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Epson Enhanced and Archival Matte

Epson Enhanced and Archival Matte

2010-01-22 by horstenj

Can some-one shed a light on the current situation wrt Epson Enhanced and Archival Matte? 

As fas as I know, there was originally a paper called Archival Matte that turned out not to be of archival quality at all. Consequently, this paper was renamed to Enhanced Matte. For some time the paper remained to be sold under both names. In my perception, the name Archival Matte slowly dissappeared. 

But now it seems to me that it has resurrected. On some places I see Enhanced and Archival Matte (still? again?) offered side by side. Are these different papers now and is the Archival really archival? Or are they still the same? Or am I mistaken altogether?

Joost

Re: Epson Enhanced and Archival Matte

2010-01-22 by john

I think those must be old batches. There is no mention of Archival Matte on Epson's website at all 

 The first thing one should remember is that the word "archival" is not worth a bucket of warm spit (to be polite) period, in the world we operate in. I'm always amused at how photographers these days label their prints "archival inkjet print". Who has defined what archival is, what does it mean? Nothing really. It is just a deceptive over used meaningless word that Epson like other corporations at one time took advantage of. I hope they are not starting it up again.

Originally Ansel Adams started the common use of archival in regard to fixing and washing techniques associated with darkroom silver prints. His standard was hopefully to achieve at least 100 years without change. We now know silver prints should go many times over that without change in decent storage conditions.  But this term archival now has become warped and distorted in recent decades to include everything from Fuji Type C prints (40 Willhelm years at their very best and I question that for a dye) to poorly designed inkjet  inks that are not researched in any professional way for long term stability, to cheap wood pulp papers with tons of optical brighteners that burn out in a few years when exposed to daylight. Enhanced Matte is a prime example of that kind of media. Other papers being sold my Moab and Red River, and others, are just as bad.

I started using it 12 years ago and abandoned it about 8 years ago after watching the paper base shift from bright white to gray on everything over time, even in dark storage. Unfortunately Wilhelm's distorted and poorly conceived fade data of this media ( that apparently did not take in to consideration oba burnout), has contributed the most confusion to this Enhanced Matte, and he probably still has misleading data about it on his site to this day. I've personally replaced many pieces that I did for clients on this paper that had even been framed behind uv glass. It is fine and cheap for many short term purposes, as long as they don't suggest it will last, because it won't.

john


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "horstenj" <j.h.j.h@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> Can some-one shed a light on the current situation wrt Epson Enhanced and Archival Matte? 
> 
> As fas as I know, there was originally a paper called Archival Matte that turned out not to be of archival quality at all. Consequently, this paper was renamed to Enhanced Matte. For some time the paper remained to be sold under both names. In my perception, the name Archival Matte slowly dissappeared. 
> 
> But now it seems to me that it has resurrected. On some places I see Enhanced and Archival Matte (still? again?) offered side by side. Are these different papers now and is the Archival really archival? Or are they still the same? Or am I mistaken altogether?
> 
> Joost
>

Re: [Digital BW] Epson Enhanced and Archival Matte

2010-01-23 by Peter Marquis-Kyle

On 23/01/2010 horstenj wrote:
> But now it seems to me that it has resurrected. On some places I see 
> Enhanced and Archival Matte (still? again?) offered side by side. Are 
> these different papers now and is the Archival really archival? Or 
> are they still the same? Or am I mistaken altogether?

Joost, it seems Epson sells the same paper under different names in 
different markets. Here in Australia the paper is still sold as 
'Archival Matte' -- see 
http://www.epson.com.au/consumables/paperandmedia/567.html -- which, as 
others have noted, amounts to false advertising. I'm happy to use it for 
proofing and other short-term purposes, but I would never sell a print 
made on this paper.

Peter Marquis-Kyle

Re: [Digital BW] Epson Enhanced and Archival Matte

2010-01-23 by horstenj

> Joost, it seems Epson sells the same paper under different names in 
> different markets. Here in Australia the paper is still sold as 
> 'Archival Matte' -- see 
> http://www.epson.com.au/consumables/paperandmedia/567.html -- which, as 
> others have noted, amounts to false advertising. I'm happy to use it for 
> proofing and other short-term purposes, but I would never sell a print 
> made on this paper.
> 
> Peter Marquis-Kyle
>

Also in the Netherlands the Epson site offers Archival Matte. No mentioning of Enhanced Matte now, though I'm pretty sure they have listed it. The driver of my Epson 3800 lists both.

Like all others, I've avoided it for serious printing. Find it a good proofing paper though. I guess I just hoped for a cheaper version of Photo Rag...

Is the issue "just" its amount of OBA, I recall it was not even acid free...?

Joost

Re: [Digital BW] Epson Enhanced and Archival Matte

2010-01-23 by Richard Sintchak

If I remember right it's made from wood fibers too, not cotton.

Sent from my iPhone

On Jan 23, 2010, at 2:24 PM, "horstenj" <j.h.j.h@...> wrote:

>
> > Joost, it seems Epson sells the same paper under different names in
> > different markets. Here in Australia the paper is still sold as
> > 'Archival Matte' -- see
> > http://www.epson.com.au/consumables/paperandmedia/567.html --  
> which, as
> > others have noted, amounts to false advertising. I'm happy to use  
> it for
> > proofing and other short-term purposes, but I would never sell a  
> print
> > made on this paper.
> >
> > Peter Marquis-Kyle
> >
>
> Also in the Netherlands the Epson site offers Archival Matte. No  
> mentioning of Enhanced Matte now, though I'm pretty sure they have  
> listed it. The driver of my Epson 3800 lists both.
>
> Like all others, I've avoided it for serious printing. Find it a  
> good proofing paper though. I guess I just hoped for a cheaper  
> version of Photo Rag...
>
> Is the issue "just" its amount of OBA, I recall it was not even acid  
> free...?
>
> Joost
>
> 


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Epson Enhanced and Archival Matte

2010-01-24 by Ernst Dinkla

horstenj schreef:
>> Joost, it seems Epson sells the same paper under different names in 
>> different markets. Here in Australia the paper is still sold as 
>> 'Archival Matte' -- see 
>> http://www.epson.com.au/consumables/paperandmedia/567.html -- which, as 
>> others have noted, amounts to false advertising. I'm happy to use it for 
>> proofing and other short-term purposes, but I would never sell a print 
>> made on this paper.
>>
>> Peter Marquis-Kyle
>>
> 
> Also in the Netherlands the Epson site offers Archival Matte. No mentioning of Enhanced Matte now, though I'm pretty sure they have listed it. The driver of my Epson 3800 lists both.
> 
> Like all others, I've avoided it for serious printing. Find it a good proofing paper though. I guess I just hoped for a cheaper version of Photo Rag...
> 
> Is the issue "just" its amount of OBA, I recall it was not even acid free...?
> 
> Joost
> 
> 
> 

Joost,

I can get Enhanced Matt on rolls here in the Netherlands. Maybe Epson 
still dumps the AM sheets on the EU market. I recall that with the 
orange plague 1280 dyes they didn't change their ads here either and 
there was no EU consumer compensation like there was in the US.
Some months ago I switched from EEM to the HP Matte Litho Realistic 
though. Less OBA and heavier, paper white between Photorag-German 
Etching so good for proofing and cheaper than EEM. Unscientific testing 
(on paper white only) in a window 40 days now and the EEM has shifted, 
the Matte Litho didn't shift so far.

I think that with a recent Epson you can use the media preset of EEM and 
with a custom profile you must get at least a print equal to EEM. I used 
the Matte Litho media preset on the Z3100 for EEM so why not the other 
way around ?

-- 
Met vriendelijke groeten,   Ernst


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Re: [Digital BW] Epson Enhanced and Archival Matte

2010-01-24 by john

If you want to see what the base color will end up like, just turn it over.

john



--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Richard Sintchak <rich815@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> If I remember right it's made from wood fibers too, not cotton.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Jan 23, 2010, at 2:24 PM, "horstenj" <j.h.j.h@...> wrote:
> 
> >
> > > Joost, it seems Epson sells the same paper under different names in
> > > different markets. Here in Australia the paper is still sold as
> > > 'Archival Matte' -- see
> > > http://www.epson.com.au/consumables/paperandmedia/567.html --  
> > which, as
> > > others have noted, amounts to false advertising. I'm happy to use  
> > it for
> > > proofing and other short-term purposes, but I would never sell a  
> > print
> > > made on this paper.
> > >
> > > Peter Marquis-Kyle
> > >
> >
> > Also in the Netherlands the Epson site offers Archival Matte. No  
> > mentioning of Enhanced Matte now, though I'm pretty sure they have  
> > listed it. The driver of my Epson 3800 lists both.
> >
> > Like all others, I've avoided it for serious printing. Find it a  
> > good proofing paper though. I guess I just hoped for a cheaper  
> > version of Photo Rag...
> >
> > Is the issue "just" its amount of OBA, I recall it was not even acid  
> > free...?
> >
> > Joost
> >
> > 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

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