Doepfer

Isn't it true that in theory, analog should have purer waveforms than  
digital?  Digitally produced waves are limited by the bit resolution,  
so on a small scale they are step functions.  Analog oscillators may  
produce distorted shapes but at least they are truly smooth  
functions.  Right?

On Nov 29, 2008, at 2:57 AM, madrayken wrote:

> Only just joined this curiously tense thread.
>
> Is there something so fundamentally (unintended joke) annoying about
> wanting sine waves when spending well over a thousand pounds on a
> mono-synth?
>
> *I* want sine waves as pure as possible because I like using ring mod
> which tends to sound rather nasty and noisy with anything other than
> pure sines. I know because I've tried using things other than sine
> waves, not because someone told me so.
>
> I heard the A110 wasn't a pure sine.
> I bought an A111 and a dual cwejman instead.
> They produce nice non-noisy sines and the ring mod produced sounds
> good to my ears.
> I am now happy.
>
> I'm happy to hear what solutions other people have found to the
> pure-sine dilemma. I'm also happy to hear that other people don't care
> about pure sines - that's interesting in itself, and I love hearing
> the work-arounds.
>
> Can't we all move on or play nice?
>
> --- In Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com, Monroe Eskew <monroe.eskew@...>
> wrote:
> >
> > So what is the purpose of this? Isn't a slightly imperfect sine
> > impossible to distinguish aurally? And can't you filter out any
> > imperfections to near-silence with an LPF?
> >
> > On Nov 28, 2008, at 10:02 AM, laryn91 wrote:
> >
> > > My ZO starts to distort at lower freqs (looks like a square with
> > > rounded corners). So it's a
> > > sine for only part of its range.
> > >
> > > I'm not so much interested about whose *distorted* sine wave  
> sounds
> > > best, but who's sine
> > > output actually has no audible harmonic distortion (i.e  
> fundamental
> > > only).
> > >
> > > --- In Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com, Bakis Sirros
> > > <synth_freak_2000@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > or maybe Cyndustries Zeroscillator...i think that should also  
> have
> > > a very good sinewave.
> > > >
> > > > that said, i also really like a lot the sine of the A111's (i  
> use
> > > them all the time!) and the
> > > sine of the AFG (regarding Euro).
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Bakis Sirros - Parallel Worlds / Interconnected / Memory Geist
> > > > [Doepfer_a100] group owner
> > > > www. parallel - worlds - music. com
> > > > www. myspace. com/ parallelworldsmusic
> > > > www. myspace. com/ interconnectedmusic
> > > > www. myspace. com/ memorygeist
> > > > www. DiN. org. uk
> > > > www. musicamaximamagnetica. com
> > > > www. shimarecords. co. uk
> > > > www. rubberrecords. gr
> > > > Athens - Greece
> > > >
> > > > --- On Fri, 11/28/08, laryn91 <caymus91@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > From: laryn91 <caymus91@>
> > > > Subject: [Doepfer_a100] Re: starting a modular - Z3000 waveform
> > > quality?
> > > > To: Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com
> > > > Date: Friday, November 28, 2008, 7:17 PM
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > I originally asked if anybody sold a VCO with undistorted sine
> > > outputs. In summary here
> > > > are the replies I got:
> > > >
> > > > 1 - Manufactures claim they can spec any wave with rounded peaks
> > > as "Sine". Even if
> > > you
> > > > can clearly hear even harmonic distortion - any roundish looking
> > > shape is a close
> > > enough
> > > > to be called a Sine.
> > > >
> > > > 2 - Analog vs. Digital religion states that analog must always
> > > remain imprecise because
> > > > that is its character. We don't want a clean analog wave with no
> > > added harmonics in our
> > > > system because that would make it digital.
> > > >
> > > > 3 - Finally the topic police posted their overall disapproval of
> > > this discussion. Even
> > > > banning members was suggested!
> > > >
> > > > So I learned if you want a real sine wave (as defined by  
> Fourier),
> > > get Plan-B Model 15...
> > > >
> > > > --- In Doepfer_a100@ yahoogroups. com, york luethje <ybl@>  
> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Why ban people? I found the debate lively at first, although  
> it
> > > later turned somewhat
> > > > obnoxious. Dieter Doepfer has given an excellent reply and I  
> think
> > > matters should rest
> > > > there.
> > > > >
> > > > > York
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ____________ _________ _________ __
> > > > > From: kovski774 <kovski@>
> > > > > To: Doepfer_a100@ yahoogroups. com
> > > > > Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2008 6:30:55 AM
> > > > > Subject: [Doepfer_a100] Re: starting a modular - Z3000  
> waveform
> > > quality?
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > or perhaps we can just ban argitoth? the guy's a trainwreck,
> > > spoils
> > > > > every message board he signs up to with inane opinions  
> presented
> > > as
> > > > > fact and a TOTAL lack of self awareness.
> > > > >
> > > > > --- In Doepfer_a100@ yahoogroups. com, Bakis Sirros
> > > > > <synth_freak_ 2000@> wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > yes, good idea. i can then NOT join that group...
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Bakis Sirros - Parallel Worlds / Interconnected / Memory  
> Geist
> > > > > > [Doepfer_a100] group owner
> > > > > > www. parallel - worlds - music. com
> > > > > > www. myspace. com/ parallelworldsmusic
> > > > > > www. myspace. com/ interconnectedmusic
> > > > > > www. myspace. com/ memorygeist
> > > > > > www. DiN. org. uk
> > > > > > www. musicamaximamagneti ca. com
> > > > > > www. shimarecords. co. uk
> > > > > > www. rubberrecords. gr
> > > > > > Athens - Greece
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --- On Tue, 11/25/08, Frequency Divider <freq.div@ .> wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > From: Frequency Divider <freq.div@ .>
> > > > > > Subject: Re: [Doepfer_a100] Re: starting a modular - Z3000
> > > waveform
> > > > > quality?
> > > > > > To: Doepfer_a100@ yahoogroups. com
> > > > > > Date: Tuesday, November 25, 2008, 9:31 PM
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > i would like to suggest the creation of a seperate list or  
> yahoo
> > > > > group
> > > > > > for any future sine wave purity discussions. you could  
> even join
> > > > > the
> > > > > > alternate tunings list for obsessive talk about tuning the  
> vco
> > > in
> > > > > cents
> > > > > > and fractions of cents
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Argitoth schreef:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > btw, here's the Tip Top Audio VCO waveform test:
> > > > > > > http://www.muffwigg ler.com/forum/ viewtopic. php?t=2158
> > > > > > > <http://www.muffwigg ler.com/forum/ viewtopic. php?t=2158>
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Is it just me or does Analogue Systems VCO produce better
> > > > > traingles and
> > > > > > > sines?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Thanks James,
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Laryn91, I just recorded my synth using the filter as a
> > > > > waveshaper.
> > > > > > > Good tracking is not needed, you just have to patch a 1v/ 
> oct
> > > > > signal
> > > > > > > into the filter's VC, but that VC needs an attenuator. You
> > > don't
> > > > > want
> > > > > > > to give it full VC. Here's the recording:
> > > > > > > http://www.elanhick ler.com/misc/ filter-waveshapi ng- 
> test.wav
> > > > > > > <http://www.elanhick ler.com/misc/ filter-waveshapi
> ng-test.wav
> > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > 1. Raw sound without filtering.
> > > > > > > 2. With filtering (notice how you can't hear low notes,  
> that's
> > > > > how it
> > > > > > > should be with sine waves, however the problem is that low
> > > notes
> > > > > also
> > > > > > > have small peaks)
> > > > > > > 3. With filtering used as a modulator (the lesser peaks  
> means
> > > > > it's not
> > > > > > > good as a modulator, not enough volume anymore)
> > > > > > > 4. Without filtering used as a pitch modulator (this is  
> how
> > > the
> > > > > > > modulation should sound)
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Hmm... Its anyone's guess if a filter is really worth  
> using
> > > as a
> > > > > waveshaper.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
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> > > --------- -
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> > > > > > > No virus found in this incoming message.
> > > > > > > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg. com
> > > > > > > Version: 8.0.175 / Virus Database: 270.9.10/1810 - Release
> > > Date:
> > > > > 11/24/2008 2:36 PM
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