QTR-Quadtone RIP

Hi Roger,
Aah - I'm not the only one! I was beginning to think I was on something of a fool's quest :0)
Actually the SG were recommended over the quad black by my reseller as giving better prints for the 1290.
But I think you can help me. Although on about the fourth reading the documentation is slowly starting to make sense, what I'm trying to work out is what you've presumably already achieved: Namely that of creating a complete printer and paper model for these inks. Since they're not listed by default, I'm having trouble understanding how I do this.
At the moment your suggestions re curves are a bit ahead of where I'm at right now. I'm still trying to get the software configured to my liking.
I've printed an ink separation sheet and set an ink limit. As soon as I get my spectrometer plugged in I'll be able to start measuring.
As I understand the SG set, indeed it contains no true greys. I believe it was designed to use what are effectively highly diluted CYM with LC LM inks which when mixed, will produce close to neutral greys.
Thing is - at this moment in time, I'm not able to experiment because I'm still struggling to understand what I do with the information derived from the ink limit testing. Into which profile does this information go - I presume I have to create this profile/printer data?
Once I'm up and running and have got something that looks like a known image, I'll be more than happy to share any discoveries on here.

-- 
  Alan Ansell
  aansell@...

----- Original message -----
From: "burnandodge" <roger@...>
To: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com
Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2007 15:33:19 -0000
Subject: {SPAM 04.2} [QuadtoneRIP] Re: Newbie help: Create New Ink/Paper profile  in QuadtoneRIP

Hi Alan,
I'm not expert enough to give you a definitive answer, but as another
Lyson user I thought I would add my little bit. I don't often see
the "L-word" mentioned in this group!
I am using the Lyson Quad Black neutral, not the Small Gamut set and
I believe they will be very different in QTR. I was having problems
getting decent prints with the QB set until I discovered QTR - now I
can print on glossy paper and easily achieve a Dmax greater than 2
without losing shadow detail. Even on matt (fine art) paper I can get
a really good black, so I'm very pleased with the Lyson ink set now.
It seems to me though that the SG set will be completely different in
that you only have one true "grey" - that is the black ink. To keep
the tone (chromaticity) consistent across the full density range you
would have to use at least one of the "grey" inks at all densities.
As I understand QTR this would only happen if you called the grey ink
a "toner". Or am I missing the point?
I was considering changing to the SG set before QTR solved my
problems with the QB, and then I was struggling to see how QTR would
handle the SG. I guessed that you would have to generate three
separate curves, one for each "toner" and then combine then in
different proportions at the print stage to get the tone you want.
Can one of the real experts help? I would still like to try the SG
set if it can compete with my Quad Black.
Roger
--- In [1]QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "Alan Ansell" <aansell@...> wrote:
>
>
> Hi Daniel,
>
> Thanks for helping on this. Due to the relative lateness of the
hour I don't think I explained it all very clearly. Let me try to use
the QTR terms.
> My problems appear to stem from the fact that from the first moment
I opened the software, I was prompted to select a printer. I have two
connected so naturally I opted for the one on my system for B&W. This
in itself caused a program error which persists - access code
violation. I guessed this was due to the use of the & (ampersand?) in
the printer name. I've since renamed it but the error persists in
slightly different form.
> Having selected the printer I was further prompted to select the
inks. On the basis of the fact that I would be creating a new Ink and
Paper combo. I felt this was not a critical step so I chose K6.
> After your earlier reply the penny dropped slightly so I selected
the inkseparation6.tiff from the bin folder. This is the correct ink
set up for my printer. I loaded this into the RIP under the current
printer Model but when I selected Calibration Mode several things
happened: Firstly, after initiating the several .exes quadtoprinter;
Rawprint etc, the program returned a simple error message: I/O error.
Although it continued to print - the software simply defaulted to
printing the calibration test sheet for the model loaded - in this
case the K6 ink set - which as stated has eight ink channels. I don't
think this is useful because even if I disregard the two unused
channels, last night's print out shows just the black ink channel
reaches its limit at 30%. This is not true for the other five inks.
> I'm going to reinstall this software - thereby hopefully
overwriting this installation and resetting my starting point (I
cannot discover how to actually reload a 'new' printer model. I seem
to be stuck with this erroneous first choice).
> As I say - I know it's new software and there is a learning curve
attached but it does seem to be slightly less than completely user
friendly. Trust me - I've read everything twice by now :0)
> Alan
>
> --
> Alan Ansell
> aansell@...
>
> ----- Original message -----
> From: "Daniel" <dchow1961@...>
> To: [2]QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2007 01:34:12 -0000
> Subject: [QuadtoneRIP] Re: Newbie help: Create New Ink/Paper
profile in QuadtoneRIP
>
> since you're creating your own curves, then the first thing is to
print the Ink Seperation
> Test Page. which you're trying to do. if you have not yet gotten to
the user guide, please
> go to page 11 "Creating and Editing Curves with QuadToneRIP".
> when you've printed this test page, let it dry for about an hour or
more. visually estimate
> the ink limit of the K ink only. i know the guide suggests
otherwise, but K ink is all you
> need to estimate. if you can visually indentify the ink patch
that's in between the lighter
> and the darker, then that's the ink limit. you don't need to be
precise here.
> i use QTR on a mac so the procedure is somewhat different. i
suggest you read the
> "Creating and Editing Curves with QuadToneRIP".
> the goal here is to identify the ink limit so that you can print
the Ink Seperation Test Page
> again based on this ink limit. let this print dry for somewhere
between 2 and 4 hours
> before doing any measurements. this is the stage where you will
need your spectrometer.
> i have made a file for myself to help me identify the ink limit but
i'm not sure how QTRgui
> prints. in QTR for the mac, i print this file by selecting
calibration mode. this file is located
> here: [1][3]http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/files/Tools/
> Ink_Limit_Pattern_Page.zip
> i hope this answers your question.
> daniel
> --- In [2][4]QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "Alan Ansell" <aansell@>
wrote:
> >
> >
> > Hi Daniel,
> >
> > Thanks for that.
> >
> > I'm using an Epson 1290.
> >
> > I've literally only bought the RIP tonight so it's fully up to
date. I am attempting to use
> the QTRgui and I'm currently reading the gui help files and all the
other documentation
> you list.
> >
> > I will be using the spectrometer from the PrintFix Pro kit (when
it arrives). I'm not exactly
> chomping at the bit to print right now - but I want to have a
thorough read through of
> documentation before I start printing out using this ink set -
since mistakes can prove
> costly at this stage.
> >
> > I feel that even with the information provided it seems to assume
a level of familiarity
> with the software that I obviously don't have.
> >
> > What I did was to open the QTR gui and selected one of the
inbuilt 'sets' for printer and
> ink because obviously my particular ink/paper combination isn't
listed. So I picked the
> Quad1290-K6. Of course when I printed out the Ink limit test, the
inks came out listed for
> that set - (of course). So although I now have a page with six ink
level tests printed on it,
> saving this later on seems irrelevant since the names don't match -
and it was designed
> for eight inks.
> >
> > If I'm doing something fundamentally wrong, then that's fine -
but it's a case of not
> really knowing how/where to start.
> >
> > Alan
>
>
> References
>
> 1. [5]http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/files/Tools/
> 2. mailto:QuadtoneRIP%40yahoogroups.com
> 3.
[6]http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/message/4335;_ylc=X3oDMTM1cW
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M1
> 4.
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> 5.
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> 6.
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> 7.
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> 8.
[11]http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/photos;_ylc=X3oDMTJmNmE1b3Mw
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> 9.
[12]http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/links;_ylc=X3oDMTJnYzN0bXFyB
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yBHNsawNsaW5rcwRzdGltZQMxMTc1MjE4NDg2
> 10.
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> 11.
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> 12.
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> 13.
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> 16. mailto:[19]QuadtoneRIP-digest@yahoogroups.com?subject=Email%
20Delivery:%20Digest
> 17. mailto:[20]QuadtoneRIP-traditional@yahoogroups.com?subject=Change%
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> 18.
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> 19. [22]http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> 20. mailto:[23]QuadtoneRIP-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=
> 21.
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> 22.
[25]http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/files;_ylc=X3oDMTJoZnVoOTdtB
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MxMTc1MjE4NDg2?
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> 25.
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> 26.
[29]http://groups.yahoo.com/gads;_ylc=X3oDMTJkMG1vcTJuBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BF9w
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eabp7a0/*[37]http://tv.yahoo.com/american-idol/show/34934
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>


References

1. mailto:QuadtoneRIP%40yahoogroups.com
2. mailto:QuadtoneRIP%40yahoogroups.com
3. http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/files/Tools/
4. mailto:QuadtoneRIP%40yahoogroups.com
5. http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/files/Tools/
6. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/message/4335;_ylc=X3oDMTM1cW
7. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJxczcxZGcwBF
8. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJmZ3VwcTc1BF
9. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/messages;_ylc=X3oDMTJmdGd0OT
  10. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/files;_ylc=X3oDMTJnMmlrZTN1B
  11. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/photos;_ylc=X3oDMTJmNmE1b3Mw
  12. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/links;_ylc=X3oDMTJnYzN0bXFyB
  13. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/database;_ylc=X3oDMTJkamo4MG
  14. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/polls;_ylc=X3oDMTJncG02bGZmB
  15. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/members;_ylc=X3oDMTJmMG8waWd
  16. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/calendar;_ylc=X3oDMTJlN2Vncm
  17. http://groups.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTJlcDdsMTJ0BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElk
  18. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/join;_ylc=X3oDMTJnNTU1Yzc3BF
  19. mailto:QuadtoneRIP-digest%40yahoogroups.com
  20. mailto:QuadtoneRIP-traditional%40yahoogroups.com
  21. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP;_ylc=X3oDMTJlc2IwczEwBF9TAzk
  22. http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
  23. mailto:QuadtoneRIP-unsubscribe%40yahoogroups.com
  24. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/members;_ylc=X3oDMTJnM281ZWp
  25. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/files;_ylc=X3oDMTJoZnVoOTdtB
  26. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP;_ylc=X3oDMTJmZ2YzanZpBF9TAzk
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  36. http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12ibtuklh/M=493064.9803235.10510228.867457
  37. http://tv.yahoo.com/american-idol/show/34934
  38. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/message/4335;_ylc=X3oDMTM1bWtuNTR1BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE0ODM0MzQ3BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAxOTE4MgRtc2dJZAM0MzQ0BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA3Z0cGMEc3RpbWUDMTE3NTI2OTY0NAR0cGNJZAM0MzM1
  39. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJxZjR2czQ0BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE0ODM0MzQ3BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAxOTE4MgRtc2dJZAM0MzQ0BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA3JwbHkEc3RpbWUDMTE3NTI2OTY0NA--?act=reply&messageNum=4344
  40. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJmOWg5bDc4BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE0ODM0MzQ3BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAxOTE4MgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNudHBjBHN0aW1lAzExNzUyNjk2NDQ-
  41. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/messages;_ylc=X3oDMTJmNjJtb2pyBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE0ODM0MzQ3BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAxOTE4MgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNtc2dzBHN0aW1lAzExNzUyNjk2NDQ-
  42. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/files;_ylc=X3oDMTJnbzliMHVnBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE0ODM0MzQ3BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAxOTE4MgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNmaWxlcwRzdGltZQMxMTc1MjY5NjQ0
  43. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/photos;_ylc=X3oDMTJmdjRkMjRpBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE0ODM0MzQ3BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAxOTE4MgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNwaG90BHN0aW1lAzExNzUyNjk2NDQ-
  44. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/links;_ylc=X3oDMTJnMmxkNzhwBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE0ODM0MzQ3BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAxOTE4MgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNsaW5rcwRzdGltZQMxMTc1MjY5NjQ0
  45. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/database;_ylc=X3oDMTJkZGczaDVlBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE0ODM0MzQ3BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAxOTE4MgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNkYgRzdGltZQMxMTc1MjY5NjQ0
  46. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/polls;_ylc=X3oDMTJnOW5xMzA4BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE0ODM0MzQ3BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAxOTE4MgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNwb2xscwRzdGltZQMxMTc1MjY5NjQ0
  47. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/members;_ylc=X3oDMTJmOGV2ZmhhBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE0ODM0MzQ3BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAxOTE4MgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNtYnJzBHN0aW1lAzExNzUyNjk2NDQ-
  48. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/calendar;_ylc=X3oDMTJlMm9ibmhpBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE0ODM0MzQ3BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAxOTE4MgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNjYWwEc3RpbWUDMTE3NTI2OTY0NA--
  49. http://groups.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTJlN244MXNhBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE0ODM0MzQ3BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAxOTE4MgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNnZnAEc3RpbWUDMTE3NTI2OTY0NA--
  50. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/join;_ylc=X3oDMTJnbTYzODRsBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE0ODM0MzQ3BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAxOTE4MgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNzdG5ncwRzdGltZQMxMTc1MjY5NjQ0
  51. mailto:QuadtoneRIP-digest@yahoogroups.com?subject=Email%20Delivery:%20Digest
  52. mailto:QuadtoneRIP-traditional@yahoogroups.com?subject=Change%20Delivery%20Format:%20Traditional
  53. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP;_ylc=X3oDMTJlZGw1b2t0BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE0ODM0MzQ3BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAxOTE4MgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNocGYEc3RpbWUDMTE3NTI2OTY0NA--
  54. http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
  55. mailto:QuadtoneRIP-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=
  56. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/members;_ylc=X3oDMTJnNWw3dmowBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE0ODM0MzQ3BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAxOTE4MgRzZWMDdnRsBHNsawN2bWJycwRzdGltZQMxMTc1MjY5NjQ0
  57. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/files;_ylc=X3oDMTJoYmo4bGtmBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE0ODM0MzQ3BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAxOTE4MgRzZWMDdnRsBHNsawN2ZmlsZXMEc3RpbWUDMTE3NTI2OTY0NA--
  58. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP;_ylc=X3oDMTJmNWFtbWltBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE0ODM0MzQ3BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAxOTE4MgRzZWMDdnRsBHNsawN2Z2hwBHN0aW1lAzExNzUyNjk2NDQ-
  59. http://groups.yahoo.com/gads;_ylc=X3oDMTJkc2p0aGs5BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BF9wAzEEZ3JwSWQDMTQ4MzQzNDcEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDE5MTgyBHNlYwNzbG1vZARzdGltZQMxMTc1MjY5NjQ1?t=ms&k=Digital+photography&w1=Digital+photography&w2=Digital+photography+course&w3=Digital+photography+equipment&w4=Digital+wedding+photography&w5=Learn+digital+photography&c=5&s=156&g=2&.sig=QQ-QZK3Y7StUpXTwn_cXXA
  60. http://groups.yahoo.com/gads;_ylc=X3oDMTJkYWozNWkzBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BF9wAzIEZ3JwSWQDMTQ4MzQzNDcEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDE5MTgyBHNlYwNzbG1vZARzdGltZQMxMTc1MjY5NjQ1?t=ms&k=Digital+photography+course&w1=Digital+photography&w2=Digital+photography+course&w3=Digital+photography+equipment&w4=Digital+wedding+photography&w5=Learn+digital+photography&c=5&s=156&g=2&.sig=8XNDCxidfqmljP09C4DATg
  61. http://groups.yahoo.com/gads;_ylc=X3oDMTJkNnNyMml0BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BF9wAzMEZ3JwSWQDMTQ4MzQzNDcEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDE5MTgyBHNlYwNzbG1vZARzdGltZQMxMTc1MjY5NjQ1?t=ms&k=Digital+photography+equipment&w1=Digital+photography&w2=Digital+photography+course&w3=Digital+photography+equipment&w4=Digital+wedding+photography&w5=Learn+digital+photography&c=5&s=156&g=2&.sig=WlwyUzMYuyPJaN-GekP1AQ
  62. http://groups.yahoo.com/gads;_ylc=X3oDMTJkcTBndHIwBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BF9wAzQEZ3JwSWQDMTQ4MzQzNDcEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDE5MTgyBHNlYwNzbG1vZARzdGltZQMxMTc1MjY5NjQ1?t=ms&k=Digital+wedding+photography&w1=Digital+photography&w2=Digital+photography+course&w3=Digital+photography+equipment&w4=Digital+wedding+photography&w5=Learn+digital+photography&c=5&s=156&g=2&.sig=7xhMEtyucKzAam208sSGOQ
  63. http://groups.yahoo.com/gads;_ylc=X3oDMTJkMmtkbnBxBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BF9wAzUEZ3JwSWQDMTQ4MzQzNDcEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDE5MTgyBHNlYwNzbG1vZARzdGltZQMxMTc1MjY5NjQ1?t=ms&k=Learn+digital+photography&w1=Digital+photography&w2=Digital+photography+course&w3=Digital+photography+equipment&w4=Digital+wedding+photography&w5=Learn+digital+photography&c=5&s=156&g=2&.sig=GDMEk0DgB4tp3tcKS945zA
  64. http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12j6lf81t/M=493064.10322721.10977643.9963301/D=groups/S=1705019182:NC/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1175276845/A=4438974/R=0/SIG=111blfb2h/*http://www.bix.com/contest/3766
  65. http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12icutr8v/M=493064.9803190.10510181.8674578/D=groups/S=1705019182:NC/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1175276845/A=3848602/R=0/SIG=12t618tjo/*http://news.yahoo.com/i/718;_ylt=A9FJqZWsu65Ek9IAbBY8sM0F;_ylu=X3oDMTA2NWJlcmlsBHNlYwN0bg--
  66. http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12io3nba6/M=493064.9803235.10510228.8674578/D=groups/S=1705019182:NC/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1175276845/A=3848445/R=0/SIG=10t28jksf/*http://tv.yahoo.com/lineup/


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