Ok, great. Still good news. I will do the tests I described earlier and report back. Thanks again! Scott -----Original Message----- From: Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, November 7, 2017 11:29 AM To: Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com Subject: AW: [Doepfer_a100] Envelope Generator Problem I also tried a simple patch (all modules in the same case/same supply): permanent high gate / LFO rectangle -> A-140 gate in A-140 out -> A-132-3 CV in A-110-1 sawtooth out -> A-132-3 audio in A-132-3 out -> scope There is no diference in the loudness peak between the permanent gate and the LFO triggered version of the A-140. I have no idea what happened in your environment. I'd recommend to start with a similar simple patch (VCO/VCA/ADSR) with all modules in the same case (same supply/GND). Best wishes Dieter Doepfer > -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- > Von: Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com] > Gesendet: Dienstag, 7. November 2017 16:59 > An: Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com > Betreff: RE: [Doepfer_a100] Envelope Generator Problem > > > > > > Yes, that is possible but I also used the analog meter. And since the > problem is obvious in the waveform of the recorded audio, and to my > ears, its obvious that the problem is definitely occurring. The > voltages may not be exactly correct on the meter but that doesnt > change the fact that the first note is always much quieter. But I may > try with the oscilloscope as well. > > I dont remember this happening when I first got the Basis system > 2 but maybe I was just too excited to notice it! > > I have 2 plans right now. One is to empty a case and only add the midi > module and one ADSR. I can also do a test with ONLY the ADSR and use a > gate from the SH-2 or Microbrute. > > The second is a bit easier and hopefully NOT the problem: All of my > gear comes from a single UPS. It seems unlikely the UPS is the problem > but I will try plugging these cases into a different outlet and see if > that changes anything. I will also not use any power bars for the > test. There a few other synthesizers plugged into the same power bar > and they work fine so I dont think this is the problem but you never > know. > > I had a Creamware Pro12 stop working once because it was plugged into > a cheap UPS. That one is entirely digital so it was a very different > story, but its always worth testing everything! > > Thanks again Dieter > > Scott > > > > From: Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com] > Sent: Tuesday, November 7, 2017 10:48 AM > To: Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com > Subject: AW: [Doepfer_a100] Envelope Generator Problem > > > I took a look at your video: you cannot measure the peak voltage of an > ADSR with a digital multimeter ! For this e.g. an oscilloscope is > required. With the digital multimeter an average value over a period > of time is measured (depending upon the measurement cycle of the meter > in question). > > Best wishes > Dieter Doepfer > > > -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- > > Von: Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com] > > Gesendet: Dienstag, 7. November 2017 16:34 > > An: Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com > > Betreff: RE: [Doepfer_a100] Envelope Generator Problem > > > > > > Thanks for doing this. That's good news... in a way. Now the > question is, > > why is this happening? > > > > I think I will have to empty one of the cases and build a very > > simple synthesizer with minimal parts and see what happens. > > > > Thanks again! > > Scott > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com] > > Sent: Tuesday, November 7, 2017 10:26 AM > > To: Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: AW: [Doepfer_a100] Envelope Generator Problem > > > > Hello, > > > > I took an A-140 and cannot confirm this behaviour. That's what I did: > > > > - wait about 10 seconds > > - permanent high signal to the gate input > > - measuring the ADSR output (especially the peak voltage) with > > oscilloscope > > -> peak is about +8.4V > > - replacing the permanent gate signal by an LFO rectangle with > about 10 Hz > > - measuring the ADSR output (especially the peak voltages) with > > oscilloscope > > -> all peaks are about +8.4V > > > > I could detect any difference in the peak level of the "first" > > envelope (permanent gate) and the peak levels when the A-140 was > > triggered by the LFO. > > > > Best wishes > > Dieter Doepfer > > > > > > > > > -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- > > > Von: Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com] > > > Gesendet: Dienstag, 7. November 2017 04:11 > > > An: Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com > > > Betreff: [Doepfer_a100] Envelope Generator Problem > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Folks > > > > > > Sorry to post this again but my whole modular synth is unusable > > > until I fix this problem so I still need help. > > > > > > The problem: All of my envelope generators do the same thing - > > > When I play a note they peak at a certain voltage, lets say 5 > > > volts. But when I play a second note that peak rises to 6 volts. > > > And in some cases when I play 16th notes it rises even more. > > > > > > So when I connect the output of an envelope generator to a VCA the > > > first note I play is always MUCH quieter than every following note. > > > > > > I have 3 Doepfer LC9 cases with various modules in each. This > > > behavior is consistent in all three boxes with all of my envelope generators. > > > > > > The modules are: > > > Doepfer A-140 (3 of these) > > > Doepfer A-143-2 quad > > > Roland 540 > > > > > > Also, the all 4 of the envelopes in the A-143-2 do not actually > > > sustain. The voltage constantly falls when a note is held, even > > > when the sustain level is set to maximum. That is a separate > > > problem but I thought I'd mention it. > > > > > > Also, for some reason the release time of the Roland 540 is only > > > 2 seconds (even on the Slow setting) when plugged into any VCA, > > > however when it is plugged into the Roland filter the release time > > > is much longer. Another weird problem but I thought I'd mention it > > > in case it was an important clue. > > > > > > I have tested the output of all of the envelopes with both analog > > > and digital volt meters to confirm the behavior. > > > > > > At this point I'm not sure what to do to fix this. I guess the > > > first question is: Is this the way these envelopes are supposed to > > > work? I have owned analog synthesizers since 1978 and own a lot of > > > them right now and not a single one has this behavior. > > > Other than when using velocity sensitivity, every note played is > > > exactly the same volume. > > > > > > Is this a known issue? Are there combination of modules that can > > > cause this to happen? Could it be the power supplies? I have moved > > > the modules around and found the behavior is the same regardless > > > of how many modules (or which ones) are in a case. > > > > > > What kind of troubleshooting can I do? With only a trigger voltage > > > being sent to the Envelope module I don't think there could be > > > anything else interfering but I'm looking for any clues at all, > > > even the most obvious ones that I may have overlooked. > > > > > > I did a video to show the problem: https://youtu.be/x8_1ZnmPWLo > > > > > > Thanks for any ideas anyone might have! > > > > > > Scott > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > Yahoo Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Posted by: "Scott Rogers" <scott@scottfromcanada.com> > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > Yahoo Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ ------------------------------------ ------------------------------------ Yahoo Groups Links
Message
RE: [Doepfer_a100] Envelope Generator Problem
2017-11-07 by Scott Rogers