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CGS VCO questions

CGS VCO questions

2004-10-10 by ask

hello folks - recently made a CGS VCO w/ everything
except the suboscilator outputs. It's really a great VCO,
the CV proccessors are extreamly handy, stayed in tune
over night to the note of C, so thats pretty good. I used
a MAT-02/tempco/heatsink/tie for expo converter.

now - i'm writing to ask if anyone used the suboscilator
parts of the VCO? My panel i put this behind did not allow
the space for the extra jacks and pots to add it. I do have
a second PCB though. how does it work for you? did you
add any additional circuitry or switches for the output modes?
am i correct you want to connect the SAW out into the staircare
input? how does it SOUND?

just curious how people feel about it!

dave wright

Re: CGS VCO questions

2004-10-12 by bbluthang

hi Dave
i've made two CGS VCOs.
the first was built with all the fruit. from memory(?) i ran a wire
from the switch of the SQ out jack to the 'staircase in' jacks's
switch - saved me using one patch-cord.

the 2nd was built into an already crowded panel, so had space
limitations. i dispensed with the SQ, STI, subosc SYNC in, CVS, STO
jacks and associated components.
so the VCO's SQ out had a jumper to the STI on the pcb, i can control
the pulse output with the CVSP knob.
it works fine, basically its an enhanced SQ/pulse out at the cost of
one extra knob (or jack if you just used the CVS input instead).

i guess it sounds confusing, but take a look at the schematic and
cross off everything i mentioned, leaving just the pulse out and CVSP
pot and it should be clear.

this 2nd VCO also has a modded linear input section, copied from E/N
preferred circuits VCO2. makes it a little touchy but suitable for my
purposes.

imho, don't leave off the TSO/ATSO outputs and the shape CV input.
for me, this is where the character of this VCO can be found.

how does it sound? awesome! (bet that helps a lot!).
the best comment would be that my CGS VCOs are always the first ones
i choose to use in a patch. i'm building two more at the moment.

cheers
andrew
Show quoted textHide quoted text
--- In cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com, "ask" <bastardita@h...> wrote:
>
> hello folks - recently made a CGS VCO w/ everything
> except the suboscilator outputs. It's really a great VCO,
> the CV proccessors are extreamly handy, stayed in tune
> over night to the note of C, so thats pretty good. I used
> a MAT-02/tempco/heatsink/tie for expo converter.
>
> now - i'm writing to ask if anyone used the suboscilator
> parts of the VCO? My panel i put this behind did not allow
> the space for the extra jacks and pots to add it. I do have
> a second PCB though. how does it work for you? did you
> add any additional circuitry or switches for the output modes?
> am i correct you want to connect the SAW out into the staircare
> input? how does it SOUND?
>
> just curious how people feel about it!
>
> dave wright

Re: CGS VCO questions

2004-10-12 by david wright

hey andrew
thanks for the kind words. i have my vco w/ EVERYTHING except the suboscilator.
i really enjoy the waveshape cv. i'm debating taking out one of the cv processor pots
and adding the suboscilator. but might not. i am allmost finished with my second
VCO - and i will let you know how it goes - it will be a 'every option available' version.
i'm very happy with my CGS vco. i hope everyone else on the list gets em goin soon enough!

creamy!

dave wright
ps- what did you use for your exponential converters?

----- Original Message -----
Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: bbluthang
To: cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2004 1:26 AM
Subject: [cgs_synth] Re: CGS VCO questions



hi Dave
i've made two CGS VCOs.
the first was built with all the fruit. from memory(?) i ran a wire
from the switch of the SQ out jack to the 'staircase in' jacks's
switch - saved me using one patch-cord.

the 2nd was built into an already crowded panel, so had space
limitations. i dispensed with the SQ, STI, subosc SYNC in, CVS, STO
jacks and associated components.
so the VCO's SQ out had a jumper to the STI on the pcb, i can control
the pulse output with the CVSP knob.
it works fine, basically its an enhanced SQ/pulse out at the cost of
one extra knob (or jack if you just used the CVS input instead).

i guess it sounds confusing, but take a look at the schematic and
cross off everything i mentioned, leaving just the pulse out and CVSP
pot and it should be clear.

this 2nd VCO also has a modded linear input section, copied from E/N
preferred circuits VCO2. makes it a little touchy but suitable for my
purposes.

imho, don't leave off the TSO/ATSO outputs and the shape CV input.
for me, this is where the character of this VCO can be found.

how does it sound? awesome! (bet that helps a lot!).
the best comment would be that my CGS VCOs are always the first ones
i choose to use in a patch. i'm building two more at the moment.

cheers
andrew


--- In cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com, "ask" <bastardita@h...> wrote:
>
> hello folks - recently made a CGS VCO w/ everything
> except the suboscilator outputs. It's really a great VCO,
> the CV proccessors are extreamly handy, stayed in tune
> over night to the note of C, so thats pretty good. I used
> a MAT-02/tempco/heatsink/tie for expo converter.
>
> now - i'm writing to ask if anyone used the suboscilator
> parts of the VCO? My panel i put this behind did not allow
> the space for the extra jacks and pots to add it. I do have
> a second PCB though. how does it work for you? did you
> add any additional circuitry or switches for the output modes?
> am i correct you want to connect the SAW out into the staircare
> input? how does it SOUND?
>
> just curious how people feel about it!
>
> dave wright





See the following URLS for the CGS Modular Synth home page:
Main: http://www.cgs.synth.net/
Secondary: http://otherunicorn.0catch.com/synth/


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: CGS VCO questions

2004-10-13 by bbluthang

hi Dave

> ps- what did you use for your exponential converters?

the first one has a LM394.
the 2nd got a 2SC1583 (the shop selling 394's went belly-up, 1583's
are starting to dry up too)
it works fine, but i'd like to find some more LM394 or MAT-02 for the
next two.
The tempcos were tiny little things, size of 1/8W resistors, got them
from a friend.

btw - i regularly check out your homepage. love your work.
cheers
andrew


>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: bbluthang
> To: cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2004 1:26 AM
> Subject: [cgs_synth] Re: CGS VCO questions
>
>
>
> hi Dave
> i've made two CGS VCOs.
> the first was built with all the fruit. from memory(?) i ran a
wire
> from the switch of the SQ out jack to the 'staircase in' jacks's
> switch - saved me using one patch-cord.
>
> the 2nd was built into an already crowded panel, so had space
> limitations. i dispensed with the SQ, STI, subosc SYNC in, CVS,
STO
> jacks and associated components.
> so the VCO's SQ out had a jumper to the STI on the pcb, i can
control
> the pulse output with the CVSP knob.
> it works fine, basically its an enhanced SQ/pulse out at the cost
of
> one extra knob (or jack if you just used the CVS input instead).
>
> i guess it sounds confusing, but take a look at the schematic and
> cross off everything i mentioned, leaving just the pulse out and
CVSP
> pot and it should be clear.
>
> this 2nd VCO also has a modded linear input section, copied from
E/N
> preferred circuits VCO2. makes it a little touchy but suitable
for my
> purposes.
>
> imho, don't leave off the TSO/ATSO outputs and the shape CV
input.
> for me, this is where the character of this VCO can be found.
>
> how does it sound? awesome! (bet that helps a lot!).
> the best comment would be that my CGS VCOs are always the first
ones
> i choose to use in a patch. i'm building two more at the moment.
>
> cheers
> andrew
>
>
> --- In cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com, "ask" <bastardita@h...> wrote:
> >
> > hello folks - recently made a CGS VCO w/ everything
> > except the suboscilator outputs. It's really a great VCO,
> > the CV proccessors are extreamly handy, stayed in tune
> > over night to the note of C, so thats pretty good. I used
> > a MAT-02/tempco/heatsink/tie for expo converter.
> >
> > now - i'm writing to ask if anyone used the suboscilator
> > parts of the VCO? My panel i put this behind did not allow
> > the space for the extra jacks and pots to add it. I do have
> > a second PCB though. how does it work for you? did you
> > add any additional circuitry or switches for the output modes?
> > am i correct you want to connect the SAW out into the staircare
> > input? how does it SOUND?
> >
> > just curious how people feel about it!
> >
> > dave wright
>
>
>
>
>
> See the following URLS for the CGS Modular Synth home page:
> Main: http://www.cgs.synth.net/
> Secondary: http://otherunicorn.0catch.com/synth/
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> ADVERTISEMENT
>
>
>
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
----------
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cgs_synth/
>
> b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> cgs_synth-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service.
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: CGS VCO questions

2004-10-13 by david wright

hey there -

analog devices sells the MAT-02 - its just alil expensive and you have
to have it shiped from the orient. but they work very well. i have about
40 1583s just waiting for the next apocolypse ;) - i used big tempcos
from that florida company. i forget their name. got a stock pile ready as well ;)

thanks for the kind words

dave wright

----- Original Message -----
Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: bbluthang
To: cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2004 6:12 PM
Subject: [cgs_synth] Re: CGS VCO questions



hi Dave

> ps- what did you use for your exponential converters?

the first one has a LM394.
the 2nd got a 2SC1583 (the shop selling 394's went belly-up, 1583's
are starting to dry up too)
it works fine, but i'd like to find some more LM394 or MAT-02 for the
next two.
The tempcos were tiny little things, size of 1/8W resistors, got them
from a friend.

btw - i regularly check out your homepage. love your work.
cheers
andrew


>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: bbluthang
> To: cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2004 1:26 AM
> Subject: [cgs_synth] Re: CGS VCO questions
>
>
>
> hi Dave
> i've made two CGS VCOs.
> the first was built with all the fruit. from memory(?) i ran a
wire
> from the switch of the SQ out jack to the 'staircase in' jacks's
> switch - saved me using one patch-cord.
>
> the 2nd was built into an already crowded panel, so had space
> limitations. i dispensed with the SQ, STI, subosc SYNC in, CVS,
STO
> jacks and associated components.
> so the VCO's SQ out had a jumper to the STI on the pcb, i can
control
> the pulse output with the CVSP knob.
> it works fine, basically its an enhanced SQ/pulse out at the cost
of
> one extra knob (or jack if you just used the CVS input instead).
>
> i guess it sounds confusing, but take a look at the schematic and
> cross off everything i mentioned, leaving just the pulse out and
CVSP
> pot and it should be clear.
>
> this 2nd VCO also has a modded linear input section, copied from
E/N
> preferred circuits VCO2. makes it a little touchy but suitable
for my
> purposes.
>
> imho, don't leave off the TSO/ATSO outputs and the shape CV
input.
> for me, this is where the character of this VCO can be found.
>
> how does it sound? awesome! (bet that helps a lot!).
> the best comment would be that my CGS VCOs are always the first
ones
> i choose to use in a patch. i'm building two more at the moment.
>
> cheers
> andrew
>
>
> --- In cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com, "ask" <bastardita@h...> wrote:
> >
> > hello folks - recently made a CGS VCO w/ everything
> > except the suboscilator outputs. It's really a great VCO,
> > the CV proccessors are extreamly handy, stayed in tune
> > over night to the note of C, so thats pretty good. I used
> > a MAT-02/tempco/heatsink/tie for expo converter.
> >
> > now - i'm writing to ask if anyone used the suboscilator
> > parts of the VCO? My panel i put this behind did not allow
> > the space for the extra jacks and pots to add it. I do have
> > a second PCB though. how does it work for you? did you
> > add any additional circuitry or switches for the output modes?
> > am i correct you want to connect the SAW out into the staircare
> > input? how does it SOUND?
> >
> > just curious how people feel about it!
> >
> > dave wright
>
>
>
>
>
> See the following URLS for the CGS Modular Synth home page:
> Main: http://www.cgs.synth.net/
> Secondary: http://otherunicorn.0catch.com/synth/
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> ADVERTISEMENT
>
>
>
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
----------
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cgs_synth/
>
> b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> cgs_synth-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service.
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





See the following URLS for the CGS Modular Synth home page:
Main: http://www.cgs.synth.net/
Secondary: http://otherunicorn.0catch.com/synth/


Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT





------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cgs_synth/

b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
cgs_synth-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: CGS VCO questions

2004-10-13 by Jay

on 10/12/04 9:12 PM, bbluthang at jumpswine@... wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> the first one has a LM394.
> the 2nd got a 2SC1583 (the shop selling 394's went belly-up, 1583's
> are starting to dry up too)
> it works fine, but i'd like to find some more LM394 or MAT-02 for the
> next two.
> The tempcos were tiny little things, size of 1/8W resistors, got them
> from a friend.

So, anyone got a reliable source for any of the above transistor pairs?

Re: CGS VCO questions

2004-10-13 by Jay

on 10/12/04 9:24 PM, david wright at bastardita@... wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> i used big tempcos
> from that florida company. i forget their name. got a stock pile ready as well
> ;)

Have the part # handy? I live 20 minutes away from them...

Re: CGS VCO questions

2004-10-13 by groovyshaman@snet.net

Well it appears LM394's can be had all over.
digikey.com
arrow.com
future-active.com

And MAT-02 you can find at arrow.com.

Don't know about the 2SC1583.

George

----- Original Message -----
Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: "Jay" <jay@...>
To: <cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2004 9:26 PM
Subject: Re: [cgs_synth] Re: CGS VCO questions


>
> on 10/12/04 9:12 PM, bbluthang at jumpswine@... wrote:
>
> > the first one has a LM394.
> > the 2nd got a 2SC1583 (the shop selling 394's went belly-up, 1583's
> > are starting to dry up too)
> > it works fine, but i'd like to find some more LM394 or MAT-02 for the
> > next two.
> > The tempcos were tiny little things, size of 1/8W resistors, got them
> > from a friend.
>
> So, anyone got a reliable source for any of the above transistor pairs?

Re: CGS VCO questions

2004-10-13 by Richard Brewster

I built two CGS VCOs this year, and purchased kits with the special
parts for the ASM-1 VCO here.

http://www.elby-designs.com/shopping/enter.html

The `special components’ kit for the ASM-2 contains the following
harder-to-get components:-
1. 2 off MAT-02
2. 3 off J108 transistors
3. 2 off 1K, 3500ppm TEMPCO plus 2 off 62R 50ppm (giving a 3300ppm result)
4. 3 off LM329-6V9

This kit is sold for $65.00. I bought two of a different kit that
contained 1 LM394, 1 J108, and 1 TEMPCO resistor set, for about $50. You
could ask about this or just take the 2 LM329 even though you don't need
them.

If you use this 1K 3500ppm TEMPCO resistor, you will NOT want to add the
62 ohm resistor in series. I found that with a 56K 1% resistor, as in
Ken's schematic, and the 100K 1% resistor in series with the SPAN
trimmer, it was not possible to tune to 1V/octave (span trimmer all the
way down to zero was not enough). I had to remove the 62R resistor,
which was a pain to install in the first place - it required cutting a
trace. The 62R is supposed to change the tempco to 3300ppm, but I
haven't noticed a problem. Temperature stability isn't that big of a
concern for me.

I built the VCO circuit a little differently, changing the design a bit.
I left it very minimal, omitting the CV1 and CV2 Serge-like FM inputs,
adding a fine tune panel pot, and using a 1.5M instead of 150K to set
the initial linear current for a lower initial frequency - this is
described in the ASM-1 VCO literature. I used an LT1013 for IC1. The
only outputs are a DC-coupled saw and square wave. I have both of these
going +/-5V. The square wave comparator runs off the DC coupled saw, so
it has no low frequency limit. My objective was to get a pair of stable
VCOs with exponential and linear FM, sync, and PWM. (Email me if you
would like the schematic.) I did not include the waveshapers mostly
because of panel space, but also because I have a lot of wave shaping
capability in my synth (two Blacet Miniwaves, a CGS Wave Multiplier,
MOTM-510 Wave Warper, MOTM-120 Suboctave, etc). It would be fun to play
with those waveshapers! But it didn't fit into my "master plan" for the
synth. The CGS VCOs stand proudly next to a pair of MOTM-310s and I use
them interchangeably. The MOTM-310 may be more stable, but I haven't
noticed. CGS rocks!

One last point of comparison with the MOTM-310: I had hoped to get off
cheap, but with the Schaeffer panel, three $7 pots, $25 special parts, a
Stooge bracket, some RN55E resistors, etc, the costs added up to the
$150 ballpark for one CGS VCO. You can get a MOTM-310 kit for only $209.
It is a great VCO, but it doesn't have linear FM or sync. I am glad I
have both the MOTM and the CGS VCOs. The other two in my rig are MOTM-300s.

-Richard Brewster

Jay wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>on 10/12/04 9:12 PM, bbluthang at jumpswine@... wrote:
>
>
>
>>the first one has a LM394.
>>the 2nd got a 2SC1583 (the shop selling 394's went belly-up, 1583's
>>are starting to dry up too)
>>it works fine, but i'd like to find some more LM394 or MAT-02 for the
>>next two.
>>The tempcos were tiny little things, size of 1/8W resistors, got them
>>from a friend.
>>
>>
>
>So, anyone got a reliable source for any of the above transistor pairs?
>
>
>
>

Re: CGS VCO questions

2004-10-13 by sasami@hotkey.net.au

>If you use this 1K 3500ppm TEMPCO resistor, you will NOT want to add the
>62 ohm resistor in series. I found that with a 56K 1% resistor, as in
>Ken's schematic, and the 100K 1% resistor in series with the SPAN
>trimmer, it was not possible to tune to 1V/octave (span trimmer all the
>way down to zero was not enough). I had to remove the 62R resistor,
>which was a pain to install in the first place - it required cutting a
>trace. The 62R is supposed to change the tempco to 3300ppm, but I
>haven't noticed a problem.

An interesting note about 3500 tempcos is on one manufacturer's website -
they claim that the tempco is subject to tollerance issues and usually comes
out a little on the low site - at 3300. In other words, they are spot on in
most cases (from this manufacturer) just as they are.

Ken
_______________________________________________________________________
Ken Stone sasami@... or sasami@...
Modular Synth PCBs for sale <http://www.blaze.net.au/~sasami/synth/>
Australian Miniature Horses & Ponies <http://www.blaze.net.au/~sasami/>

Re: CGS VCO questions

2004-10-13 by Scott Stites

Jay -
For the 2SC1583, Electronix Plus (the place with the cheap switches, if you
recall) has them for $0.79 apiece.

http://www.electronix.com/catalog/advanced_search_result.php?keywords=2SC158
3

I'm pretty sure that MCM In One has them, and a place called Suburban
Electronics (IIRC).

American Microsemi for the *longest* time had them for $0.28 apiece. I
remember picking up 100 of them for a friend in Germany (where they are
practically non-existent). At the same time, they had something like the
2N3906 for like four bucks apiece. As I mentioned on the SDIY list, their
prices can be hilariously out of balance. Anyhoo, they apparently don't
have them in stock anymore, but they list them as available and RFQ, so it
might be worth a shot. Maybe they haven't wised up to how much they're
really worth.

http://www.americanmicrosemi.com

Cheers,
Scott


----- Original Message -----
Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: "Jay" <jay@...>
To: <cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2004 6:26 PM
Subject: Re: [cgs_synth] Re: CGS VCO questions


>
> on 10/12/04 9:12 PM, bbluthang at jumpswine@... wrote:
>
> > the first one has a LM394.
> > the 2nd got a 2SC1583 (the shop selling 394's went belly-up, 1583's
> > are starting to dry up too)
> > it works fine, but i'd like to find some more LM394 or MAT-02 for the
> > next two.
> > The tempcos were tiny little things, size of 1/8W resistors, got them
> > from a friend.
>
> So, anyone got a reliable source for any of the above transistor pairs?
>
>
>
>
> See the following URLS for the CGS Modular Synth home page:
> Main: http://www.cgs.synth.net/
> Secondary: http://otherunicorn.0catch.com/synth/
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Re: CGS VCO questions

2004-10-13 by Ryan Williams

yea, I bought 100 of the last 120 2sc1583 from american microsemi.
mouser lists a NTE part as substitute. it's like $2 though and I wonder
if it's really a suitable replacement for our purposes.

ryan

Scott Stites wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> American Microsemi for the *longest* time had them for $0.28 apiece. I
> remember picking up 100 of them for a friend in Germany (where they are
> practically non-existent). At the same time, they had something like the
> 2N3906 for like four bucks apiece. As I mentioned on the SDIY list, their
> prices can be hilariously out of balance. Anyhoo, they apparently don't
> have them in stock anymore, but they list them as available and RFQ, so it
> might be worth a shot. Maybe they haven't wised up to how much they're
> really worth.
>
> http://www.americanmicrosemi.com
>
> Cheers,
> Scott

Re: CGS VCO questions

2004-10-13 by Jay

on 10/12/04 10:34 PM, Richard Brewster at pugix@... wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> Temperature stability isn't that big of a concern for me.

Can the tempco be left out entirely then?

Re: CGS VCO questions

2004-10-13 by Ryan Williams

Jay wrote:
> on 10/12/04 10:34 PM, Richard Brewster at pugix@... wrote:
>
> > Temperature stability isn't that big of a concern for me.
>
> Can the tempco be left out entirely then?


if you don't care about temp stability, put in a normal resistor instead.

-ryan

Re: CGS VCO questions

2004-10-14 by david wright

hey jay
heres a link to the company i got my tempcos from
hope it helps out

http://www.precisionresistor.com/total.pdf
----- Original Message -----
Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: Jay
To: cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2004 6:39 PM
Subject: Re: [cgs_synth] Re: CGS VCO questions


on 10/12/04 9:24 PM, david wright at bastardita@... wrote:

> i used big tempcos
> from that florida company. i forget their name. got a stock pile ready as well
> ;)

Have the part # handy? I live 20 minutes away from them...



See the following URLS for the CGS Modular Synth home page:
Main: http://www.cgs.synth.net/
Secondary: http://otherunicorn.0catch.com/synth/


Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT





------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: CGS VCO questions

2004-10-14 by sasami@hotkey.net.au

That's the beast.

Ken

>
>on 10/14/04 12:06 PM, david wright at bastardita@... wrote:
>
>>
>> hey jay
>> heres a link to the company i got my tempcos from
>> hope it helps out
>>
>> http://www.precisionresistor.com/total.pdf
>
>Im assuming part #PT146?
>
>
>
>
>See the following URLS for the CGS Modular Synth home page:
>Main: http://www.cgs.synth.net/
>Secondary: http://otherunicorn.0catch.com/synth/
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
_______________________________________________________________________
Ken Stone sasami@... or sasami@...
Modular Synth PCBs for sale <http://www.blaze.net.au/~sasami/synth/>
Australian Miniature Horses & Ponies <http://www.blaze.net.au/~sasami/>

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