Digital BW, The Print

If I were to make a set of flushing cartridges out of some refillable
cartridges, what would I use as the flushing agent - just distilled H2O ?

 

-----------------------------------------------------

Brian Corll



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Brian. I've used a variety of things. The distilled water will work
but it may be a bit more difficult to remove old ink that way.
Currently, I use a mix of about 15% glycerin, 84.5% distilled H2O and
1/2% clear ammonia by volume. If I'm cleaning an old cart thats been
around awhile or restoring an old printer's heads, I make the mix with
about 10% Tilex Clean Shower replacing an equal amount of H2O (The
Tilex contains a surfactant and isopropyl alcohol). 

Regards
Duane


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Brian Corll"
<briancorll@...> wrote:
>
> If I were to make a set of flushing cartridges out of some refillable
> cartridges, what would I use as the flushing agent - just distilled
H2O ?

> 
>  
> 
> -----------------------------------------------------
> 
> Brian Corll
> 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Hi Duane

Thanks for this information. The clear ammonia; how do you work that 
out? does it come in a pure form or is it in containers allready cut 
to say 3 to 10%?

Thanks Bob Shram

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "dlruckus" 
<dlruckus@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Brian. I've used a variety of things. The distilled water will 
work
> but it may be a bit more difficult to remove old ink that way.
> Currently, I use a mix of about 15% glycerin, 84.5% distilled H2O 
and
> 1/2% clear ammonia by volume. If I'm cleaning an old cart thats been
> around awhile or restoring an old printer's heads, I make the mix 
with
> about 10% Tilex Clean Shower replacing an equal amount of H2O (The
> Tilex contains a surfactant and isopropyl alcohol). 
> 
> Regards
> Duane
> 
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Brian Corll"
> <briancorll@> wrote:
> >
> > If I were to make a set of flushing cartridges out of some 
refillable
> > cartridges, what would I use as the flushing agent - just 
distilled

> H2O ?
> > 
> >  
> > 
> > -----------------------------------------------------
> > 
> > Brian Corll
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Brian Corll" 
<briancorll@...> wrote:
>
> If I were to make a set of flushing cartridges out of some 
refillable
> cartridges, what would I use as the flushing agent - just distilled 
H2O ?
> 
>  
> 
> -----------------------------------------------------
> 
> Brian Corll


Hi Brian,

I run 97% distilled water and 3% ammonia. Mix 3ml of ammonia with 
every 970 ml of distilled water.

This is what I use to flush my 4800 once a year.

If I were going to leave in the printer, such as in a B.O. set-up, 
I'd use just distilled water and use 3% glyceric instead of the 
ammonia. (I bought the glycerin at Wal_mart in pharmacy dept., that 
was 99.97% pure. It was only a few dollars for a 6oz. bottle.}

Scott

Thanks, Duane. Wow - Tilex - how did you come up with that one ? ! I'll give
the glycerin, H2O and ammonia a spin.

 

-----------------------------------------------------

Brian Corll

From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of dlruckus
Sent: Saturday, November 29, 2008 7:52 PM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Digital BW] Re: Making yourown flushing cartridges

 

Hi Brian. I've used a variety of things. The distilled water will work
but it may be a bit more difficult to remove old ink that way.
Currently, I use a mix of about 15% glycerin, 84.5% distilled H2O and
1/2% clear ammonia by volume. If I'm cleaning an old cart thats been
around awhile or restoring an old printer's heads, I make the mix with
about 10% Tilex Clean Shower replacing an equal amount of H2O (The
Tilex contains a surfactant and isopropyl alcohol). 

Regards
Duane

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint%40yahoogroups.com> , "Brian Corll"
<briancorll@...> wrote:
>
> If I were to make a set of flushing cartridges out of some refillable
> cartridges, what would I use as the flushing agent - just distilled
H2O ?
> 
> 
> 
> -----------------------------------------------------
> 
> Brian Corll
> 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Bob. It's the ordinary clear ammonia from the grocery store so is
precut. You wouldn't want it to be too corrosive. Be sure NOT to use
some of the brands containing other additives.

Regards
Duane




--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Shram"
<bobshram@...> wrote:

>
> Hi Duane
> 
> Thanks for this information. The clear ammonia; how do you work that 
> out? does it come in a pure form or is it in containers allready cut 
> to say 3 to 10%?
> 
> Thanks Bob Shram
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "dlruckus" 
> <dlruckus@> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Brian. I've used a variety of things. The distilled water will 
> work
> > but it may be a bit more difficult to remove old ink that way.
> > Currently, I use a mix of about 15% glycerin, 84.5% distilled H2O 
> and
> > 1/2% clear ammonia by volume. If I'm cleaning an old cart thats been
> > around awhile or restoring an old printer's heads, I make the mix 
> with
> > about 10% Tilex Clean Shower replacing an equal amount of H2O (The
> > Tilex contains a surfactant and isopropyl alcohol). 
> > 
> > Regards
> > Duane
> > 
> > 
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Brian Corll"
> > <briancorll@> wrote:
> > >
> > > If I were to make a set of flushing cartridges out of some 
> refillable
> > > cartridges, what would I use as the flushing agent - just 
> distilled
> > H2O ?
> > > 
> > >  
> > > 
> > > -----------------------------------------------------
> > > 
> > > Brian Corll
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> >
>

Brian,I was looking for commonly available products that contained
surfactants possibly suitable for use in ink dilutions.The Tilex MSDS
showed one of interest to me. That, along with the fact that it's only
other listed ingredient besides H2O was the isopropyl, led me to give
it a try. Unless you are a commercial or educational enterprise, it's
often difficult to get access to small quantities of this sort of
chemical.

Regards
Duane


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Brian Corll"
<briancorll@...> wrote:
>
> Wow - Tilex - how did you come up with that one ? ! 
> 
>  
> 
> -----------------------------------------------------
> 
> Brian Corll
> 
>  
> 
> From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
dlruckus

> Sent: Saturday, November 29, 2008 7:52 PM
> To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Digital BW] Re: Making yourown flushing cartridges
> 
>  
> 
> Hi Brian. I've used a variety of things. The distilled water will work
> but it may be a bit more difficult to remove old ink that way.
> Currently, I use a mix of about 15% glycerin, 84.5% distilled H2O and
> 1/2% clear ammonia by volume. If I'm cleaning an old cart thats been
> around awhile or restoring an old printer's heads, I make the mix with
> about 10% Tilex Clean Shower replacing an equal amount of H2O (The
> Tilex contains a surfactant and isopropyl alcohol). 
> 
> Regards
> Duane
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint%40yahoogroups.com> , "Brian Corll"
> <briancorll@> wrote:
> >
> > If I were to make a set of flushing cartridges out of some refillable
> > cartridges, what would I use as the flushing agent - just distilled
> H2O ?
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -----------------------------------------------------
> > 
> > Brian Corll
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Ammonia is bad for the plastics in the printer head. Use just
distilled water, glycerin and a cleaner containing only surfactants
(like Simple Green).

Daniela

Thanks Daniela, thats usefull information and I will do just that.

Bob Shram




________________________________

From: dgattarino <dgattarino@yahoo.com>
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, December 1, 2008 11:28:56 AM
Subject: [Digital BW] Re: Making yourown flushing cartridges



Ammonia is bad for the plastics in the printer head. Use just
distilled water, glycerin and a cleaner containing only surfactants
(like Simple Green).

Daniela

 

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

"dlruckus" <dlruckus@...> wrote:
>
> ... I was looking for commonly available products that contained
> surfactants possibly suitable for use in ink dilutions.
> The Tilex MSDS showed one of interest to me. 
> That, along with the fact that it's only
> other listed ingredient besides H2O was the isopropyl, 
> led me to give it a try. 

It does have fragrances in it.  

> Unless you are a commercial or educational enterprise, it's
> often difficult to get access to small quantities of this sort of
> chemical.

Edwal LFN wetting agent is a relatively concentrated possibility that 
has been used for photography for some time.  See
http://www.digitaltruth.com/products/msds/LFNWettingAgent.pdf

It appears to have 3 different ethoxylated linear alcohols (<35%) as 
well as isopropyl (<15%).  These types of alcohols are mentioned 
often with respect to inkjet and other surfactant needs.  

I mention it mostly because it is one of the possibilities I've 
considered testing for use in inks.  I have not yet tried it.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

Thanks Paul. I believe Tilex has changed the formulation of their
product since I first used it. I just looked at a new bottle in the
grocery store and see that it now has tetrapotassium EDTA listed on
the bottle as well. The original supply I have been using did not show
that. It's surfactant was alkyl polyglycoside along with the isopropyl
alcohol. Both in a range of 1 to 5%.
Interestingly enough, a search on this surfactant led to studies
showing that it functioned in much the same way as the polymer
coatings you mentioned the other day, when used in small
concentrations. It surface coats the particles and prevents clumping.

I haven't yet had time to do much work with it but did use it to make
a base dilution for your carbon six set just to tinker. One thing I
did observe was that it took some time for it to do it's thing. The
initial mix tended to leave a thin coat of pigment on the side of the
poly bottle, as do all of the inks I've seen to date. However, after
sitting for a couple of days, there was a marked change and that no
longer happened. The ink now drains completely into the bottom and no
longer leaves any residue on the side of the bottle. Sometime over the
next few months I'll investigate it a bit more.

Regards
Duane




--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "pr_roark"
<pr_roark@...> wrote:

>
>  "dlruckus" <dlruckus@> wrote:
> >
> > ... I was looking for commonly available products that contained
> > surfactants possibly suitable for use in ink dilutions.
> > The Tilex MSDS showed one of interest to me. 
> > That, along with the fact that it's only
> > other listed ingredient besides H2O was the isopropyl, 
> > led me to give it a try. 
> 
> It does have fragrances in it.  
> 
> > Unless you are a commercial or educational enterprise, it's
> > often difficult to get access to small quantities of this sort of
> > chemical.
> 
> Edwal LFN wetting agent is a relatively concentrated possibility that 
> has been used for photography for some time.  See
> http://www.digitaltruth.com/products/msds/LFNWettingAgent.pdf
> 
> It appears to have 3 different ethoxylated linear alcohols (<35%) as 
> well as isopropyl (<15%).  These types of alcohols are mentioned 
> often with respect to inkjet and other surfactant needs.  
> 
> I mention it mostly because it is one of the possibilities I've 
> considered testing for use in inks.  I have not yet tried it.
> 
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com
>

Duane wrote:

> I believe Tilex has changed the formulation ...
> it now has tetrapotassium EDTA listed ...
> It's surfactant was alkyl polyglycoside along with 
> the isopropyl alcohol. Both in a range of 1 to 5%.

> Interestingly enough, a search on this surfactant led to studies
> showing that it functioned in much the same way as the polymer
> coatings you mentioned the other day, when used in small
> concentrations. It surface coats the particles and prevents 
> clumping.

These surfactants are where a whole lot of action is.  They all coat 
things.  It's how they work.  With one end being hydrophobic (not 
liking water) and one end being hydrophilic (liking water), they tend 
to line up at the edges of water and other substances, including 
pigment particles.  All of our pigment particles have always 
been "coated" in this sense.  Balancing the various characteristics 
of these substances to get the gloss (or lack thereof), 
dispersion/stabilization, and adhesion one is after is how the 
various companies pay their bills.   

Although finding the cocktail that does what one wants becomes very 
tricky with the pigments, for cleaning I suspect a lot of them will 
work well.


> ...  The ink now drains completely into the bottom and no
> longer leaves any residue on the side of the bottle. 

Interesting.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "pr_roark" 
<pr_roark@...> wrote:
>
> Duane wrote:
> 
> > I believe Tilex has changed the formulation ...
> > it now has tetrapotassium EDTA listed ...
> > It's surfactant was alkyl polyglycoside along with 
> > the isopropyl alcohol. Both in a range of 1 to 5%.
> 
> > Interestingly enough, a search on this surfactant led to studies
> > showing that it functioned in much the same way as the polymer
> > coatings you mentioned the other day, when used in small
>> > ...  The ink now drains completely into the bottom and no
> > longer leaves any residue on the side of the bottle. 
> 
> Interesting.
> 
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com
>

Paul,


Do you think Jet-Dry would work as a surfactant? It has a nonionic 
chemical I believe is polyoxyethylene, which I also belive is the 
same as polyoxyethyl alcohol used in Photo-Flo 200.

I bet Jet Dry would work at least as well as PF 200.

Scott

Scott wrote:
... 
> Do you think Jet-Dry would work as a surfactant? It has a nonionic 
> chemical I believe is polyoxyethylene, which I also belive is the 
> same as polyoxyethyl alcohol used in Photo-Flo 200.
> 
> I bet Jet Dry would work at least as well as PF 200.
>

I don't know.  I suspect there are a number of these that will work in 
the older printers.  The 1.5 pl printers may be more difficult to get 
to print smoothly.

I used Photo Flo in the first C6 iteration because many of us have it, 
and I thought people might be more accepting of a chemical that has 
been used in the field for many years.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

Don't know if this is germane to the topic, but I do traditional b/w
photography and have switched from PhotoFlo to LFN for my film
development. PhotoFlo, if mixed and left to stand, gets "skanky", stuff
begins to grow in it. I was careful in using it, but sometimes I got
scum on my negatives. Since using LFN I've had none of these problems. 

In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "pr_roark"
<pr_roark@...> wrote:

> Edwal LFN wetting agent is a relatively concentrated possibility that 
> has been used for photography for some time.  See
> http://www.digitaltruth.com/products/msds/LFNWettingAgent.pdf
> 
> It appears to have 3 different ethoxylated linear alcohols (<35%) as 
> well as isopropyl (<15%).  These types of alcohols are mentioned 
> often with respect to inkjet and other surfactant needs.  
> 
> I mention it mostly because it is one of the possibilities I've 
> considered testing for use in inks.  I have not yet tried it.
> 
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com
>

I use ammonia dilute for outside cleaning (strong). It is a strong compound that should be used with care. I still use vinegar dilute for mild cleaning (windows).

gar

*********** REPLY SEPARATOR  ***********

On 12/1/2008 at 4:28 PM dgattarino wrote:

>Ammonia is bad for the plastics in the printer head. Use just
>distilled water, glycerin and a cleaner containing only surfactants
>(like Simple Green).
>
>Daniela
>
>
>------------------------------------
>
>Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as
>they are often being updated.
>
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
>If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
>unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same
>page.
>
>Please follow these basic guidelines:
>- As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
>them short.
>- Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames.
>Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
>membership without notice.
>- Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W
>printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from
>the membership.
>- By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and
>guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner
>and Moderators. See “Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines” in the Files
>section:
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
>
>BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
>YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE “OWNER” AND
>“MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO
>YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR
>EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF
>PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE 
>“OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN
>ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE
>OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii)
>UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii)
>STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
>YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE
>PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

Moderation is the word of course, but there is no need to fear low
levels of use. Ammonia is listed frequently in patent literature as an
ingredient in inks for inkjets. If memory serves, it was even
mentioned here as a component in at least one MIS ink base.

I've been using it, at low levels, for cleaning both outside and
inside of my machines for nearly a decade now. I'm still using the
first Epson I purchased. It gets mothballed for 6 months of every year
and the heads cleaned with flushing fluid containing ammonia prior to
it's use. There have been no problems from doing that. The same is
true for the other 4 machines I own.

After all, if you buy it in the grocery, it even comes in a plastic
bottle and gets stored on the laundry shelf for who knows how long
without problem :)

Regards
Duane

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Gary Weaver"
<garww@...> wrote:
>
> I use ammonia dilute for outside cleaning (strong). It is a strong
compound that should be used with care. I still use vinegar dilute for
mild cleaning (windows).
> 
> gar
> 
> *********** REPLY SEPARATOR  ***********
> 
> On 12/1/2008 at 4:28 PM dgattarino wrote:
> 
> >Ammonia is bad for the plastics in the printer head. Use just
> >distilled water, glycerin and a cleaner containing only surfactants
> >(like Simple Green).
> >
> >Daniela
> >
> >
> >------------------------------------
> >
> >Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other
resources as
> >they are often being updated.
> >
> >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> >
> >If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
> >unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting
this same
> >page.
> >
> >Please follow these basic guidelines:
> >- As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages
to keep
> >them short.
> >- Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames.
> >Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
> >membership without notice.
> >- Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W
> >printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be
removed from
> >the membership.
> >- By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and
> >guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group
Owner
> >and Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines" in the Files
> >section:
> >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
> >
> >BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE
PRINT
> >YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE "OWNER" AND
> >"MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE
LIABLE TO
> >YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR
> >EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF
> >PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE 
> >"OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN
> >ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i)
THE USE
> >OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii)
> >UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA;
(iii)

> >STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
> >YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE
> >PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> >Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>

Good to know, Duane. But what do you do about the excess ink pads
after you've reset the printer a couple of times and the pads
genuinely need changing?
Bob Bollini

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "dlruckus"
<dlruckus@...> wrote:
>
> Moderation is the word of course, but there is no need to fear low
> levels of use. Ammonia is listed frequently in patent literature as an
> ingredient in inks for inkjets. If memory serves, it was even
> mentioned here as a component in at least one MIS ink base.
> 
> I've been using it, at low levels, for cleaning both outside and
> inside of my machines for nearly a decade now. I'm still using the
> first Epson I purchased. It gets mothballed for 6 months of every year
> and the heads cleaned with flushing fluid containing ammonia prior to
> it's use. There have been no problems from doing that. The same is
> true for the other 4 machines I own.
> 
> After all, if you buy it in the grocery, it even comes in a plastic
> bottle and gets stored on the laundry shelf for who knows how long
> without problem :)
> 
> Regards
> Duane
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Gary Weaver"
> <garww@> wrote:
> >
> > I use ammonia dilute for outside cleaning (strong). It is a strong
> compound that should be used with care. I still use vinegar dilute for
> mild cleaning (windows).
> > 
> > gar
> > 
> > *********** REPLY SEPARATOR  ***********
> > 
> > On 12/1/2008 at 4:28 PM dgattarino wrote:
> > 
> > >Ammonia is bad for the plastics in the printer head. Use just
> > >distilled water, glycerin and a cleaner containing only surfactants
> > >(like Simple Green).
> > >
> > >Daniela
> > >
> > >
> > >------------------------------------
> > >
> > >Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other
> resources as
> > >they are often being updated.
> > >
> > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> > >
> > >If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you
wish to
> > >unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting
> this same
> > >page.
> > >
> > >Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > >- As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages
> to keep
> > >them short.
> > >- Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or
flames.
> > >Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
> > >membership without notice.
> > >- Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of
digital B&W
> > >printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be
> removed from
> > >the membership.
> > >- By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and
> > >guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group
> Owner
> > >and Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines" in the Files
> > >section:
> > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
> > >
> > >BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE
> PRINT
> > >YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE "OWNER" AND
> > >"MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE
> LIABLE TO
> > >YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR
> > >EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF
> > >PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE 
> > >"OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP
HAVE BEEN

> > >ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i)
> THE USE
> > >OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii)
> > >UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA;
> (iii)
> > >STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
> > >YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE
> > >PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> > >Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>

Hello Bob. You may have noticed that I said I have 5 printers. I use
all of them but print only for myself, so, they are not in a high
production environment compared to a commercial one or even someone
using only one printer for everything. Also, I work from 2 different
locations during the year so they all get a long rest at some point.
It takes considerable time for cleaning cycles to fill up a sump,
especially if one takes the trouble to avoid using any more of them
than necessary, and the flushing fluids and all but pigment residues
tend to basically evaporate away during the periodic rests. I reset
machines but I keep track of what the pads look like and have yet to
overflow anything. 

I repair and maintain the printers myself so if pads need replaced, I
just do it. 

Regards
Duane

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "p5198"
<oyster@...> wrote:
>
> Good to know, Duane. But what do you do about the excess ink pads
> after you've reset the printer a couple of times and the pads
> genuinely need changing?
> Bob Bollini
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "dlruckus"
> <dlruckus@> wrote:
> >
> > Moderation is the word of course, but there is no need to fear low
> > levels of use. Ammonia is listed frequently in patent literature as an
> > ingredient in inks for inkjets. If memory serves, it was even
> > mentioned here as a component in at least one MIS ink base.
> > 
> > I've been using it, at low levels, for cleaning both outside and
> > inside of my machines for nearly a decade now. I'm still using the
> > first Epson I purchased. It gets mothballed for 6 months of every year
> > and the heads cleaned with flushing fluid containing ammonia prior to
> > it's use. There have been no problems from doing that. The same is
> > true for the other 4 machines I own.
> > 
> > After all, if you buy it in the grocery, it even comes in a plastic
> > bottle and gets stored on the laundry shelf for who knows how long
> > without problem :)
> > 
> > Regards
> > Duane
> > 
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Gary Weaver"
> > <garww@> wrote:
> > >
> > > I use ammonia dilute for outside cleaning (strong). It is a strong
> > compound that should be used with care. I still use vinegar dilute for
> > mild cleaning (windows).
> > > 
> > > gar
> > > 
> > > *********** REPLY SEPARATOR  ***********
> > > 
> > > On 12/1/2008 at 4:28 PM dgattarino wrote:
> > > 
> > > >Ammonia is bad for the plastics in the printer head. Use just
> > > >distilled water, glycerin and a cleaner containing only surfactants
> > > >(like Simple Green).
> > > >
> > > >Daniela
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > >Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other
> > resources as
> > > >they are often being updated.
> > > >
> > > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> > > >
> > > >If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you
> wish to
> > > >unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting
> > this same
> > > >page.
> > > >
> > > >Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > > >- As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages
> > to keep
> > > >them short.
> > > >- Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or
> flames.
> > > >Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
> > > >membership without notice.
> > > >- Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of
> digital B&W
> > > >printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be
> > removed from
> > > >the membership.
> > > >- By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group
rules and
> > > >guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group
> > Owner
> > > >and Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines" in the
Files
> > > >section:
> > > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
> > > >
> > > >BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE
> > PRINT
> > > >YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE
"OWNER" AND
> > > >"MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE
> > LIABLE TO
> > > >YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR
> > > >EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR
LOSS OF
> > > >PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN
IF THE 
> > > >"OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP
> HAVE BEEN
> > > >ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i)
> > THE USE
> > > >OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii)
> > > >UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA;
> > (iii)
> > > >STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE
PRINT
> > > >YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL
BW, THE

> > > >PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>

Regarding you posting, you mention you replace the pads yourself.  I didn't realise it was possible to buy the pads without being an authorised Epson Service Centre.  Can you please direct me as to where I may buy the pads please?

Additionally, is there a publication that explains how to service the printers?

We have over twenty printers we use for testing inks periodically, so this would be really useful.

Many thanks

Paul




________________________________

From: dlruckus <dlruckus@...>
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, 5 December, 2008 0:34:51
Subject: [Digital BW] Re: Making yourown flushing cartridges


Hello Bob. You may have noticed that I said I have 5 printers. I use
all of them but print only for myself, so, they are not in a high
production environment compared to a commercial one or even someone
using only one printer for everything. Also, I work from 2 different
locations during the year so they all get a long rest at some point.
It takes considerable time for cleaning cycles to fill up a sump,
especially if one takes the trouble to avoid using any more of them
than necessary, and the flushing fluids and all but pigment residues
tend to basically evaporate away during the periodic rests. I reset
machines but I keep track of what the pads look like and have yet to
overflow anything. 

I repair and maintain the printers myself so if pads need replaced, I
just do it. 

Regards
Duane

--- In DigitalBlackandWhit eThePrint@ yahoogroups. com, "p5198"
<oyster@...> wrote:
>
> Good to know, Duane. But what do you do about the excess ink pads
> after you've reset the printer a couple of times and the pads
> genuinely need changing?
> Bob Bollini
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhit eThePrint@ yahoogroups. com, "dlruckus"
> <dlruckus@> wrote:
> >
> > Moderation is the word of course, but there is no need to fear low
> > levels of use. Ammonia is listed frequently in patent literature as an
> > ingredient in inks for inkjets. If memory serves, it was even
> > mentioned here as a component in at least one MIS ink base.
> > 
> > I've been using it, at low levels, for cleaning both outside and
> > inside of my machines for nearly a decade now. I'm still using the
> > first Epson I purchased. It gets mothballed for 6 months of every year
> > and the heads cleaned with flushing fluid containing ammonia prior to
> > it's use. There have been no problems from doing that. The same is
> > true for the other 4 machines I own.
> > 
> > After all, if you buy it in the grocery, it even comes in a plastic
> > bottle and gets stored on the laundry shelf for who knows how long
> > without problem :)
> > 
> > Regards
> > Duane
> > 
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhit eThePrint@ yahoogroups. com, "Gary Weaver"
> > <garww@> wrote:
> > >
> > > I use ammonia dilute for outside cleaning (strong). It is a strong
> > compound that should be used with care. I still use vinegar dilute for
> > mild cleaning (windows).
> > > 
> > > gar
> > > 
> > > *********** REPLY SEPARATOR  ***********
> > > 
> > > On 12/1/2008 at 4:28 PM dgattarino wrote:
> > > 
> > > >Ammonia is bad for the plastics in the printer head. Use just
> > > >distilled water, glycerin and a cleaner containing only surfactants
> > > >(like Simple Green).
> > > >
> > > >Daniela
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >----------- --------- --------- -------
> > > >
> > > >Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other
> > resources as
> > > >they are often being updated.
> > > >
> > > >http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/DigitalBla ckandWhiteThePri nt
> > > >
> > > >If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you
> wish to
> > > >unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting
> > this same
> > > >page.
> > > >
> > > >Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > > >- As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages
> > to keep
> > > >them short.
> > > >- Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or
> flames.
> > > >Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
> > > >membership without notice.
> > > >- Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of
> digital B&W
> > > >printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be
> > removed from
> > > >the membership.
> > > >- By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group
rules and
> > > >guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group
> > Owner
> > > >and Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines" in the
Files
> > > >section:
> > > >http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/DigitalBla ckandWhiteThePri nt/files/
> > > >
> > > >BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE
> > PRINT
> > > >YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE
"OWNER" AND
> > > >"MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE
> > LIABLE TO
> > > >YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR
> > > >EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR
LOSS OF
> > > >PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN
IF THE 
> > > >"OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP
> HAVE BEEN
> > > >ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i)
> > THE USE
> > > >OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii)
> > > >UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA;
> > (iii)
> > > >STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE
PRINT
> > > >YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL
BW, THE
> > > >PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>

    


      

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hello Paul. Google "epson service manual" and "epson parts" to find
sources for both. 
I don't know where you are located, but if you are in the USA and
unless the law has been changed, it's been illegal for a company to
refuse to sell parts to customers for equipment that they have legally
purchased, for a period of seven years from the time of the last
company sale of the item to anyone in the country. I suspect that the
law is honored only in the breach much of the time since one might
have to force their attention to it. It's also illegal to require
anyone to use only "authorized service" for something or to refuse to
honor the warranty do to use of third party supplies in a machine. The
burden of proof would be upon Epson for any assertion on their part
that the supplies cause damage of some sort. Again, of course,
anything goes if customers allow someone to get away with breaking
those laws.

More to the point is that you would want to have someone in your
organization with some experience in repairs of electro-mechanical
devices in order to achieve much benefit from the DIY approach. 

Regards
Duane
  

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Paul Banks
<failedthespian@...> wrote:
>
> Regarding you posting, you mention you replace the pads yourself.  I
didn't realise it was possible to buy the pads without being an
authorised Epson Service Centre.  Can you please direct me as to where
I may buy the pads please?
> 
> Additionally, is there a publication that explains how to service
the printers?
> 
> We have over twenty printers we use for testing inks periodically,
so this would be really useful.
> 
> Many thanks
> 
> Paul
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ________________________________
> From: dlruckus <dlruckus@...>
> To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Friday, 5 December, 2008 0:34:51
> Subject: [Digital BW] Re: Making yourown flushing cartridges
> 
> 
> Hello Bob. You may have noticed that I said I have 5 printers. I use
> all of them but print only for myself, so, they are not in a high
> production environment compared to a commercial one or even someone
> using only one printer for everything. Also, I work from 2 different
> locations during the year so they all get a long rest at some point.
> It takes considerable time for cleaning cycles to fill up a sump,
> especially if one takes the trouble to avoid using any more of them
> than necessary, and the flushing fluids and all but pigment residues
> tend to basically evaporate away during the periodic rests. I reset
> machines but I keep track of what the pads look like and have yet to
> overflow anything. 
> 
> I repair and maintain the printers myself so if pads need replaced, I
> just do it. 
> 
> Regards
> Duane
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhit eThePrint@ yahoogroups. com, "p5198"
> <oyster@> wrote:
> >
> > Good to know, Duane. But what do you do about the excess ink pads
> > after you've reset the printer a couple of times and the pads
> > genuinely need changing?
> > Bob Bollini
> > 
> > --- In DigitalBlackandWhit eThePrint@ yahoogroups. com, "dlruckus"
> > <dlruckus@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Moderation is the word of course, but there is no need to fear low
> > > levels of use. Ammonia is listed frequently in patent literature
as an
> > > ingredient in inks for inkjets. If memory serves, it was even
> > > mentioned here as a component in at least one MIS ink base.
> > > 
> > > I've been using it, at low levels, for cleaning both outside and
> > > inside of my machines for nearly a decade now. I'm still using the
> > > first Epson I purchased. It gets mothballed for 6 months of
every year
> > > and the heads cleaned with flushing fluid containing ammonia
prior to
> > > it's use. There have been no problems from doing that. The same is
> > > true for the other 4 machines I own.
> > > 
> > > After all, if you buy it in the grocery, it even comes in a plastic
> > > bottle and gets stored on the laundry shelf for who knows how long
> > > without problem :)
> > > 
> > > Regards
> > > Duane
> > > 
> > > --- In DigitalBlackandWhit eThePrint@ yahoogroups. com, "Gary
Weaver"
> > > <garww@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > I use ammonia dilute for outside cleaning (strong). It is a strong
> > > compound that should be used with care. I still use vinegar
dilute for
> > > mild cleaning (windows).
> > > > 
> > > > gar
> > > > 
> > > > *********** REPLY SEPARATOR  ***********
> > > > 
> > > > On 12/1/2008 at 4:28 PM dgattarino wrote:
> > > > 
> > > > >Ammonia is bad for the plastics in the printer head. Use just
> > > > >distilled water, glycerin and a cleaner containing only
surfactants
> > > > >(like Simple Green).
> > > > >
> > > > >Daniela
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >----------- --------- --------- -------
> > > > >
> > > > >Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other
> > > resources as
> > > > >they are often being updated.
> > > > >
> > > > >http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/DigitalBla ckandWhiteThePri nt
> > > > >
> > > > >If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you
> > wish to
> > > > >unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting
> > > this same
> > > > >page.
> > > > >
> > > > >Please follow these basic guidelines:
> > > > >- As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier
messages
> > > to keep
> > > > >them short.
> > > > >- Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or
> > flames.
> > > > >Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed
from the
> > > > >membership without notice.
> > > > >- Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of
> > digital B&W
> > > > >printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be
> > > removed from
> > > > >the membership.
> > > > >- By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group
> rules and
> > > > >guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the
group
> > > Owner
> > > > >and Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines" in the
> Files
> > > > >section:
> > > > >http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/DigitalBla ckandWhiteThePri
nt/files/
> > > > >
> > > > >BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL
BW, THE
> > > PRINT
> > > > >YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE
> "OWNER" AND
> > > > >"MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE
> > > LIABLE TO
> > > > >YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL,
CONSEQUENTIAL OR
> > > > >EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR
> LOSS OF
> > > > >PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN
> IF THE 
> > > > >"OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP
> > HAVE BEEN
> > > > >ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i)
> > > THE USE
> > > > >OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO
GROUP; (ii)
> > > > >UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR
DATA;

> > > (iii)
> > > > >STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE
> PRINT
> > > > >YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL
> BW, THE
> > > > >PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> > > > >Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> 
>     
> 
> 
>       
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

On 05/12/2008 Paul Banks wrote:
> I didn't realise it was possible to buy the pads without being an 
> authorised Epson Service Centre. Can you please direct me as to where 
> I may buy the pads please?

Epson distribute spares through several UK outlets, the main one being
Unicomp Ltd
01732 781400
Bourne Estate
Borough Green  TN15 8DG

They were perfectly happy to sell spare parts to me, an end user, taking 
CC payment over the phone for a 1290 printhead, which I DIY replaced at 
half the cost of Epson doing it (easy 10min job, no calibration required 
except normal user stuff on that printer). Whether they sell manuals I 
don't know.
-- 
Regards

Tony Sleep
http://tonysleep.co.uk

I've been following this thread for a bit... thanks to all with
knowledge... but before I mix up a big Christmas batch, I'm unclear
about part of it... I'm trying the glycerin, distilled water, but from
there I'm unclear if what tilex and simple green offer are
interchangable... or do they each offer something unique? Lastly, the
tilex I saw in the store had the fragrence Paul mentioned, but does
that rule it out? Stinks around here anyway...
Thanks all,
Tyler

Hi Tyler.
Looking at the MSDS of each of these products, it appears the
difference is that the primary ingredient of Simplegreen is Butyl
Cellosolve, a solvent, along with fragrances also, whereas the Tilex
Fresh Shower has Alkylpolyglycoside, which is an environment friendly
non-ionic surfactant, along with alcohol as solvent, a chelating EDTA
agent to bind heavy metals, and fragrance.
 Try googling  Butyl cellosolve to get an idea of it's disadvantages.

 The surfactant in the Tilex is used in many cleaning and cosmetic
products from what I can find. It's also mentioned in research and
patent literature as very useful in micro encapsulation applications.
That caught my attention quickly. It's also effective in basic
solutions which include some of the inks we use. One other advantage
it has is that it leaves no residues behind and requires no rinse when
used in cleaning applications.

All this said, I imagine a lot of cleaning agents can probably be used
successfully. I don't think the fragrances have much impact for the
flushing use but for dilution of inks the jury would still be out.

Sorry for the late response but I've been under the weather for a
couple of days(due to an encounter with a poisonous spider...it won).

Regards
Duane



--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Tyler Boley"
<tyler@...> wrote:

>
> I've been following this thread for a bit... thanks to all with
> knowledge... but before I mix up a big Christmas batch, I'm unclear
> about part of it... I'm trying the glycerin, distilled water, but from
> there I'm unclear if what tilex and simple green offer are
> interchangable... or do they each offer something unique? Lastly, the
> tilex I saw in the store had the fragrence Paul mentioned, but does
> that rule it out? Stinks around here anyway...
> Thanks all,
> Tyler
>

Good grief, that sounds awful! I hope you are OK Duane. I really
apreciate your reply. The only thing I might add for anyone else
following this is that there are 2 tilex products that I ran into. One
seems to be for mold, NOT what you want.
Thanks again Duane, get better.
Tyler

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "dlruckus"
<dlruckus@...> wrote:

>
> Hi Tyler.
> Looking at the MSDS of each of these products, it appears the
> difference is that the primary ingredient of Simplegreen is Butyl
> Cellosolve, a solvent, along with fragrances also, whereas the Tilex
> Fresh Shower has Alkylpolyglycoside, which is an environment friendly
> non-ionic surfactant, along with alcohol as solvent, a chelating EDTA
> agent to bind heavy metals, and fragrance.
>  Try googling  Butyl cellosolve to get an idea of it's disadvantages.
> 
>  The surfactant in the Tilex is used in many cleaning and cosmetic
> products from what I can find. It's also mentioned in research and
> patent literature as very useful in micro encapsulation applications.
> That caught my attention quickly. It's also effective in basic
> solutions which include some of the inks we use. One other advantage
> it has is that it leaves no residues behind and requires no rinse when
> used in cleaning applications.
> 
> All this said, I imagine a lot of cleaning agents can probably be used
> successfully. I don't think the fragrances have much impact for the
> flushing use but for dilution of inks the jury would still be out.
> 
> Sorry for the late response but I've been under the weather for a
> couple of days(due to an encounter with a poisonous spider...it won).
> 
> Regards
> Duane
> 
> 
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Tyler Boley"
> <tyler@> wrote:
> >
> > I've been following this thread for a bit... thanks to all with
> > knowledge... but before I mix up a big Christmas batch, I'm unclear
> > about part of it... I'm trying the glycerin, distilled water, but from
> > there I'm unclear if what tilex and simple green offer are
> > interchangable... or do they each offer something unique? Lastly, the
> > tilex I saw in the store had the fragrence Paul mentioned, but does
> > that rule it out? Stinks around here anyway...
> > Thanks all,
> > Tyler
> >
>

Hi Duane

<...whereas the Tilex
<Fresh Shower has Alkylpolyglycoside, which is an environment friendly
<non-ionic surfactant, along with alcohol as solvent, a chelating EDTA
<agent to bind heavy metals, and fragrance

I would stay away from anything containing EDTA if it is to pass through precision, reasonably fragile metallic components such as the piezo heads.  EDTA will definitely erode copper, zinc, iron, etc.  Yes it will be little bits but continued use will accrue and such precision and intricate things as piezo heads don't need much internal erosion before the clog from hell arrives or they don't function as well as they ought to.

EDTA and its cousins are all part of my art conservation chemical shelf.

My two cents.


Mark MacKenzie
Art Conservator & Wet Plate Photographer
Alcalde, New Mexico

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Mark. Thanks for the info. It's appreciated.
Regards
Duane

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Mark MacKenzie"
<mjmackenzie22@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Duane
> 
> <...whereas the Tilex
> <Fresh Shower has Alkylpolyglycoside, which is an environment friendly
> <non-ionic surfactant, along with alcohol as solvent, a chelating EDTA
> <agent to bind heavy metals, and fragrance
> 
> I would stay away from anything containing EDTA if it is to pass
through precision, reasonably fragile metallic components such as the
piezo heads.  EDTA will definitely erode copper, zinc, iron, etc.  Yes
it will be little bits but continued use will accrue and such
precision and intricate things as piezo heads don't need much internal
erosion before the clog from hell arrives or they don't function as
well as they ought to.

> 
> EDTA and its cousins are all part of my art conservation chemical shelf.
> 
> My two cents.
> 
> 
> Mark MacKenzie
> Art Conservator & Wet Plate Photographer
> Alcalde, New Mexico
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>