Mellotronists

Hello all
Surely you couldn't possibly be sued if you used the spanish guitar 
riff from Bungalow Bill because the Beatles didn't write that part of 
the song!  Okay, if you got a copy of the White Album and sampled the 
sound off that I suppose you could then be sued by EMI as the CD (or 
vinyl etc) is their recording and therefore their copyright.
But as regards other Mellotron sounds, if you buy a Mellotron (or 
otherwise pay to use it, for example by hiring one or using one 
belonging to a studio) then you have the right to use those sounds as 
you see fit.  Don't you?
It's no different, surely, from using a factory preset on a DX-7?  
Remember that shakuhachi sample form Slegehammer that showed up 
everywhere in the 80's?  I don't remember Peter Gabriel suing anyone!

Regards,
Steve.

You are 100% exactly right!!!

The spanish guitar also appears in some live King Crimson performances.



----- Original Message ----- 

From: stevetebble <stevetebble@...>
To: <Mellotronists@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, February 14, 2006 3:08 PM
Subject: [Mellotronists] Re: Copyright


> Hello all
> Surely you couldn't possibly be sued if you used the spanish guitar 
> riff from Bungalow Bill because the Beatles didn't write that part of 
> the song!  Okay, if you got a copy of the White Album and sampled the 
> sound off that I suppose you could then be sued by EMI as the CD (or 
> vinyl etc) is their recording and therefore their copyright.
> But as regards other Mellotron sounds, if you buy a Mellotron (or 
> otherwise pay to use it, for example by hiring one or using one 
> belonging to a studio) then you have the right to use those sounds as 
> you see fit.  Don't you?
> It's no different, surely, from using a factory preset on a DX-7?  
> Remember that shakuhachi sample form Slegehammer that showed up 
> everywhere in the 80's?  I don't remember Peter Gabriel suing anyone!
> 
> Regards,
> Steve.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
>

On Feb 14, 2006, at 3:08 PM, stevetebble wrote:

> I don't remember Peter Gabriel suing anyone!
>

Actually, Steve, he had them quietly rubbed out...

Rick

Hi again...

I remember Julian Cope talking about that Mk.2 Spanish Guitar sound... 
He wanted to use it on a song he was recording... but his producer 
thought he had sampled it off the "White Album". When Julian told him 
that he got it off the Mk.2, the producer told him NOT to use it... 
because he figured that the Beatles purchased the copyright to the 
sound so that nobody could use it again!

Go Figure...

J.P.

MicroTron 001

Dear All,
 
The crux of Julian's dilemma about using Bungalow Bill was that an action  
could be brought by Sony that, 'the last deemed  significant use of the phrase 
was on the White Album'.  Although this may  not have stood up in court, the 
action from Sony at that time would  have cost a lot to defend and Julian would 
not have had the financial clout to  make that defence, even though he would 
have been found patently within his  rights to use the BB phrase.  Money wins 
cases or at least sees off the  innocent defendants.
 
Best,
 
Martin

STREETLY ELECTRONICS - All things Mellotronic
_www.mellotronics.co.uk_ (http://www.mellotronics.co.uk/) 
www.mellotronics.com

US East Coast  Agent - Jimmy Moore _JMoore6397_ (mailto:JMoore6397) @...
US West Coast Agent - Paul  Cox _pjc56@..._ 
(mailto:pjc56@...)

Other than King Crimsons Epitaph box set, has the spanish guitar
phrase appreared on any other albums? 

--- In Mellotronists@yahoogroups.com, tronbros@... wrote:
>
> Dear All,
>  
> The crux of Julian's dilemma about using Bungalow Bill was that an
action  
> could be brought by Sony that, 'the last deemed  significant use of
the phrase 
> was on the White Album'.  Although this may  not have stood up in
court, the 
> action from Sony at that time would  have cost a lot to defend and
Julian would 
> not have had the financial clout to  make that defence, even though
he would 
> have been found patently within his  rights to use the BB phrase. 
Money wins 
> cases or at least sees off the  innocent defendants.
>  
> Best,
>  
> Martin
> 
> STREETLY ELECTRONICS - All things Mellotronic
> _www.mellotronics.co.uk_ (http://www.mellotronics.co.uk/) 
> www.mellotronics.com
> 
> US East Coast  Agent - Jimmy Moore _JMoore6397_ (mailto:JMoore6397)
@...

> US West Coast Agent - Paul  Cox _pjc56@..._ 
> (mailto:pjc56@...)
>

To add to Martin's comments:

The potential Sony lawsuit would have been expensive to defend, which is why
the producer would have given Julian this advice. A lawyer would have
charged a lot because it has the potential to be a high profile case and
possibly make the lawyer (in)famous.

It wouldn't have anything to do with the Beatles because they couldn't
purchase the copyright in the first place even if they wanted to.

The copyright would be owned by the anonymous guitar player, and the "rights
to mechanical reproduction" would be owned by whoever holds the original
master tape the guitar was recorded to (not subsequent copies of that tape).

In order for a copyright to be purchased, one needs written legal permission
from *both* these parties. If it can't be secured (which is the case here),
then the copyright can't be purchased to prevent others from using it.


Chris

> Hi again...
>
> I remember Julian Cope talking about that Mk.2 Spanish Guitar sound...
> He wanted to use it on a song he was recording... but his producer
> thought he had sampled it off the "White Album". When Julian told him
> that he got it off the Mk.2, the producer told him NOT to use it...
> because he figured that the Beatles purchased the copyright to the
> sound so that nobody could use it again!
>
> Go Figure...
>
> J.P.
>
> MicroTron 001
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

On Wed, 15 Feb 2006 chris.dale@... wrote:

> To add to Martin's comments:
>
> The potential Sony lawsuit would have been expensive to defend, which is why
> the producer would have given Julian this advice. A lawyer would have
> charged a lot because it has the potential to be a high profile case and
> possibly make the lawyer (in)famous.
>
> It wouldn't have anything to do with the Beatles because they couldn't
> purchase the copyright in the first place even if they wanted to.
>
> The copyright would be owned by the anonymous guitar player, and the "rights
> to mechanical reproduction" would be owned by whoever holds the original
> master tape the guitar was recorded to (not subsequent copies of that tape).
>
> In order for a copyright to be purchased, one needs written legal permission
> from *both* these parties. If it can't be secured (which is the case here),
> then the copyright can't be purchased to prevent others from using it.
>
> Chris



unless, as i am sure the case is here, it was performed as
a "work for hire" thus relinquishing any and all rights to
the performance to the person/party/etc doing the hiring.
[though i am not actually a land shark and any legal advice
should be referred to competent counsel]

jeffrey d coulter, esq.
[the formal definition of "esq" can be used by a landownder]

> > Hi again...
> >
> > I remember Julian Cope talking about that Mk.2 Spanish Guitar sound...
> > He wanted to use it on a song he was recording... but his producer
> > thought he had sampled it off the "White Album". When Julian told him
> > that he got it off the Mk.2, the producer told him NOT to use it...
> > because he figured that the Beatles purchased the copyright to the
> > sound so that nobody could use it again!
> >
> > Go Figure...
> >
> > J.P.
> >
> > MicroTron 001
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

I go by "ESQ-1" just to be different.  You can call me "Ensoniq" for 
short...


> jeffrey d coulter, esq.
> [the formal definition of "esq" can be used by a landownder]

On Wed, 15 Feb 2006, jonesalley wrote:

> I go by "ESQ-1" just to be different.  You can call me "Ensoniq" for
> short...


good one!

i actually know about 8 people that are FORMER ensoniq employees,
including the man i bought my first synth from in 1978.

i am currently playing music with one of them about once a month.
[he works for a local a/v supply company]

one of them works for korg now.
one of them is the founder of broadjam.com after leaving ensoniq for
sonic foundry.
at least two of them work for aviom.

all of them are great people and still keep in touch with each other.
many of them are still in this area [philadelphia].

it was a cool, but sometimes flawed, company.

jeffrey d coulter [cranky jerk]

;0)

In a message dated 2/15/2006 3:04:16 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,  
jonesalley@... writes:

I go by  "ESQ-1" just to be different.  You can call me "Ensoniq" for  
short...



I just think of you as, "soni."

I LOVED my SQ-80 till the display died.  Grundgy 8-bit lofi.... 
precious.  I'll buy another someday.


fritZ

-----Original Message-----
From: jeffc@...
To: Mellotronists@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wed, 15 Feb 2006 15:10:56 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: [Mellotronists] Re: Copyright

   On Wed, 15 Feb 2006, jonesalley wrote:

> I go by "ESQ-1" just to be different.  You can call me "Ensoniq" for
> short...


good one!

i actually know about 8 people that are FORMER ensoniq employees,
including the man i bought my first synth from in 1978.

i am currently playing music with one of them about once a month.
[he works for a local a/v supply company]

one of them works for korg now.
one of them is the founder of broadjam.com after leaving ensoniq for
sonic foundry.
at least two of them work for aviom.

all of them are great people and still keep in touch with each other.
many of them are still in this area [philadelphia].

it was a cool, but sometimes flawed, company.

jeffrey d coulter [cranky jerk]

;0)



Yahoo! Groups Links

In a message dated 15/02/2006 20:41:31 GMT Standard Time, fdoddy@...  
writes:

I LOVED  my SQ-80 till the display died.  Grundgy 8-bit lofi....  
precious.  I'll buy another someday.


Mirage was good, strings had a tron-like harsness...
 
Norm

I still have my Mirage and an ESQ-M(although it's been down for over a 
year :-( )
Pete

fdoddy@... wrote:

> I LOVED my SQ-80 till the display died.  Grundgy 8-bit lofi....
> precious.  I'll buy another someday.
>
>
> fritZ
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: jeffc@...
> To: Mellotronists@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Wed, 15 Feb 2006 15:10:56 -0500 (EST)
> Subject: Re: [Mellotronists] Re: Copyright
>
>    On Wed, 15 Feb 2006, jonesalley wrote:
>
> > I go by "ESQ-1" just to be different.  You can call me "Ensoniq" for
> > short...
>
>
> good one!
>
> i actually know about 8 people that are FORMER ensoniq employees,
> including the man i bought my first synth from in 1978.
>
> i am currently playing music with one of them about once a month.
> [he works for a local a/v supply company]
>
> one of them works for korg now.
> one of them is the founder of broadjam.com after leaving ensoniq for
> sonic foundry.
> at least two of them work for aviom.
>
> all of them are great people and still keep in touch with each other.
> many of them are still in this area [philadelphia].
>
> it was a cool, but sometimes flawed, company.
>
> jeffrey d coulter [cranky jerk]