Homebrew PCBs

Hi,
I'm looking for good CNC machine for PCB. I found one
www.accuratecnc.com <http://www.accuratecnc.com/>  (Accurate 360)
I think the machine is suitable for my needs (mainly prototyping):
- 2 layers PCBs with QFP64/QFP100, 8 mils traces
- full copper rubout (for our FR filters & antennas)
- stencils

What do you think about it ?
(LPKF & T-TECH second hand are more expensive !)

Thank you in advance !







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Try eBay : $ 499 for a new machine.
Cristian


At 04:37 PM 2/26/2009, you wrote:


>Hi,
>I'm looking for good CNC machine for PCB. I found one
>www.accuratecnc.com 
><<http://www.accuratecnc.com/>http://www.accuratecnc.com/> (Accurate 360)
>I think the machine is suitable for my needs (mainly prototyping):
>- 2 layers PCBs with QFP64/QFP100, 8 mils traces
>- full copper rubout (for our FR filters & antennas)
>- stencils


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

>
>I'm looking for good CNC machine for PCB. I found one
>www.accuratecnc.com <http://www.accuratecnc.com/>  (Accurate 360)
>I think the machine is suitable for my needs (mainly prototyping):
>- 2 layers PCBs with QFP64/QFP100, 8 mils traces
>- full copper rubout (for our FR filters & antennas)
>- stencils
>
>What do you think about it ?
>

     See if you can locate one of those old enclosures we used to use for printers.  Either that or put it into a walk-in closet with a lot of clothes.  Those PCB milling machines make a lot of noise.

     And keep plenty of extra cutters available as they tend to wear out quickly, even the carbide ones.

     Other than that, those things are wonderful to have available especially for high frequency RF work.


Chris

     ,----------------------.       High Performance Mixers and
    /    What's all this     \    Amplifiers for RF Communications
   / extinct stuff, anyhow?  /
   \  _______,--------------'           Chris Trask / N7ZWY
  _ |/                                  Principal Engineer
 oo\                                  Sonoran Radio Research
(__)\       _                             P.O. Box 25240
  \  \    .'  `.                     Tempe, Arizona 85285-5240
   \  \  /      \
    \  '"        \                 IEEE Senior Member #40274515
     .       (  ) \
      '-| )__| :.  \              Email: christrask@...
        | |  | | \  '.       http://www.home.earthlink.net/~christrask
       c__; c__;  '-..'>.__

                       Graphics by Loek Frederiks

I have an LPKF milling machine with cabinet. It is true they are not
cheap and well the tools are not cheap. The results are fantastic but
at a cost. Now that I have gotten use to it it is true I can mill a
few double sided board complete, cut out in an afternoon. It is a real
luxury. I can do tracks down to 0.2mm without thinking about it. 

From reading this group for a while I have been seriously considering
the true merit of the machine. I am wondering if what is most
important about the machine is being able to drill all the holes
nicely and cut the board out properly. From the talk on chemical
processes I am forming a theory that it might be well worth a mix of
processes. It could be quite cheap to set up an etch system to mill
tracks of very fine quality and then use a milling machine to drill
the holes and cut them out. This might actually be a quicker method
and suppose really it is what is done in PCB production.  

What it leads to is the idea that you might be able to get away with a
decent enough machine like the one on ebay or maybe a Fireballcnc
machine and not have the costs of the tooling. It all takes time to
set up, get used to and perfect your methods. Depends if you have the
space for the chemical process. 

Another point is I looked around for methods to acheive plating and
resist layers and these lead you back to chemical processes. So if you
want to make perfect boards that are plated and have solder and screen
resist the milling machine does not represent the absolute solution. 

Trev

Trev

take a look at
http://www.fireballcnc.com/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Fireballcnc/



--- On Thu, 2/26/09, rf33333 <rf33333@...> wrote:

> Hi,
> I'm looking for good CNC machine for PCB. I found one
> www.accuratecnc.com <http://www.accuratecnc.com/> 
> (Accurate 360)
> I think the machine is suitable for my needs (mainly
> prototyping):
> - 2 layers PCBs with QFP64/QFP100, 8 mils traces
> - full copper rubout (for our FR filters & antennas)
> - stencils
> 
> What do you think about it ?
> (LPKF & T-TECH second hand are more expensive !)
> 
> Thank you in advance !

I have a 360 and I love it. Excellent support, too. No affiliation with them, just a big fan! I also have a used t-tech that I'd be interested in selling. My advice, though, is to get a new Accurate 360.

Mark

-----Original Message-----

>From: "Herbert E. Plett" <cachureos@...>
>Sent: Feb 26, 2009 7:57 PM
>To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] PCB prototyping
>
>
>take a look at
>http://www.fireballcnc.com/
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Fireballcnc/
>
>
>
>--- On Thu, 2/26/09, rf33333 <rf33333@...> wrote:
>> Hi,
>> I'm looking for good CNC machine for PCB. I found one
>> www.accuratecnc.com <http://www.accuratecnc.com/> 
>> (Accurate 360)
>> I think the machine is suitable for my needs (mainly
>> prototyping):
>> - 2 layers PCBs with QFP64/QFP100, 8 mils traces
>> - full copper rubout (for our FR filters & antennas)
>> - stencils
>> 
>> What do you think about it ?
>> (LPKF & T-TECH second hand are more expensive !)
>> 
>> Thank you in advance !
>
>
>
>      
>
>
>------------------------------------
>
>Be sure to visit the group home and check for new Links, Files, and Photos:
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBsYahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

The Fireball is great, especially if you want to save a few dollars 
by assembling it yourself. It does more than PCBs, too.

Steve Greenfield

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Herbert E. Plett" 
<cachureos@...> wrote:

>
> 
> take a look at
> http://www.fireballcnc.com/
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Fireballcnc/
> 
> 
> 
> --- On Thu, 2/26/09, rf33333 <rf33333@...> wrote:
> > Hi,
> > I'm looking for good CNC machine for PCB. I found one
> > www.accuratecnc.com <http://www.accuratecnc.com/> 
> > (Accurate 360)
> > I think the machine is suitable for my needs (mainly
> > prototyping):
> > - 2 layers PCBs with QFP64/QFP100, 8 mils traces
> > - full copper rubout (for our FR filters & antennas)
> > - stencils
> > 
> > What do you think about it ?
> > (LPKF & T-TECH second hand are more expensive !)
> > 
> > Thank you in advance !
>

Hi Steve,
I looked at fireballcnc, but it seems that there is no machine with even
close parameters to the necessary for PCB. For DIY purposes they may be
sufficient, but for fine operations – no! And… something else
– they does not have software – which is not at all a small
problem, especially for CNC PCB machine!
And a Dremel for spindle is not good enough.
I studied the question and reached the conclusion that a good CNC
machine must obligatory have depth limiter and a foot. The real Z axis
gives much other advantages (in front of pseudo Z axis in the cheaper
LPKF), but without depth limiter there is no way to use V instruments
for isolation (5-8 mils)!
I like very much the Z axis of Accurate 360:
(www.accuratecnc.com/Pictures/Small/A360_z-axis.jpg
<http://www.accuratecnc.com/Pictures/Small/A360_z-axis.jpg> ) – it
looks solidly made, exactly for fine operations like PCB.

Peter


--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Steve" <alienrelics@...> wrote:
>
> The Fireball is great, especially if you want to save a few dollars
> by assembling it yourself. It does more than PCBs, too.
>
> Steve Greenfield
>
> --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Herbert E. Plett"
> cachureos@ wrote:
> >
> >
> > take a look at
> > http://www.fireballcnc.com/
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Fireballcnc/
> >
> >
> >
> > --- On Thu, 2/26/09, rf33333 rf33333@ wrote:
> > > Hi,
> > > I'm looking for good CNC machine for PCB. I found one
> > > www.accuratecnc.com <http://www.accuratecnc.com/>
> > > (Accurate 360)
> > > I think the machine is suitable for my needs (mainly
> > > prototyping):
> > > - 2 layers PCBs with QFP64/QFP100, 8 mils traces
> > > - full copper rubout (for our FR filters & antennas)
> > > - stencils
> > >
> > > What do you think about it ?
> > > (LPKF & T-TECH second hand are more expensive !)
> > >
> > > Thank you in advance !
> >
>




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Mark,

Thank you very much for the answer – that is what I was looking for.
A friend of mine (who has old LPKF C60) recommended to me Accurate 360
(http://www.accuratecnc.com/A360.html
<http://www.accuratecnc.com/A360.html> ). He considers that for this
money this is the best on the market (and plans to change C60 with 360).

Peter

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, mlerman@... wrote:
>
> I have a 360 and I love it. Excellent support, too. No affiliation
with them, just a big fan! I also have a used t-tech that I'd be
interested in selling. My advice, though, is to get a new Accurate 360.
>
> Mark
>
> -----Original Message-----
> >From: "Herbert E. Plett" cachureos@...
> >Sent: Feb 26, 2009 7:57 PM
> >To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
> >Subject: Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] PCB prototyping
> >
> >
> >take a look at
> >http://www.fireballcnc.com/
> >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Fireballcnc/
> >
> >
> >
> >--- On Thu, 2/26/09, rf33333 rf33333@... wrote:
> >> Hi,
> >> I'm looking for good CNC machine for PCB. I found one
> >> www.accuratecnc.com <http://www.accuratecnc.com/>
> >> (Accurate 360)
> >> I think the machine is suitable for my needs (mainly
> >> prototyping):
> >> - 2 layers PCBs with QFP64/QFP100, 8 mils traces
> >> - full copper rubout (for our FR filters & antennas)
> >> - stencils
> >>
> >> What do you think about it ?
> >> (LPKF & T-TECH second hand are more expensive !)
> >>
> >> Thank you in advance !
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >------------------------------------
> >
> >Be sure to visit the group home and check for new Links, Files, and
Photos:
> >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBsYahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

How much does a Accurate 360 from accuratecnc cost ?

Thanks in advance

Vikas 

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Steve" <alienrelics@...> wrote:

>
> The Fireball is great, especially if you want to save a few dollars 
> by assembling it yourself. It does more than PCBs, too.
> 
> Steve Greenfield
> 
> --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Herbert E. Plett" 
> <cachureos@> wrote:
> >
> > 
> > take a look at
> > http://www.fireballcnc.com/
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Fireballcnc/
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > --- On Thu, 2/26/09, rf33333 <rf33333@> wrote:
> > > Hi,
> > > I'm looking for good CNC machine for PCB. I found one
> > > www.accuratecnc.com <http://www.accuratecnc.com/> 
> > > (Accurate 360)
> > > I think the machine is suitable for my needs (mainly
> > > prototyping):
> > > - 2 layers PCBs with QFP64/QFP100, 8 mils traces
> > > - full copper rubout (for our FR filters & antennas)
> > > - stencils
> > > 
> > > What do you think about it ?
> > > (LPKF & T-TECH second hand are more expensive !)
> > > 
> > > Thank you in advance !
> >
>

Somewhere in the $8700 range, IIRC. If you want the exact price, they will quote for you.
Mark

-----Original Message-----

>From: for_si2003 <for_si2003@...>
>Sent: Mar 4, 2009 10:20 AM
>To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: PCB prototyping
>
>How much does a Accurate 360 from accuratecnc cost ?
>
>Thanks in advance
>
>Vikas 
>
>--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Steve" <alienrelics@...> wrote:
>>
>> The Fireball is great, especially if you want to save a few dollars 
>> by assembling it yourself. It does more than PCBs, too.
>> 
>> Steve Greenfield
>> 
>> --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Herbert E. Plett" 
>> <cachureos@> wrote:
>> >
>> > 
>> > take a look at
>> > http://www.fireballcnc.com/
>> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Fireballcnc/
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > --- On Thu, 2/26/09, rf33333 <rf33333@> wrote:
>> > > Hi,
>> > > I'm looking for good CNC machine for PCB. I found one
>> > > www.accuratecnc.com <http://www.accuratecnc.com/> 
>> > > (Accurate 360)
>> > > I think the machine is suitable for my needs (mainly
>> > > prototyping):
>> > > - 2 layers PCBs with QFP64/QFP100, 8 mils traces
>> > > - full copper rubout (for our FR filters & antennas)
>> > > - stencils
>> > > 
>> > > What do you think about it ?
>> > > (LPKF & T-TECH second hand are more expensive !)
>> > > 
>> > > Thank you in advance !
>> >
>>
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------------
>
>Be sure to visit the group home and check for new Links, Files, and Photos:
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBsYahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

Who are you using for your supplies -- cutters, end mills and bits -- backup material?  Precise Bits was recommended to me  http://www.precisebits.com/applications/pcbtools.htm   TNX Jack

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, mlerman@... wrote:
>
> I have a 360 and I love it. Excellent support, too. No affiliation with them, just a big fan! I also have a used t-tech that I'd be interested in selling. My advice, though, is to get a new Accurate 360.
> 
SNIP

Lately I've been using Think and 
Tinker   <http://www.thinktink.com/>. Biggest problem is their $50 
minimum. I have used Precise Bits, too, with no problems. For backing 
material I've just gone to the local art supply and gotten precut 
pieces of masonite. It takes a bit of experimentation and experience 
to avoid breaking tools. I do like the V mills because they don't 
break nearly as easily as the regular mills.

Mark

>Who are you using for your supplies -- cutters, end mills and bits 
>-- backup material?  Precise Bits was recommended to 
>me  http://www.precisebits.com/applications/pcbtools.htm   TNX Jack
>
>--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, mlerman@... wrote:
> >
> > I have a 360 and I love it. Excellent support, too. No 
> affiliation with them, just a big fan! I also have a used t-tech 
> that I'd be interested in selling. My advice, though, is to get a 
> new Accurate 360.
> >
>SNIP
>
>
>
>------------------------------------
>
>Be sure to visit the group home and check for new Links, Files, and Photos:
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBsYahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>