Disklavier

I have an old model PGG10R. Is it possible to attached a cd player so 
that I won't make use of the obsolete floppy disk (DD). If not can I 
use a Floppy Disk HD instead of DD. Another option is how do I connect 
a notebook and play the music from the playlist I will create.
Please help because my Floppy drive is making too much hizzing sound 
and usually hangs often. Final question, is the floppy drive the same 
as the normal Pc floppy drive on my desktop PC? Where can I find 
guidelines on how to replace floppy drive of PGG10R. I guess it can be 
done by anybody with a computer hardware knowlegable if guided 
properly by Yamaha Technician. Thank you very much for any help you 
can give me, surely will appreciate it. More power to this group!!!!!

allanz

Allanz,

I also have an old Disklavier with DD floppies, and I learned that the
floppy drives are somewhat proprietary, so that a replacement would
set me back about $275, and that's just for another DD floppy drive. 
The upgrade to HD floppy disks has been discontinued, and is difficult
to find (and, the HD drive too will eventually go bad).  Its retail
price was around $2000 but I think they go on eBay for a couple
hundred bucks - if you can find one.  So...... I decided to go the
route of simply hooking my computer (laptop) up to the Disklavier with
MIDI cables, and it works great for playing and recording the piano. 
See some of the earlier posts in this group for recommendations on
various software programs and MIDI interface to use.  

Bill

--- In disklavier@yahoogroups.com, "allanz_2000" <aaz29@...> wrote:

>
> 
> I have an old model PGG10R. Is it possible to attached a cd player so 
> that I won't make use of the obsolete floppy disk (DD). If not can I 
> use a Floppy Disk HD instead of DD. Another option is how do I connect 
> a notebook and play the music from the playlist I will create.
> Please help because my Floppy drive is making too much hizzing sound 
> and usually hangs often. Final question, is the floppy drive the same 
> as the normal Pc floppy drive on my desktop PC? Where can I find 
> guidelines on how to replace floppy drive of PGG10R. I guess it can be 
> done by anybody with a computer hardware knowlegable if guided 
> properly by Yamaha Technician. Thank you very much for any help you 
> can give me, surely will appreciate it. More power to this group!!!!!
> 
> allanz
>

Good morning, everyone.

Jae Choe received a grant from Cisco Systems to create a 3-minute  
documentary on a subject having to do with technology and the  
Internet. He chose to focus on the Disklavier and its Internet  
capabilities for long distance teaching and performing.

This piece features Dr. Lisa Yui, Yamaha Artist and professor at the  
Manhattan School of Music. In the video she briefly interacts with Dr.  
Mario Ajero, professor at the Stephen F. Austin University in  
Nachadoces, TX and myself. More interestingly, she works with a  
sixteen year old student of mine on a Nocturne by John Field.

You can see the video here:

http://www.digitalcribs.net/DisplayVideo.aspx?id=971429324

Regards,
PianoBench


www.georgelitterst.com
www.timewarptech.com

For the floppy drive itself, I am not sure, but your best bet would be
to call Yamaha to get the part #, and then do an eBay search.  I have
a feeling it will be hard to find.  I took apart my broken floppy
drive from my Disklavier and did Google searches for all the part
numbers but I came up with nothing.  Might need to bite the bullet and
buy from Yamaha, or better yet switch to using MIDIs to/from your
computer instead of the floppy drive.

You can also look for the discontinued Yamaha DSR1 which is an
external unit that converts your older unit to work with HD disks. 
But it's probably not worth it because its floppy drive will also die
eventually...

Bill



--- In disklavier@yahoogroups.com, Allan Zalamea <aaz29@...> wrote:
>
> 
> THANKS BILL
> By  the way do you know what model or some kind of description of
floppy drive shall I look for on ebay (DD or HD)
> 
> 
> 
> To: disklavier@...: bill@...: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 21:17:19
+0000Subject: [disklavier] Re: PGG10R
> 
> 
> 
> Allanz,I also have an old Disklavier with DD floppies, and I learned
that thefloppy drives are somewhat proprietary, so that a replacement
wouldset me back about $275, and that's just for another DD floppy
drive. The upgrade to HD floppy disks has been discontinued, and is
difficultto find (and, the HD drive too will eventually go bad). Its
retailprice was around $2000 but I think they go on eBay for a
couplehundred bucks - if you can find one. So...... I decided to go
theroute of simply hooking my computer (laptop) up to the Disklavier
withMIDI cables, and it works great for playing and recording the
piano. See some of the earlier posts in this group for recommendations
onvarious software programs and MIDI interface to use. Bill--- In
disklavier@yahoogroups.com, "allanz_2000" <aaz29@> wrote:>> > I have
an old model PGG10R. Is it possible to attached a cd player so > that
I won't make use of the obsolete floppy disk (DD). If not can I > use
a Floppy Disk HD instead of DD. Another option is how do I connect > a
notebook and play the music from the playlist I will create.> Please
help because my Floppy drive is making too much hizzing sound > and
usually hangs often. Final question, is the floppy drive the same > as
the normal Pc floppy drive on my desktop PC? Where can I find >
guidelines on how to replace floppy drive of PGG10R. I guess it can be
> done by anybody with a computer hardware knowlegable if guided >
properly by Yamaha Technician. Thank you very much for any help you >
can give me, surely will appreciate it. More power to this group!!!!!>

> allanz> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _________________________________________________________________
> Join the Fantasy Football club and win cash prizes here!
> http://fantasyfootball.sg.msn.com
>

Carol or anybody,

Is there a difference is using the MIDI ports versus the Serial port on 
a Mark II XG? I have been considering trying to use a PC or such to 
allow the CD with all of its functions. It would appear to me that the 
MIDI ports would just allow the MIDI information where the serial port 
would allow other information. Or would the serial port be to slow to 
access the audio/vocal information.
 
Mark in Idaho

BTW, There is an MX100A in white for sale locally. The seller is very 
eager to get it sold. The price is now down to $3650 at a consignment 
piano shop. You will find it on craigslist for Boise, Idaho or at 
http://www.pianosnthings.com/

Carol Beigel wrote:

>
> Wow!  That is some great information!!  Two other thoughts occurred to 
> me when I looked through those amazing documents.
>  
> 1)  If you can afford a Disklavier, you can afford to have it fixed.  
> Like buying a used car, you should always have in the back of your 
> head that you will need to do a major repair.  Once you factor in this 
> most probable reality, do you still save money?  I know how to change 
> the oil in my car, but I would actually lose a lot of money, skin, 
> risk the possibility of getting hurt, etc. than just paying $30 or so 
> at Jiffy Lube and have the situation taken of care of in minutes 
> instead of hours.  The cost of having a proper floppy drive replaced 
> by a Yamaha Disklavier tech is probably in the neighborhood of $350.
>  
> 2)  Since floppy drive technology is on its way out, and Disklaviers 
> last a long, long time, those of us with units older than the Mark 
> IV should all be looking at playlist software to be run from a 
> computer attached to our Disklaviers.  I myself have been 
> experimenting along these lines using both PC and MacBook laptops with 
> USB MIDI interfaces.  There are even gadgets out there now that use 
> Bluetooth and other wireless interfaces that will send your MIDI files 
> wirelessly to your Disklavier from a computer, but I have not done any 
> real time research on them.  I suspect someday in the future it will 
> be possible to control your DKV from your cell phone!!
>  
> I realize that not every DKV owner has access to genuine Yamaha parts 
> and a tech, and that this kind of information might be helpful under 
> those circumstances.  But for those of us who do, I highly recommend 
> the genuine Yamaha repair!
>  
> Carol Beigel
>

Good morning, everyone.

On Dec 27, 2008, at 12:12 AM, Mark wrote:

> Carol or anybody,
>
> Is there a difference is using the MIDI ports versus the Serial port  
> on
> a Mark II XG? I have been considering trying to use a PC or such to
> allow the CD with all of its functions. It would appear to me that the
> MIDI ports would just allow the MIDI information where the serial port
> would allow other information. Or would the serial port be to slow to
> access the audio/vocal information.
>

In my experience, MIDI seems to function the same using the serial  
port as it does using the MIDI ports. In fact, the Yamaha website  
states, "there is no differencebetween the quality of the MIDI signal  
via the TO HOST port and the MIDI IN/OUT ports."

The big difference is that using the MIDI ports requires a MIDI  
interface and using the serial port requires a computer that has a  
serial port as well as the appropriate driver to make the serial port  
work.

Getting the serial port to work on a modern Mac which natively does  
not have serial ports is next to impossible (with one exception that  
I'll mention in a moment). Pre-OS X Macintoshes do have serial ports,  
but configuring and using OMS or FreeMIDI as the necessary MIDI driver  
is a pain. However, unlike modern OS X Macs, you can actually get  
iTunes to output MIDI data to the serial port under OS 9 using OMS or  
FreeMIDI. This means that you can use iTunes as your librarian  
program. The reason is that QuickTime in OS 9 enables you to select  
OMS or FreeMIDI as the output for QuickTime MIDI data.

Using the serial port with a Windows computer requires a computer that  
has a serial port, of course. And, you need to install the Yamaha CBX  
serial driver which you can get here:

http://www.global.yamaha.com/download/cbx_midi/index.html

Apparently this CBX driver supports Windows 95 through XP.

You can use the serial port with any modern Macintosh or Windows  
computer if you use a Yamaha MIDI interface that also has a serial  
port, such as the UX-96. Sometimes I do this so that I can have two  
different computers plugged into my Disklavier, one using he serial  
port and one using the MIDI ports. All I have to do is to move the To  
Host switch on the back of the control unit to the correct position in  
order to switch the active input.

NOTE: Using the serial port does not provide any additional  
communication between the computer and the control unit other than  
MIDI data. The Disklavier Pro 2000 (of which there were fewer than 10  
manufactured) did have a special version of the firmware for the  
control unit that enabled additional communication using the serial  
port and a special software program running in Windows 98. However,  
that is not available for other models.

Regards,
PianoBench

I'm pretty new to this Disklavier thing and have benefited from all the great advice from this group. I don't know if this is any help for this subject: I used a MIDI to USB cable to connect my DL to a Windows XP professional laptop.Using Van Basco's free software, all I had to do was to connect the cables and play the song in Van Basco. 
 
One important note was that the MIDI IN of the cable had to be inserted in the MIDI OUT of the Piano and so on. The cable was $10 on Ebay and all the software was loaded onto it. A lot easier than the TO HOST cable and any other serial port connections if you asked me. Here is a link 
 http://cgi.ebay.com/3M-Keyboard-to-PC-USB-MIDI-Interface-Adapter-Cable-K97_W0QQitemZ280268785894QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item280268785894&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1234%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1308%7C301%3A1%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50

--- On Sat, 12/27/08, George F. Litterst <PianoBench@...m> wrote:

From: George F. Litterst <PianoBench@...>
Subject: Re: [disklavier] MIDI or Serial port to computer
To: disklavier@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, December 27, 2008, 10:03 AM






Good morning, everyone.

On Dec 27, 2008, at 12:12 AM, Mark wrote:

> Carol or anybody,
>
> Is there a difference is using the MIDI ports versus the Serial port 
> on
> a Mark II XG? I have been considering trying to use a PC or such to
> allow the CD with all of its functions. It would appear to me that the
> MIDI ports would just allow the MIDI information where the serial port
> would allow other information. Or would the serial port be to slow to
> access the audio/vocal information.
>

In my experience, MIDI seems to function the same using the serial 
port as it does using the MIDI ports. In fact, the Yamaha website 
states, "there is no differencebetween the quality of the MIDI signal 
via the TO HOST port and the MIDI IN/OUT ports."

The big difference is that using the MIDI ports requires a MIDI 
interface and using the serial port requires a computer that has a 
serial port as well as the appropriate driver to make the serial port 
work.

Getting the serial port to work on a modern Mac which natively does 
not have serial ports is next to impossible (with one exception that 
I'll mention in a moment). Pre-OS X Macintoshes do have serial ports, 
but configuring and using OMS or FreeMIDI as the necessary MIDI driver 
is a pain. However, unlike modern OS X Macs, you can actually get 
iTunes to output MIDI data to the serial port under OS 9 using OMS or 
FreeMIDI. This means that you can use iTunes as your librarian 
program. The reason is that QuickTime in OS 9 enables you to select 
OMS or FreeMIDI as the output for QuickTime MIDI data.

Using the serial port with a Windows computer requires a computer that 
has a serial port, of course. And, you need to install the Yamaha CBX 
serial driver which you can get here:

http://www.global. yamaha.com/ download/ cbx_midi/ index.html

Apparently this CBX driver supports Windows 95 through XP.

You can use the serial port with any modern Macintosh or Windows 
computer if you use a Yamaha MIDI interface that also has a serial 
port, such as the UX-96. Sometimes I do this so that I can have two 
different computers plugged into my Disklavier, one using he serial 
port and one using the MIDI ports. All I have to do is to move the To 
Host switch on the back of the control unit to the correct position in 
order to switch the active input.

NOTE: Using the serial port does not provide any additional 
communication between the computer and the control unit other than 
MIDI data. The Disklavier Pro 2000 (of which there were fewer than 10 
manufactured) did have a special version of the firmware for the 
control unit that enabled additional communication using the serial 
port and a special software program running in Windows 98. However, 
that is not available for other models.

Regards,
PianoBench

Good afternoon, everyone.

On Dec 27, 2008, at 1:30 PM, Dokhanchi wrote:

> ...I used a MIDI to USB cable to connect my DL to a Windows XP  
> professional laptop....One important note was that the MIDI IN of  
> the cable had to be inserted in the MIDI OUT of the Piano and so on.

In the old days, a MIDI interface had connecting ports into which you  
had to insert MIDI cables. Those ports were labelled MIDI IN and MIDI  
OUT. When connecting to another device with identically named MIDI  
ports, the rule was that you connected IN to OUT and OUT to IN. That  
way, data would flow out of the OUT port and into the IN port.

In more recent times, most USB MIDI interfaces have had the MIDI  
cables hardwired to the interface. The MIDI plugs at the ends of the  
cables are usually labeled IN and OUT. Unfortunately, some  
manufacturers have used those labels to indicate the direction of the  
data flow while others have used those labels to indicate the ports to  
which they should be connected.

So, the modern rule is this: If it doesn't work one way, connect them  
the other way.

Regards,
PianoBench

www.georgelitterst.com
www.timewarptech.com

--- In disklavier@yahoogroups.com, "George F. Litterst" <PianoBench@...> wrote:

"Getting the serial port to work on a modern Mac which natively does
not have serial ports is next to impossible.."

Hello - I'm a longtime lurker, have a good friend w/Diskclavier.

Yes, what you need is a MIDI-USB interface.  I use an Edirol UM-1EX interface.  This has two 
MIDI plugs/cable ends, for IN and OUT functions, and a USB cable end.  In my experience, the 
Mac System Preferences will make this available to any software normally requiring a 
dedicated MIDI connection.

hope this helps

Karl

My prior question has not been completely answered.

Can I set up a computer to provide the same audio features at the DCD-1?

Can a computer MIDI or serial provide the audio from a Piano Soft Plus 
CD to the Disklavier as the DCD-1 will? I suspect that MIDI will only 
provide data to the MIDI tone generator, not the audio that the DCD-1 
will provide.

If the MIDI will not supply the audio tracks to a Mark II XG, then, with 
a computer, can you use the computer's sound processor to put out the 
audio from a Piano Soft Plus CD to speakers connected directly to the 
computer?

                                                       /  MIDI 
data----MIDI interface---- DKV player system
Computer w/ PianoSoft Plus CD <
                                                       \  Audio 
data----sound card--------speakers

It appears that this would require the computer to read both the MIDI 
data and audio data from the PianoSoft Plus CD and send the MIDI to the 
Disklavier  MIDI ports and the audio to the computer's sound card.


btw; you can buy a PCI Serial card for a desktop system for about 
$35.00. Not as cheap as the USB to MIDI cable but some may have all of 
the USB ports in use.



George F. Litterst wrote:

>
> Good morning, everyone.
>
> On Dec 27, 2008, at 12:12 AM, Mark wrote:
>
> > Carol or anybody,
> >
> > Is there a difference is using the MIDI ports versus the Serial port
> > on
> > a Mark II XG? I have been considering trying to use a PC or such to
> > allow the CD with all of its functions. It would appear to me that the
> > MIDI ports would just allow the MIDI information where the serial port
> > would allow other information. Or would the serial port be to slow to
> > access the audio/vocal information.
> >
>
> In my experience, MIDI seems to function the same using the serial
> port as it does using the MIDI ports. In fact, the Yamaha website
> states, "there is no differencebetween the quality of the MIDI signal
> via the TO HOST port and the MIDI IN/OUT ports."
>
> The big difference is that using the MIDI ports requires a MIDI
> interface and using the serial port requires a computer that has a
> serial port as well as the appropriate driver to make the serial port
> work.
>
> Getting the serial port to work on a modern Mac which natively does
> not have serial ports is next to impossible (with one exception that
> I'll mention in a moment). Pre-OS X Macintoshes do have serial ports,
> but configuring and using OMS or FreeMIDI as the necessary MIDI driver
> is a pain. However, unlike modern OS X Macs, you can actually get
> iTunes to output MIDI data to the serial port under OS 9 using OMS or
> FreeMIDI. This means that you can use iTunes as your librarian
> program. The reason is that QuickTime in OS 9 enables you to select
> OMS or FreeMIDI as the output for QuickTime MIDI data.
>
> Using the serial port with a Windows computer requires a computer that
> has a serial port, of course. And, you need to install the Yamaha CBX
> serial driver which you can get here:
>
> http://www.global.yamaha.com/download/cbx_midi/index.html 
> <http://www.global.yamaha.com/download/cbx_midi/index.html>
>
> Apparently this CBX driver supports Windows 95 through XP.
>
> You can use the serial port with any modern Macintosh or Windows
> computer if you use a Yamaha MIDI interface that also has a serial
> port, such as the UX-96. Sometimes I do this so that I can have two
> different computers plugged into my Disklavier, one using he serial
> port and one using the MIDI ports. All I have to do is to move the To
> Host switch on the back of the control unit to the correct position in
> order to switch the active input.
>
> NOTE: Using the serial port does not provide any additional
> communication between the computer and the control unit other than
> MIDI data. The Disklavier Pro 2000 (of which there were fewer than 10
> manufactured) did have a special version of the firmware for the
> control unit that enabled additional communication using the serial
> port and a special software program running in Windows 98. However,
> that is not available for other models.
>
> Regards,
> PianoBench
>
>

Good morning, everyone.


On Dec 27, 2008, at 7:49 PM, Mark wrote:

> My prior question has not been completely answered.
>
> Can I set up a computer to provide the same audio features at the  
> DCD-1?
>

No. Not with a Mark II.

> Can a computer MIDI or serial provide the audio from a Piano Soft Plus
> CD to the Disklavier as the DCD-1 will?
>

No.
> I suspect that MIDI will only
> provide data to the MIDI tone generator, not the audio that the DCD-1
> will provide.
>

Correct.

> If the MIDI will not supply the audio tracks to a Mark II XG, then,  
> with
> a computer, can you use the computer's sound processor to put out the
> audio from a Piano Soft Plus CD to speakers connected directly to the
> computer?
>

This would require a special computer program to read the encoded MIDI  
data, decode it, send the MIDI data to the Disklavier and the audio  
data to the computer speakers. I am not aware of such a program.

> / MIDI
> data----MIDI interface---- DKV player system
> Computer w/ PianoSoft Plus CD <
> \ Audio
> data----sound card--------speakers
>
> It appears that this would require the computer to read both the MIDI
> data and audio data from the PianoSoft Plus CD and send the MIDI to  
> the
> Disklavier MIDI ports and the audio to the computer's sound card.
>

True.

> btw; you can buy a PCI Serial card for a desktop system for about
> $35.00. Not as cheap as the USB to MIDI cable but some may have all of
> the USB ports in use.
>

Regards,
PianoBench


www.georgelitterst.com
www.timewarptech.com

Mark,
It seems that you are looking for the reverse of Mark Fontana's 
MID2PianoCD software (http://dp70.dyndns.org/mid2pianocd/). Perhaps 
you could talk to Mark about the possibility/feasibility of producing 
software to do what you are suggesting, which would be PianoCD2MIDI.
(mailto:mfontana@frontiernet.net)

Scott Jackson


--- In disklavier@yahoogroups.com, Mark <MarkGMID@...> wrote:
>
> My prior question has not been completely answered.
> 
> Can I set up a computer to provide the same audio features at the 
DCD-1?
> 
> Can a computer MIDI or serial provide the audio from a Piano Soft 
Plus 
> CD to the Disklavier as the DCD-1 will? I suspect that MIDI will 
only 
> provide data to the MIDI tone generator, not the audio that the DCD-
1 
> will provide.
> 
> If the MIDI will not supply the audio tracks to a Mark II XG, then, 
with 
> a computer, can you use the computer's sound processor to put out 
the 
> audio from a Piano Soft Plus CD to speakers connected directly to 
the 
> computer?