get a lot of ink
  > loss, you do things to try and understand why, (removing and
  > reinserting the carts, under-head cleaning - which prompts a vigorous
  > head clean when the printer is plugged in and turned on again), and I
  > thought perhaps that I had done something to exacerbate the problem. 
  > 
  > I tried to prime the second LM & LC carts before I used them, by
  > drawing some ink out of the fill holes in order to draw air into the
  > vent holes. This seemed to work as efillink says it should. There
  > were a few drips on the paper, but not many, and by printing a few
  > purge patterns over several days and avoiding head cleans, I
  > eventually had a good nozzle check. I profiled the new inks and made
  > a print. All seemed well. However a few days later I found that the
  > LM and LK carts are empty! These two carts have drained themselves. 
  > The LM for the second time! The rest are still around half full,
  > except for the LC, which having been replaced was still nearly full.
  > 
  > This time I can't see where the ink has gone. Not in drips on the
  > page and not around the printer, as far as I can see. I can only
  > guess that they were drained when sitting on the cleaning station. I
  > had turned the printer off, leaving the fill plugs in and the vent
  > plugs out, which is how I thought you were supposed to leave them. 
  > For the two replacement carts, the only head clean was the one that
  > the printer insists on when a new cart is inserted. Otherwise it was
  > just purge patterns and nozzle checks. 
  > 
  > So what is going on? It does seem to me, and Ronnie agrees, that some
  > of the carts are faulty. The second experience suggests that there is
  > a small air leak somewhere, so that capillary action when the head was
  > parked on the cleaning station drained the carts. In the first case
  > there was clearly a larger air leak such that the ink just drained out
  > of the LM & LC cartridges.
  > 
  > So, what leak? There could have been a problem with the cartridge
  > seals around the ink nipples (the spikes that puncture the ink
  > cartridges), or there could be an internal leak so that air was being
  > drawn in bypassing the air intake passage that these carts have. If
  > the air intake passage is bypassed, then the negative pressure that
  > this passage creates to keep the air in won't be created.
  > 
  > I am more inclined to suspect the seals. The LK cart did not
  > initially drain. When I realised the initial problem of the LC and LM
  > carts having drained, I of course had to remove all the carts to
  > check the others, and the half-full LK only drained via the cleaning
  > station once reinserted. I do wonder if a little Windex that I used
  > on the ink nipples might have affected the seals, but it's not
  > supposed to.
  > 
  > This is my first post here, but reading past messages, I have noted
  > some negative comments about Ronnie, who also posts here. This is not
  > my experience. He has been very generous with his time, via Skype and
  > email, to help me work through these problems. I have lost faith in
  > the carts, but I have accepted a good offer on a CIS. Some people
  > will think I am throwing good money after bad, but there are some very
  > good reports around about his CIS, particularly on French sites. 
  > Reading the forums, the current batch of CIS do see to have a better
  > reputation than the carts.
  > 
  > From reading past messages, I can't see that efillink is all that
  > different to MIS. Both have problems with a small proportion of
  > defective carts. This seems to be an occupational hazard with
  > ordering a large batch from China. The leaks, when they do occur,
  > seem worse with efillink carts, but I have to say, having read the
  > reports of unresponsiveness from MIS, my experience of service from
  > efillink is better. I could not agree with the statement that "the
  > company apparently won't stand behind them".
  > 
  > There are enough posts on this forum, including from three recent
  > users that I could count, to suggest that when the carts work, they do
  > work as advertised. Most of mine did.
  > 
  > I'm sorry about such a long posting on a B&W group which is not
  > specifically B&W. There is an Epson group I understand, but there did
  > seem to be a bit of momentum here on this issue.
  > 
  > Brian D
  > 
  > 
  > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "dbhull97459"
  > <d_hull@> wrote:
  > >
  > > I ordered 2 sets of prefilled 2400 carts from the efillink internet 
  > > site - They did not work well at all. I had ink drops of numerous 
  > > colors for most of the time I had them installed. I followed the 
  > > directions provided, even corresponded with Ronnie. Out of one set of 
  > > carts, I got a total of one 11x14 and two 8x10s without ink blobs on 
  > > them. I probably printed well over 50 purge patterns (all with ink 
  > > blobs) trying to clear the problem. Then I noted that 4 carts were 
  > > completely empty while others like Light Magenta (that I usually use 
  > > most of) still had about 40-50% of the ink remaining. Much ink in the 
  > > printer also; in fact most probably in the printer - I tried to soak 
  > > up as much as I could with absorbant paper - thought maybe the leaks 
  > > would eventually stop, as advertised. 
  > > I liked the ink color; didn't like the carts. Won't use the 2nd set 
  > > of carts and the company apparently won't stand behind them.
  > > 
  > > dan
  >



   


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