Apple Logic Pro /LogicExpress Discussion

I recently bought run Logic Express 8.0.2. I popped 4GB into my 20" iMac and found that my RME FireFace800 works just fine via the firewire 800 port.

But I am having one anomaly. I have a Yamaha XS6 with coaxial digital out. When I connect via the RME to Logic - it all works - but the signal generally peaks at about 1/4 of the meter.

Is that normal? Is their a PRO/CONSUMER switch for coaxial digital :) I don't have any control over the volumne when I take digital out - so there isn't much else I can do other than go analog on.

Thoughts?

On another note, will I get a warmer, better sound going out of the DA converters on the Motif ... and into the AD converters on the RME? I've considered a purchase like the API A2D ... which would do just that but it would SPDIF into my RME again and if this is normal when using the coaxial SPDIF - then I'd be right back where I started.

I recently bounced 8 tracks from an old ADAT XT via lightpipe into the RME and Logic levels where much better ... peaking when the ADAT peaked.

Is it the SPDIF interface on the Motif? the RME? Logic? Anyone else had similar experiences?

Thanks in advance for your thoughts.

-Luther

I have used SPDIF and TOSLINK optical cables and even a cheap $30 
spdif/toslink converter, and the signal levels are always fine. 

There are probably some sites on the internet with shootouts between 
different a/d converters, but I suspect that anything costing a few hundred bucks or 
more will be fine (in other words anything but the cheapest ones). I am sure 
there are differences, but I think they are pretty subtle and hard to hear the 
differences. There are many other ways to get warmer sound - from the preamps 
and compressors to any number of plugins. The job of converters is accuracy not 
warmth or character.


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

So to paraphrase my question - is anyone aware of any specific reason my Motif XS6 via SPDIF to the RME and into Logic is coming in at such a low level?

It is a digital signal so it can't be related to the quality of the COAX cable ... I wonder if this is a Yamaha Motif question. It isn't distorted - just low.

-Luther



--- On Wed, 1/21/09, GAmoore@... <GAmoore@aol.com> wrote:

From: GAmoore@... <GAmoore@...>
Subject: Re: [Logic_Cafe] Coaxial SPDIF in
To: Logic_Cafe@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday, January 21, 2009, 12:12 PM










    
            I have used SPDIF and TOSLINK optical cables and even a cheap $30 

spdif/toslink converter, and the signal levels are always fine. 



There are probably some sites on the internet with shootouts between 

different a/d converters, but I suspect that anything costing a few hundred bucks or 

more will be fine (in other words anything but the cheapest ones). I am sure 

there are differences, but I think they are pretty subtle and hard to hear the 

differences. There are many other ways to get warmer sound - from the preamps 

and compressors to any number of plugins. The job of converters is accuracy not 

warmth or character.



************ **

A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See 

yours in just 2 easy steps! 

(http://pr.atwola. com/promoclk/ 100000075x121585 5013x1201028747/ aol?redir= http://www. freecreditreport .com/pm/default. aspx?sc=668072%

26hmpgID=62% 26bcd=Decemailfo oterNO62)



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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On 22/01/2009, at 3:07 AM, luther baker wrote:

> I recently bought run Logic Express 8.0.2. I popped 4GB into my 20"  
> iMac and found that my RME FireFace800 works just fine via the  
> firewire 800 port.
>
> But I am having one anomaly. I have a Yamaha XS6 with coaxial  
> digital out. When I connect via the RME to Logic - it all works -  
> but the signal generally peaks at about 1/4 of the meter.
>
> Is that normal? Is their a PRO/CONSUMER switch for coaxial  
> digital :) I don't have any control over the volumne when I take  
> digital out - so there isn't much else I can do other than go analog  
> on.
>
> Thoughts?

Yes there is a pro/ consumer setting for Coaxial. Check the options in  
the RME Settings panel. The other thing you'll need to do is run a  
clock signal back to the Motif to achieve digital sync (RME master,  
Motif slave). Lack of sync may be causing your odd peaking issue. It's  
much better to use the FF as the master digital clock rather than the  
Motif.

>
> On another note, will I get a warmer, better sound going out of the  
> DA converters on the Motif ... and into the AD converters on the  
> RME? I've considered a purchase like the API A2D ... which would do  
> just that but it would SPDIF into my RME again and if this is normal  
> when using the coaxial SPDIF - then I'd be right back where I started.

Going digital all the way from the Motif to Logic will preserve the  
most accurate recording of the Motif's sounds - no doubt. But he API  
preamp you mention is a very nice piece of gear and while going  
through it to record the Motif won't result in as accurate recording  
it could very easily impart some desirable coloration to the sound. If  
you've got plenty of money it could be fun and you could record other  
things through it as well if you needed that.

Kind regards


:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Paul Najar
Jaminajar Music Production
www.jaminajar.com




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On 22/01/2009, at 5:25 AM, luther baker wrote:

> So to paraphrase my question - is anyone aware of any specific  
> reason my Motif XS6 via SPDIF to the RME and into Logic is coming in  
> at such a low level?
>
> It is a digital signal so it can't be related to the quality of the  
> COAX cable ... I wonder if this is a Yamaha Motif question. It isn't  
> distorted - just low.
>
> -Luther

There could be another gain stage in the Motif that's not turned up  
enough???

one might be in 16 bit mode and the other in 24 bit mode, which would cut the 
level.

i wonder if you can try using the Toslink input to the mac directly from each 
one, and judge where the level is falling from that.


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> Yes there is a pro/ consumer setting for Coaxial. Check the options in  the RME Settings panel. 


Great - this is what I'll check this evening.

> The other thing you'll need to do is run a  clock signal back to the Motif to achieve digital sync (RME master,  Motif slave). Lack of sync may be causing your odd peaking issue. It's  

much better to use the FF as the master digital clock rather than the  

Motif.

On more than one occasion, whether it is my Motif or my Proteus 2000, when I set the interface as Master, I get randomish distortion artifacts while playing. Those artifacts go away once set the instrument as master. I'd agree that I'd prefer to use the clock in the RME - but in my experience, the sound has been cleaner when I let the instrument be its own master clock and set the RME to slave.

But I will try a few more vavriants of this tonite and see what I find. Thanks for the suggestions.

-Luther




--- On Wed, 1/21/09, Paul Najar <jaminajar@mac.com> wrote:

From: Paul Najar <jaminajar@...>
Subject: Re: [Logic_Cafe] Coaxial SPDIF in
To: Logic_Cafe@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday, January 21, 2009, 3:46 PM










    
            

On 22/01/2009, at 3:07 AM, luther baker wrote:



> I recently bought run Logic Express 8.0.2. I popped 4GB into my 20"  

> iMac and found that my RME FireFace800 works just fine via the  

> firewire 800 port.

>

> But I am having one anomaly. I have a Yamaha XS6 with coaxial  

> digital out. When I connect via the RME to Logic - it all works -  

> but the signal generally peaks at about 1/4 of the meter.

>

> Is that normal? Is their a PRO/CONSUMER switch for coaxial  

> digital :) I don't have any control over the volumne when I take  

> digital out - so there isn't much else I can do other than go analog  

> on.

>

> Thoughts?



Yes there is a pro/ consumer setting for Coaxial. Check the options in  

the RME Settings panel. The other thing you'll need to do is run a  

clock signal back to the Motif to achieve digital sync (RME master,  

Motif slave). Lack of sync may be causing your odd peaking issue. It's  

much better to use the FF as the master digital clock rather than the  

Motif.



>

> On another note, will I get a warmer, better sound going out of the  

> DA converters on the Motif ... and into the AD converters on the  

> RME? I've considered a purchase like the API A2D ... which would do  

> just that but it would SPDIF into my RME again and if this is normal  

> when using the coaxial SPDIF - then I'd be right back where I started.



Going digital all the way from the Motif to Logic will preserve the  

most accurate recording of the Motif's sounds - no doubt. But he API  

preamp you mention is a very nice piece of gear and while going  

through it to record the Motif won't result in as accurate recording  

it could very easily impart some desirable coloration to the sound. If  

you've got plenty of money it could be fun and you could record other  

things through it as well if you needed that.



Kind regards



:::::::::::: ::::::::: ::::::::: ::::::::: ::::::::: :::

Paul Najar

Jaminajar Music Production

www.jaminajar. com



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




      

    
    
	
	 
	
	








	


	
	

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On 22/01/2009, at 9:38 AM, luther baker wrote:

> On more than one occasion, whether it is my Motif or my Proteus  
> 2000, when I set the interface as Master, I get randomish distortion  
> artifacts while playing. Those artifacts go away once set the  
> instrument as master. I'd agree that I'd prefer to use the clock in  
> the RME - but in my experience, the sound has been cleaner when I  
> let the instrument be its own master clock and set the RME to slave.
>
> But I will try a few more vavriants of this tonite and see what I  
> find. Thanks for the suggestions.

Unless you have the loopback cable running AND the Motif or Proteus in  
External clock mode, it's not possible to use the RME as master  
reliably and this could explain the random distortions you mention.  
I'm not very familiar with either of your machines but it has long  
since been a question mark for me when looking at the spec's on newer  
ranges of hardware synths that did offer digital outputs. Many did not  
have a corresponding digital input or word clock connector for slaving  
their digital clocks to a more stable higher quality external clock  
source.

Good luck.


:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Paul Najar
Jaminajar Music Production
www.jaminajar.com




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]