Bc2000 (for the BCF2000 & BCR2000)

Hi everyone,

I've uploaded BC Manager 1.2.0 and its manual to the Files section
under Applications -> BC Manager.

New features include:
- "Donate" button allowing you to make a donation.
- Transfer recorded MIDI messages (e.g. BCF/BCR snapshots) to custom
output (".tx") lines.
- For a button sending only custom output messages, you can set the
Mode parameter to "Increment".
- Several bug fixes and other small improvements.

See the accompanying manual for more details on these changes.

Anyone using BC Manager is strongly advised to upgrade to this new
version.
You can install directly on top of the previous version.

Enjoy!
Mark.

I've looked through the manual but I want to confirm that I understand
how this works. For instance, say I record an arbitrary midi message
(under 125 bytes) from a device (not necessarily a BCR/BCF) to the
clipboard in BCManager. Can I then go to a particular Element, edit
the custom output field and "paste" the recorded midi via
Ctrl+Shift+Ins? If so, that's very nice indeed.

--- In bc2000@yahoogroups.com, "Mark van den Berg" <markwinvdb@...> wrote:
... 
> New features include:
...
> - Transfer recorded MIDI messages (e.g. BCF/BCR snapshots) to custom
> output (".tx") lines.
...

--- In bc2000@yahoogroups.com, "poser_p" <poserp@...> wrote:
> I've looked through the manual but I want to confirm that I understand
> how this works. For instance, say I record an arbitrary midi message
> (under 125 bytes) from a device (not necessarily a BCR/BCF) to the
> clipboard in BCManager. Can I then go to a particular Element, edit
> the custom output field and "paste" the recorded midi via
> Ctrl+Shift+Ins?

Yes!

(You'll understand that in this case the rather long time you've had to 
wait for this answer has nothing to do with its complexity! I just don't 
check my email every day - sorry...)

Mark.

Well, then, may a multitude of blessings be upon you and your
household. That's going to save me loads of programming time. 

Now I'm just getting greedy -- it would be tres cool if:

1.) You could assign all of the buttons to a MIDI channel.
2.) You select a button and press "Learn".
3.) You transmit some midi/sysex on that channel.
4.) You press "Learn" again. Now the data is stored for that button.

That's more of a Behringer thing (or whomever is hacking new firmware)
than something that could be done in software, just thinking out loud...

    -Andrew-

--- In bc2000@yahoogroups.com, "Mark van den Berg" <markwinvdb@...> wrote:
>
> --- In bc2000@yahoogroups.com, "poser_p" <poserp@> wrote:
> > I've looked through the manual but I want to confirm that I understand
> > how this works. For instance, say I record an arbitrary midi message
> > (under 125 bytes) from a device (not necessarily a BCR/BCF) to the
> > clipboard in BCManager. Can I then go to a particular Element, edit
> > the custom output field and "paste" the recorded midi via
> > Ctrl+Shift+Ins?
> 
> Yes!
> 
> (You'll understand that in this case the rather long time you've had to 
> wait for this answer has nothing to do with its complexity! I just
don't 

> check my email every day - sorry...)
> 
> Mark.
>

--- In bc2000@yahoogroups.com, "poser_p" <poserp@...> wrote:
> Now I'm just getting greedy -- it would be tres cool if:

> 1.) You could assign all of the buttons to a MIDI channel.

You mean in BC Manager? If I understand your intention correctly,
that's already possible via the "Edit" -> "Set"  -> "Channel" menu
command in the button list window. (See the manual for further
explanation.)

> 2.) You select a button and press "Learn".
> 3.) You transmit some midi/sysex on that channel.
> 4.) You press "Learn" again. Now the data is stored for that button.

I think that on the BCF/BCR themselves this is already possible
(although I haven't tried it myself), as explained in par. 4.3.1 of
the B-Control manual (vs. 1.1, Oct. 2004).

However, if you want to do this from BC Manager... If I understand you
correctly, this is conceptually not too different from the method via
the "MIDI input messages" window I've just implemented, unless you
find that too indirect.

In fact, after first reading about your problem, I racked my brains
for several days about the best way to implement this kind of learn
function. I considered adding "Record" and "Stop" buttons to the
button/encoder/fader dialog's "custom output" tab for direct input,
but finally I chose the more modular approach via the MIDI input
message window: one advantage of that window is that it already has
facilities for filtering out unwanted types of messages and selecting
recorded messages.

Mark.

No, it's not too indirect, just would be nice if I could take the
process one step further. I just now tried to do it Behringer's way
(sent a "snapshot" of the Keystation 88's controllers to the Behringer
and tried to record it via "Learn") and it didn't work -- the screen
flashed "bad" then "good", and sure enough it recorded one line of the
 message (right around the middle of the message, too)... problem is
the message is around 100 lines long. I've been using Midi Ox for
doing the snapshot thing and it works very well, but ultimately I'd
like to freely share my "toys" and I think having full-featured K2000
presets (to go along with the synth models I'm working on) for the
Behringer that include "patches" would be more fun (and less hassle)
for other users. So thanks again for the great utility; it works
perfectly for my needs.

From a wonky programmer point-of-view, if the MIDI recording
funcionality were modular you could "plug it in" anywhere in the
program. As I've thought about this, having "record" functionality
right on the parameter page would work out best for what I do. Of
course, those needs shouldn't dictate what you do with your program. I
will use it and enjoy it either way.

And, why don't other manufacturers get on board with assigning
arbitrary sysex to controls? I really like the Novation controllers
with the LCD screens to remind you about what knob does what (very
useful when dealing with the internals of hardware synths), but the
dang things won't do arbitrary sysex longer than (I think) 8 bytes. As
bad a rap as Behringer gets in the pro audio world for their
mixers/premaps/etc, they're beating the pants off of other controller
makers IMHO.

    -Andrew-

--- In bc2000@yahoogroups.com, "Mark van den Berg" <markwinvdb@...> wrote:
>
> --- In bc2000@yahoogroups.com, "poser_p" <poserp@> wrote:
...

> I think that on the BCF/BCR themselves this is already possible
> (although I haven't tried it myself), as explained in par. 4.3.1 of
> the B-Control manual (vs. 1.1, Oct. 2004).
> 
> However, if you want to do this from BC Manager... If I understand you
> correctly, this is conceptually not too different from the method via
> the "MIDI input messages" window I've just implemented, unless you
> find that too indirect.
> 
> In fact, after first reading about your problem, I racked my brains
> for several days about the best way to implement this kind of learn
> function. I considered adding "Record" and "Stop" buttons to the
> button/encoder/fader dialog's "custom output" tab for direct input,
> but finally I chose the more modular approach via the MIDI input
> message window: one advantage of that window is that it already has
> facilities for filtering out unwanted types of messages and selecting
> recorded messages.
> 
> Mark.
>

--- In bc2000@yahoogroups.com, "poser_p" <poserp@...> wrote:
> I just now tried to do it Behringer's way
> (sent a "snapshot" of the Keystation 88's controllers to the Behringer
> and tried to record it via "Learn") and it didn't work -- the screen
> flashed "bad" then "good", and sure enough it recorded one line of the
>  message (right around the middle of the message, too)... problem is
> the message is around 100 lines long.

Funny: for the update of the MIDI implementation doc I've just
uploaded, I tested the Learn function yesterday as well. Basically
found the same thing as you: only 1 message seems ever accepted.

>>From a wonky programmer point-of-view, if the MIDI recording
> funcionality were modular you could "plug it in" anywhere in the
> program.
> As I've thought about this, having "record" functionality
> right on the parameter page would work out best for what I do.

Well, basically the Record facility in my own library is very modular,
more or less "pluggable" in the way you're describing: whenever a MIDI
message arrives, any window can simply pick up this message by adding
its own event handler. This is how recorded MIDI messages in BC
Manager end up in several different windows "simultaneously", e.g. the
"meters" window, the input message window, the BCL input message window...
So from that point of view, it would be a piece of cake to add a
recording handler to the element dialog box. I just try to be careful
not to overload the program with duplicate or esoteric functionality
that only confuses people. I'll see what I can do.

Mark.

I just had a thought -- what if somehow the MIDI received by the
Behringer could be put onto one line before sending? I suspect that
would work; I don't know if Midi Ox can do that but I could try
setting up a single line of data, saving it as a sysex message, and
then sending it after pressing "Learn". I'll try that tomorrow and see
if it works.

    -Andrew-

--- In bc2000@yahoogroups.com, "Mark van den Berg" <markwinvdb@...> wrote:
...
> Funny: for the update of the MIDI implementation doc I've just
> uploaded, I tested the Learn function yesterday as well. Basically
> found the same thing as you: only 1 message seems ever accepted.
> 
> >>From a wonky programmer point-of-view, if the MIDI recording
> > funcionality were modular you could "plug it in" anywhere in the
> > program.
> > As I've thought about this, having "record" functionality
> > right on the parameter page would work out best for what I do.
> 
....
> Mark.
>