Apple Logic Pro /LogicExpress Discussion

Hi,

 

I am an amateur musician who uses Logic Pro on a G5.

 

I am now looking to go Intel. 

                          

My question is simple: Do I need to buy a Mac Pro or will a high-end
iMac do the job? Is anyone out there using Logic Pro with an iMac and,
if so, what spec (Ram, HD etc) have you gone for?

 

I asked an Apple "Genius" the same question yesterday and his advice was
that although the iMac was perfectly capable, after a solid hour of
Logic Pro use it could overheat and turn itself off! "It's not a
problem," he added, "It's all about ventilation and that's what it is
supposed to do." Has anyone had that happen?

 

Thanks in advance,

Mike 

 


www.thisisnorthcliffe.co.uk

Any opinions expressed in this e-mail are those of the individual and not necessarily the company. This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and solely for the use of the intended recipient. If you are not the intended recipient or person responsible for delivering to the intended recipient, be advised that you have received this e-mail in error and that any use is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, advise the sender immediately by using the reply facility in your e-mail software. 

Warning: Computer viruses may be transmitted or downloaded onto any computer system via e-mail communication. It is the recipient�s responsibility to take appropriate action to prevent computer viruses being transmitted In this way. Accordingly Northcliffe Media Ltd disclaim all responsibility which arises directly or indirectly from such transmission of computer viruses. 

Northcliffe Media Ltd. Registered Office: Northcliffe Accounting Centre, PO Box 6795 St George Street, Leicester, LE1 1ZP, co no 272225, Registered in England and Wales, VAT no 243571174.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On Tue, Sep 30, 2008 at 1:46 AM, Norton, Mike - BUP <MNorton@...>wrote:

> Hi,
>
>
>
> I am an amateur musician who uses Logic Pro on a G5.
>
>
>
> I am now looking to go Intel.
>
>
>
> My question is simple: Do I need to buy a Mac Pro or will a high-end
> iMac do the job? Is anyone out there using Logic Pro with an iMac and,
> if so, what spec (Ram, HD etc) have you gone for?
>
>
>
> I asked an Apple "Genius" the same question yesterday and his advice was
> that although the iMac was perfectly capable, after a solid hour of
> Logic Pro use it could overheat and turn itself off! "It's not a
> problem," he added, "It's all about ventilation and that's what it is
> supposed to do." Has anyone had that happen?
>
>
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> Mike
>
>
>
>
> www.thisisnorthcliffe.co.uk
>
>
>
I've used Logic on a Mac Mini 2.0 ghz/3 GB RAM for well over an hour with no
problems.  I know that's not what you're looking at, but the Mini's
processing power is less than any new iMac currently on the market.  I
really doubt you'd have any serious trouble.  Hopefully, however, someone
else on this list is using an iMac and can provide some input.

Also, for what it's worth, I've found that the Apple Store Geniuses aren't
usually that knowledgable about Apple's "pro" products, such as Logic.  No
offense to them.  It's just been my experience.

-- 
-Shawn "Shawno" Thorpe
Hyper Nonsense - Talk/comedy podcast from central California
http://www.hypernonsense.com/

Shawnogram - Content = life.
http://www.shawnogram.com/


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Mike,

On Sep 30, 2008, at 1:46 AM, Norton, Mike - BUP wrote:
>
> My question is simple: Do I need to buy a Mac Pro or will a high-end
> iMac do the job?

Are you going to use large sample libraries (orchestral, etc.)? If so,  
then iMac is not an option as you will need to upgrade it to at least  
8 GB of RAM and have at least 1 more internal HD (I would recommend 2  
extra HDs, one for storing your sample libraries and the other for  
tracking). OTOH if you only work with synths and small libraries this  
is all moot and you're good to go with an iMac.

Best,

Andy
  (Mac Pro quad 2.66, 10 GB RAM, 10.5.5, Logic 8.0.2)

I wonder if there really isn´t a plugin that works in Logic that does  
what Vocalign does.....anyone.
I guess maybe Melodyne 2 can do it but only time can tell.

Melodyne is pretty good at that and many other things. I have the plugin and 
the standalone. 

> 
> I wonder if there really isn´t a plugin that works in Logic that does
> what Vocalign does.....anyone.
> I guess maybe Melodyne 2 can do it but only time can tell.
> 
> 
> 




**************
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On Sep 30, 2008, at 2:27 PM, GAmoore@... wrote:

> Melodyne is pretty good at that and many other things. I have the  
> plugin and
> the standalone.
>
> Yes but the plugin is monophonic so I can´t see how it´s possible to  
> compare one track to another. What I like about Vocalign is that you  
> kind of take a "master" and then everything is "ligned" to that. I  
> know that the right way is to spend more time doing the dubs but  
> more and more it seems like that battle is a lost one however  
> problematic that is.
>
>




>

>
> 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> 
> My question is simple: Do I need to buy a Mac Pro or will a high-end
> iMac do the job? Is anyone out there using Logic Pro with an iMac and,
> if so, what spec (Ram, HD etc) have you gone for? 
> 
>   
> 
> I asked an Apple "Genius" the same question yesterday and his advice was
> that although the iMac was perfectly capable, after a solid hour of
> Logic Pro use it could overheat and turn itself off! "It's not a
> problem," he added, "It's all about ventilation and that's what it is
> supposed to do." Has anyone had that happen? 
> 
I'm running Logic on a Mac Pro laptop and whilst it does heat up quite a 
bit, I have never had a problem with it. My own rule of thumb for how much 
to spend on a piece of computer equipment is this: 

the longer you are going to keep it, the better spec you need in the first 
place, because you always need more memory, processing power, hard disc 
space etc than you can ever envisage. 

I have a related question: I bought my laptop primarly for logic - would I 
have been better to by a desktop. I am specifically thinking of connectivity 
and sound card issues 

Andy B

This was a guy in an Apple Store?

I think you should get a second opinion- you can call me about this.

On Sep 30, 2008, at 4:46 AM, Norton, Mike - BUP wrote:

> I asked an Apple "Genius" the same question yesterday and his advice  
> was
> that although the iMac was perfectly capable, after a solid hour of
> Logic Pro use it could overheat and turn itself off! "It's not a
> problem," he added, "It's all about ventilation and that's what it is
> supposed to do." Has anyone had that happen?
>
>
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> Mike


Eddie Sullivan
Sales Consultant
IMS Pro A/V
The Stony Brook Technology Center
21 Technology Drive
E. Setauket NY 11733
1800 344 6434
fax-1 631 751 4552
esullivan@...



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I often record audio in logic, export to Melodyne Cre8, and I can put 
multiple tracks there and edit one at a time. For example copy the vocal and make a 
harmony. Then export back to Logic. I don't think its that hard to align things 
in Logic. I wish Logic would have the ability to open two audio tracks at 
once, and keep them in line then adjust the start points to line up though.


> > Yes but the plugin is monophonic so I can´t see how it´s possible to
> > compare one track to another. What I like about Vocalign is that you
> > kind of take a "master" and then everything is "ligned" to that. I
> > know that the right way is to spend more time doing the dubs but
> > more and more it seems like that battle is a lost one however
> > problematic that is.
> 




**************
Looking for simple solutions to your real-life financial 
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

From: GAmoore@... 
I often record audio in logic, export to Melodyne Cre8, and I can put 
multiple tracks there and edit one at a time. For example copy the vocal and make a 
harmony. Then export back to Logic. I don't think its that hard to align things 
in Logic. I wish Logic would have the ability to open two audio tracks at 
once, and keep them in line then adjust the start points to line up though.

I don't think it's hard to align tracks either but I'm talking about on more complex lines like on sentences with many words. Vocalign does this pretty convincingly as long as you don't try to use it on lead lines where it has it's artifacts. 
Anyway I have asked this question before and apparently there is only Vocalign that does what Vocalign does. It's just strange that a plugin that is so widely used in PT world never has made it outside of it. They do make a Performer version though which is just beyond me why they chose that particular platform but I guess Performer users who want Pitch´n Time could say the same thing about Logic.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Yeah, that was no "genius" at the Apple store.  iMacs don't overheat  
and shut down.  I use mine as a DVR, so it encodes video for hours at  
a time, which is arguably more processor and disk access intensive  
than using Logic, and have never had a problem.

As for using the iMac for Logic, here are my thoughts:

1.  At this stage, I don't think the processor is an issue.  Since I  
went Intel, I've not been able to tax the processors using Logic on  
my MacBook, iMac or Mac Pro, no matter how many tracks I run or plugs  
I use.  Obviously, there is a limit somewhere, but recording 10  
tracks simultaneously with 4-5 plugs on every track isn't close to it.

2.  Someone said that you needed additional *internal* drives.  I use  
external FW800 for everything but the OS and Logic itself, and  
haven't had a problem.  However, my mac pro has something like a  
thousand internal drive bays, and internals are less clutter on your  
desk, so there is an advantage there.

3.  My biggest complaint about the iMac is its defining  
characteristic - the built-in monitor.  They can run 2 monitors,  
which is nice, but I want both monitors to be huge, so I bought huge  
ones for my Pro, but am stuck with the middle-sized iMac monitor that  
I purchased originally.

4.  Last point is upgradeability.   I think FW800 will serve you well  
for storage for years to come, but ethernet and wifi may change  
dramatically in the next couple of years, and I would think those  
would be hard to upgrade on the iMac, whereas it's just a PCI card on  
the Mac Pro.

If you can afford it, the Mac Pro will serve you for longer before  
you need to buy a new computer.  But if you're just thinking about  
running Logic for the next 3 years and money is an issue, you won't  
regret buying the iMac.

Gregory

BTW, my iMac is 1st gen intel, so has much lower specs than any iMac  
you can buy now.

On Sep 30, 2008, at 10:02 AM, Eddie Sullivan wrote:

> This was a guy in an Apple Store?
>
> I think you should get a second opinion- you can call me about this.
>
> On Sep 30, 2008, at 4:46 AM, Norton, Mike - BUP wrote:
>
> > I asked an Apple "Genius" the same question yesterday and his advice
> > was
> > that although the iMac was perfectly capable, after a solid hour of
> > Logic Pro use it could overheat and turn itself off! "It's not a
> > problem," he added, "It's all about ventilation and that's what  
> it is
> > supposed to do." Has anyone had that happen?
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks in advance,
> >
> > Mike
>
> Eddie Sullivan
> Sales Consultant
> IMS Pro A/V
> The Stony Brook Technology Center
> 21 Technology Drive
> E. Setauket NY 11733
> 1800 344 6434
> fax-1 631 751 4552
> esullivan@...
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
> 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

i think they are beta testing Vocalign in AU right now. So hopefully it will 
be released soon.


**************
Looking for simple solutions to your real-life 
financial challenges?  Check out WalletPop for the latest news and 
information, tips and calculators.
      
(http://www.walletpop.com/?NCID=emlcntuswall00000001)


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On Sep 30, 2008, at 10:44 AM, GAmoore@... wrote:

> i think they are beta testing Vocalign in AU right now. So hopefully  
> it will
> be released soon.

I was able to try out the beta version in logic 8 and it worked well.  
The beta time expired before I really put it through any major hoops  
but I didn't experience any problems with it. 

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On Sep 30, 2008, at 10:44 AM, GAmoore@... wrote:

> i think they are beta testing Vocalign in AU right now. So hopefully 
> it will be released soon.

Very interesting, no doubt I will buy it.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In Logic_Cafe@yahoogroups.com, "Shawn Thorpe" <shawnogordo@...> wrote:
>
> Also, for what it's worth, I've found that the Apple Store Geniuses aren't
> usually that knowledgable about Apple's "pro" products, such as Logic.  No
> offense to them.  It's just been my experience.
> 
> -- 

More on Shawn's point: they do vary. 

As a VERY amateur musician who got into synths and electronics completely in the analog 
days (using just an ARP 2600 with a couple of TEAC 4-tr reel machines and a custom 
board) I was reasonably knowledgeable about synthesis and recording, but I had a LOT to 
learn in transferring that to Logic -- starting only three years ago. 

I paid for Apple's One to One for two years, and in two different Apple stores in Miami 
(and a few others I'd visit around the country while traveling on business), I found that 
most of those assigned to Logic knew their limits. 

Of the maybe 8-10 different "Geniuses" I've met, the  two or three who did say they used 
it a lot were in fact very, VERY helpful. In my sessions with those particular guys, I'd have 
to spend half the time in my sessions writing things down, taking screen shots, to make 
sure I could retain all the techniques and pointers they were showing me. 

So ask the "Genius" how much he uses Logic, for what, in what settings. You'll get the feel 
for whether he's on top of it or not. Do keep checking it out on forums like this and 
Apple's own forums as well.


As for using Logic on an iMac, mine is 2.16GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 2GB 667 MHz DDR2 
SDRAM. As a hobbyist, my largest projects are puny: maybe 6-8 audio tracks, maybe the 
same for synths, generally not much more on most tracks than compressor and limiter, a 
little Space Design, some EQ here and there. Some have quite a bit of EXS24, usually not 
much UB. Given all that, I've worked on projects for 3-4 hours at a time, rarely any 
problem. YMMV.

Good luck.

chuck

Thank you for your response, and to everyone who gave advice.

I've learnt as much about geniuses as I have about Logic and the iMac!

Regards,
Mike

On 1 Oct 2008, at 01:21, "cb50dc" <cb50dc@...> wrote:

> --- In Logic_Cafe@yahoogroups.com, "Shawn Thorpe" <shawnogordo@...>  
> wrote:
> >
> > Also, for what it's worth, I've found that the Apple Store  
> Geniuses aren't
> > usually that knowledgable about Apple's "pro" products, such as  
> Logic. No
> > offense to them. It's just been my experience.
> >
> > --
>
> More on Shawn's point: they do vary.
>
> As a VERY amateur musician who got into synths and electronics  
> completely in the analog
> days (using just an ARP 2600 with a couple of TEAC 4-tr reel  
> machines and a custom
> board) I was reasonably knowledgeable about synthesis and recording,  
> but I had a LOT to
> learn in transferring that to Logic -- starting only three years ago.
>
> I paid for Apple's One to One for two years, and in two different  
> Apple stores in Miami
> (and a few others I'd visit around the country while traveling on  
> business), I found that
> most of those assigned to Logic knew their limits.
>
> Of the maybe 8-10 different "Geniuses" I've met, the two or three  
> who did say they used
> it a lot were in fact very, VERY helpful. In my sessions with those  
> particular guys, I'd have
> to spend half the time in my sessions writing things down, taking  
> screen shots, to make
> sure I could retain all the techniques and pointers they were  
> showing me.
>
> So ask the "Genius" how much he uses Logic, for what, in what  
> settings. You'll get the feel
> for whether he's on top of it or not. Do keep checking it out on  
> forums like this and
> Apple's own forums as well.
>
> As for using Logic on an iMac, mine is 2.16GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 2GB  
> 667 MHz DDR2
> SDRAM. As a hobbyist, my largest projects are puny: maybe 6-8 audio  
> tracks, maybe the
> same for synths, generally not much more on most tracks than  
> compressor and limiter, a
> little Space Design, some EQ here and there. Some have quite a bit  
> of EXS24, usually not
> much UB. Given all that, I've worked on projects for 3-4 hours at a  
> time, rarely any
> problem. YMMV.
>
> Good luck.
>
> chuck
>
> 


www.thisisnorthcliffe.co.uk

Any opinions expressed in this e-mail are those of the individual and not necessarily the company. This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and solely for the use of the intended recipient. If you are not the intended recipient or person responsible for delivering to the intended recipient, be advised that you have received this e-mail in error and that any use is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, advise the sender immediately by using the reply facility in your e-mail software. 

Warning: Computer viruses may be transmitted or downloaded onto any computer system via e-mail communication. It is the recipient�s responsibility to take appropriate action to prevent computer viruses being transmitted In this way. Accordingly Northcliffe Media Ltd disclaim all responsibility which arises directly or indirectly from such transmission of computer viruses. 

Northcliffe Media Ltd. Registered Office: Northcliffe Accounting Centre, PO Box 6795 St George Street, Leicester, LE1 1ZP, co no 272225, Registered in England and Wales, VAT no 243571174.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

The Creative Specialists do the training in Apple Store one to one sessions, not the 
Geniuses.  Getting certified in ANY pro-level application is not a trivial investment in time, 
and they get paid the same whether they know pro apps or not.

In my case I know and use Logic, but since I don't record multiple instrumentalists at one 
time, don't have a multiport audio interface.  By definition a trainer can't take you any 
farther than they themselves have gone.  To be certain of getting a trainer with Logic 
experience, be sure to sign up for a Logic session, not Garageband or OS/X..

The geniuses are the guys behind the counter that handle broken systems.

karl

--- In Logic_Cafe@yahoogroups.com, "cb50dc" <cb50dc@...> wrote:

>
> --- In Logic_Cafe@yahoogroups.com, "Shawn Thorpe" <shawnogordo@> wrote:
> >
> > Also, for what it's worth, I've found that the Apple Store Geniuses aren't
> > usually that knowledgable about Apple's "pro" products, such as Logic.  No
> > offense to them.  It's just been my experience.

--- In Logic_Cafe@yahoogroups.com, "Karl M" <mkarl2@...> wrote:
>
> The Creative Specialists do the training in Apple Store one to one
sessions, not the 
> Geniuses. 
> 

Right. Sorry for that oversight on my part. I know the guys I work
with and I tend to see them all the same ("Apple Store guys"). 

chuck

Hey Mike.

I just bought a refurbished imac with 2.4 GHz, 250 Gig hard drive and
maxed out the RAM to 4 Gigs. I use it for my Logic Studio LP 8
With the 4 Gigs I payed about $1300 for the whole deal, and my imac
works great...
I too had gone to my local Apple store and the bright fellow told me I
would have no problems if I bought the Mac Pro, but would have
difficulties if I went with anything less..but $4000 was not in my
budget..
I am totally happy with my imac...
If you need to know anymore just email me..
best of luck
Jack
healingtouch58@...






--- In Logic_Cafe@yahoogroups.com, "Norton, Mike - BUP" <MNorton@...>
wrote:
>
> Hi,
> 
>  
> 
> I am an amateur musician who uses Logic Pro on a G5.
> 
>  
> 
> I am now looking to go Intel. 
> 
>                           
> 
> My question is simple: Do I need to buy a Mac Pro or will a high-end
> iMac do the job? Is anyone out there using Logic Pro with an iMac and,
> if so, what spec (Ram, HD etc) have you gone for?
> 
>  
> 
> I asked an Apple "Genius" the same question yesterday and his advice was
> that although the iMac was perfectly capable, after a solid hour of
> Logic Pro use it could overheat and turn itself off! "It's not a
> problem," he added, "It's all about ventilation and that's what it is
> supposed to do." Has anyone had that happen?
> 
>  
> 
> Thanks in advance,
> 
> Mike 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> www.thisisnorthcliffe.co.uk
> 
> Any opinions expressed in this e-mail are those of the individual
and not necessarily the company. This e-mail and any files transmitted
with it are confidential and solely for the use of the intended
recipient. If you are not the intended recipient or person responsible
for delivering to the intended recipient, be advised that you have
received this e-mail in error and that any use is strictly prohibited.
If you have received this e-mail in error, advise the sender
immediately by using the reply facility in your e-mail software. 
> 
> Warning: Computer viruses may be transmitted or downloaded onto any
computer system via e-mail communication. It is the recipient's
responsibility to take appropriate action to prevent computer viruses
being transmitted In this way. Accordingly Northcliffe Media Ltd
disclaim all responsibility which arises directly or indirectly from
such transmission of computer viruses. 
> 
> Northcliffe Media Ltd. Registered Office: Northcliffe Accounting
Centre, PO Box 6795 St George Street, Leicester, LE1 1ZP, co no
272225, Registered in England and Wales, VAT no 243571174.

> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

I think that "genius" was just trying to make a bigger sale. I'm using
a 2.4ghz 24" iMac with 4gigs ram, 320 HD and Logic Pro, and my iMac
has never over heated, and I using Logic all day long. I also work
from the internal drive.

While my sessions aren't huge (average of 20 to 30 tracks), I always
have multiple programs running while editing and mixing on Logic. So
the CPU is being pushed. Additionally, with a lot of my sessions I'll
have a good handful of instances of Revalver mkIII running which can
be very taxing on the CPU, along with Space designer, Delay Designer,
etc. Granted, for my work I'm not running huge sessions that some
music productions involve, but I really wouldn't worry about it.
Although if you're going to be running huge sessions with tons of
plug-ins and VI's, maybe the Mac Pro would be the best option.

He said it 'could' over heat. Yeah, it 'could', but it probably won't,
IMO.






--- In Logic_Cafe@yahoogroups.com, "Norton, Mike - BUP" <MNorton@...>
wrote:
>
> Hi,
> 
>  
> 
> I am an amateur musician who uses Logic Pro on a G5.
> 
>  
> 
> I am now looking to go Intel. 
> 
>                           
> 
> My question is simple: Do I need to buy a Mac Pro or will a high-end
> iMac do the job? Is anyone out there using Logic Pro with an iMac and,
> if so, what spec (Ram, HD etc) have you gone for?
> 
>  
> 
> I asked an Apple "Genius" the same question yesterday and his advice was
> that although the iMac was perfectly capable, after a solid hour of
> Logic Pro use it could overheat and turn itself off! "It's not a
> problem," he added, "It's all about ventilation and that's what it is
> supposed to do." Has anyone had that happen?
> 
>  
> 
> Thanks in advance,
> 
> Mike 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> www.thisisnorthcliffe.co.uk
> 
> Any opinions expressed in this e-mail are those of the individual
and not necessarily the company. This e-mail and any files transmitted
with it are confidential and solely for the use of the intended
recipient. If you are not the intended recipient or person responsible
for delivering to the intended recipient, be advised that you have
received this e-mail in error and that any use is strictly prohibited.
If you have received this e-mail in error, advise the sender
immediately by using the reply facility in your e-mail software. 
> 
> Warning: Computer viruses may be transmitted or downloaded onto any
computer system via e-mail communication. It is the recipient's
responsibility to take appropriate action to prevent computer viruses
being transmitted In this way. Accordingly Northcliffe Media Ltd
disclaim all responsibility which arises directly or indirectly from
such transmission of computer viruses. 
> 
> Northcliffe Media Ltd. Registered Office: Northcliffe Accounting
Centre, PO Box 6795 St George Street, Leicester, LE1 1ZP, co no
272225, Registered in England and Wales, VAT no 243571174.

> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>