Elektron Musical Instruments

Hi to everyone,

I myself have found that I would love to use MnM's internal sequencer 
with multi-trig mode (ALL) and poly-mode. Is this planned?? The 
sequenced multi-trig and poly would be the absolute killer features! 
I would easily giveup a few midiseq for these...

I would also like to link for example two machines together like in 
MD. Yes, there is multitrig, but this would be in kit menu like in MD 
and would use one sequencer track for the master-machine and slave-
machine (with options to link amp, flt, exf also). That would give us 
a lot more easy way to make unique sounding monopatterns. Imagine 
combined SID and Digipro, with easy way of sequence on one track. 
yam...

Toni.

--- In elektron-users@yahoogroups.com, "tahvenaine2002" 
<tahvenaine@c...> wrote:

> I myself have found that I would love to use MnM's internal 
sequencer 
> with multi-trig mode (ALL) and poly-mode. Is this planned??

No, the poly mode is mostly a bonus features, not to be planned to 
be tightly interated with all other modes. After all - this is the 
Monomachine.

> I would also like to link for example two machines together like 
in 
> MD. Yes, there is multitrig, but this would be in kit menu like in 
MD 
> and would use one sequencer track for the master-machine and slave-
> machine (with options to link amp, flt, exf also). That would give 
us 
> a lot more easy way to make unique sounding monopatterns. Imagine 
> combined SID and Digipro, with easy way of sequence on one track. 
> yam...

When we get the paste to work better you could do this by copying 
one track to another!

We do not have any plans to add track-linking, like in the 
Machinedrum. But if we got a reason good enough, and a good place 
for placing the interface switches we could do it.

Daniel

> > I myself have found that I would love to use MnM's
> internal 
> sequencer 
> > with multi-trig mode (ALL) and poly-mode. Is this
> planned??
> 
> No, the poly mode is mostly a bonus features, not to
> be planned to 
> be tightly interated with all other modes. After all
> - this is the 
> Monomachine.

WHY NO CHORD SEQUENCING?????????????????????????????
This is perhaps the biggest turn-off for me so far.


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*mono* machine.

Not as in "I'm sick and i feel real bored", as in "singular voice"

On Wednesday, October 8, 2003, at 10:50 am, Sr. Minimo wrote:

>
>>> I myself have found that I would love to use MnM's
>> internal
>> sequencer
>>> with multi-trig mode (ALL) and poly-mode. Is this
>> planned??
>>
>> No, the poly mode is mostly a bonus features, not to
>> be planned to
>> be tightly interated with all other modes. After all
>> - this is the
>> Monomachine.
>
> WHY NO CHORD SEQUENCING?????????????????????????????
> This is perhaps the biggest turn-off for me so far.
>
>
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Because it is called *mono*machine ?

> WHY NO CHORD SEQUENCING?????????????????????????????
> This is perhaps the biggest turn-off for me so far.

--- "M-.-n" <nostromo@...> wrote:
> Because it is called *mono*machine ?

It still has polyphony, 6 simultaneous sequences and
you can pan stereo sounds and have stereo effects.
What the hell is so *mono* about that?
What's the point with the name anyways? Somebody ever
smack you over the head with a Waldorf "Attack"?


> > WHY NO CHORD
> SEQUENCING?????????????????????????????
> > This is perhaps the biggest turn-off for me so
> far.
> 
> 


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haha... LOL. .. no never.

----- Original Message ----- 

From: "Sr. Minimo" <srminimo@...>
To: <elektron-users@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 08, 2003 9:09 PM
Subject: Re: [elektron] Re: [Daniel] Development of multi-trig and polymode?


> --- "M-.-n" <nostromo@...> wrote:
> > Because it is called *mono*machine ?
>
> It still has polyphony, 6 simultaneous sequences and
> you can pan stereo sounds and have stereo effects.
> What the hell is so *mono* about that?
> What's the point with the name anyways? Somebody ever
> smack you over the head with a Waldorf "Attack"?
>
>
> > > WHY NO CHORD
> > SEQUENCING?????????????????????????????
> > > This is perhaps the biggest turn-off for me so
> > far.
> >
> >
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search
> http://shopping.yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

Hi,

I must say that I'm also a bit disappointed. I understand the name 
and what's the purpose of this machine. Allthought I feel that maybe 
a little programming (or more of it) this poly mode could be turned 
more uselfull and would add a killer feature to monomachine. Now I 
feel this is just a artificial separation, if you know what I mean. I 
really would like to here more comments about this. Is there any more 
people that feel that poly mode should have sequencing also? (I know 
Daniel, you must be pulling your hairs right now :)
There is a work around thought, you could make one machined sound 
fabulous and then copy-paste it to other tracks (for example 4 
tracks). Then you would have 4-voice machine, but you must sequence 
them to different tracks. Maybe elektron could make up some clever 
system that allows us to put these 4 tracks to be used with one 
sequencer track?? 
What I mean to say is that I see no reason to not develop somekind of 
poly with seq into monomachine. I would add a killer feature 
(monosynth with ability to to be configured as poly+seq also. Worth 
of advertising, I think), and would benefit the monomachine and 
Elektron. If only reason not to do this is the name of the synth, I 
feel it's very artificial. Ok, this was my opinion. Your opinion 
please? Let's make some discussion.

Toni Ahvenainen


-- In elektron-users@yahoogroups.com, "Sr. Minimo" <srminimo@y...> 
wrote:

> 
> > > I myself have found that I would love to use MnM's
> > internal 
> > sequencer 
> > > with multi-trig mode (ALL) and poly-mode. Is this
> > planned??
> > 
> > No, the poly mode is mostly a bonus features, not to
> > be planned to 
> > be tightly interated with all other modes. After all
> > - this is the 
> > Monomachine.
> 
> WHY NO CHORD SEQUENCING?????????????????????????????
> This is perhaps the biggest turn-off for me so far.
> 
> 
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search
> http://shopping.yahoo.com

I totally agree.
Not having polyphonic sequencing because of the productname is way to dogmatic 
IMHO.
At least one track should be devoted to handle polyphonic stuff.

Hans

--- In elektron-users@yahoogroups.com, "tahvenaine2002" <tahvenaine@c...> 
wrote:

> Hi,
> 
> I must say that I'm also a bit disappointed. I understand the name 
> and what's the purpose of this machine. Allthought I feel that maybe 
> a little programming (or more of it) this poly mode could be turned 
> more uselfull and would add a killer feature to monomachine. Now I 
> feel this is just a artificial separation, if you know what I mean. I 
> really would like to here more comments about this. Is there any more 
> people that feel that poly mode should have sequencing also? (I know 
> Daniel, you must be pulling your hairs right now :)
> There is a work around thought, you could make one machined sound 
> fabulous and then copy-paste it to other tracks (for example 4 
> tracks). Then you would have 4-voice machine, but you must sequence 
> them to different tracks. Maybe elektron could make up some clever 
> system that allows us to put these 4 tracks to be used with one 
> sequencer track?? 
> What I mean to say is that I see no reason to not develop somekind of 
> poly with seq into monomachine. I would add a killer feature 
> (monosynth with ability to to be configured as poly+seq also. Worth 
> of advertising, I think), and would benefit the monomachine and 
> Elektron. If only reason not to do this is the name of the synth, I 
> feel it's very artificial. Ok, this was my opinion. Your opinion 
> please? Let's make some discussion.
> 
> Toni Ahvenainen
> 
> 
> -- In elektron-users@yahoogroups.com, "Sr. Minimo" <srminimo@y...> 
> wrote:
> > 
> > > > I myself have found that I would love to use MnM's
> > > internal 
> > > sequencer 
> > > > with multi-trig mode (ALL) and poly-mode. Is this
> > > planned??
> > > 
> > > No, the poly mode is mostly a bonus features, not to
> > > be planned to 
> > > be tightly interated with all other modes. After all
> > > - this is the 
> > > Monomachine.
> > 
> > WHY NO CHORD SEQUENCING?????????????????????????????
> > This is perhaps the biggest turn-off for me so far.
> > 
> > 
> > __________________________________
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search
> > http://shopping.yahoo.com

--- In elektron-users@yahoogroups.com, "Sr. Minimo" <srminimo@y...> 
wrote:

> > No, the poly mode is mostly a bonus features, not to
> > be planned to 
> > be tightly interated with all other modes. After all
> > - this is the 
> > Monomachine.
> 
> WHY NO CHORD SEQUENCING?????????????????????????????
> This is perhaps the biggest turn-off for me so far.

I didn't say that. I said no internal sequencing in poly mode. But 
who knows! We can always change our minds until OS1.0. :) There 
might be some problems though, but I'll promise then that we'll look 
into the matter and see if it's possible.

Daniel

--- In elektron-users@yahoogroups.com, "tahvenaine2002" 
<tahvenaine@c...> wrote:
> There is a work around thought, you could make one machined sound 
> fabulous and then copy-paste it to other tracks (for example 4 
> tracks). Then you would have 4-voice machine, but you must sequence 
> them to different tracks. 

If you sequence one track first and do a copy/paste the sequence is 
also copied. You'll only have to adjust transpose to make chords.
Actually this way is more powerfull since you can change panning, 
fine tuning, parameter locks, arp. settings etc. etc.. This way you 
can make very dynamic rich sounding poly tracks. In normal poly mode 
all voices have the same parameters and therefore not as rich 
sounding.

Ronald.

On Thu, Oct 09, 2003 at 07:02:17AM -0000, tahvenaine2002 wrote:
>    There is a work around thought, you could make one machined sound
>    fabulous and then copy-paste it to other tracks (for example 4
>    tracks). Then you would have 4-voice machine, but you must sequence
>    them to different tracks. Maybe elektron could make up some clever
>    system that allows us to put these 4 tracks to be used with one
>    sequencer track??

According to the information that came with the MM, a 4-voice mode
sequencing mode is planned.  It will take one track for it and can be
done on all six tracks.  However, this is only planned for the Superwave
synth machine.  Which makes sense given the synth machines present in
the MM.

>    If only reason not to do this is the name of the synth, I
>    feel it's very artificial.

I think Daniel's point isn't that they won't do it because of the name;
it's that it's called Monomachine for a reason.  i.e. they didn't design
it with full polyphonic playing/sequencing in mind, thus it's not really
a good idea to place emphasis on doing it now

Personally, I think the ensemble mode (4-voice Superwave) will be quite
interesting and will offer a lot.  I would, however, *really love* it if
the MIDI sequencer was polyphonic.

Joe

yeah, but that will only give you harmoies that are shifted in parallel.
To change from major to minor you would have to go into the track, find all the thirds 
and tweak them manually. Not exactly a very inspiring way to work.
I guess for people who can play chords there should be a way to input them in 
realtime as inspiration strikes.

Hans


--- In elektron-users@yahoogroups.com, "Roonan" <info@r...> wrote:

> --- In elektron-users@yahoogroups.com, "tahvenaine2002" 
> <tahvenaine@c...> wrote:
> > There is a work around thought, you could make one machined sound 
> > fabulous and then copy-paste it to other tracks (for example 4 
> > tracks). Then you would have 4-voice machine, but you must sequence 
> > them to different tracks. 
> 
> If you sequence one track first and do a copy/paste the sequence is 
> also copied. You'll only have to adjust transpose to make chords.
> Actually this way is more powerfull since you can change panning, 
> fine tuning, parameter locks, arp. settings etc. etc.. This way you 
> can make very dynamic rich sounding poly tracks. In normal poly mode 
> all voices have the same parameters and therefore not as rich 
> sounding.
> 
> Ronald.

> According to the information that came with the MM, a 4-voice mode
> sequencing mode is planned.  It will take one track for it and can 
be
> done on all six tracks.  However, this is only planned for the 
Superwave
> synth machine.  Which makes sense given the synth machines present 
in
> the MM.

Yes I'm aware of this and it sure sounds good! Allthought I could see 
polyphonic sequencing on other machines as well, like FM+, SID and so 
on...


> >    If only reason not to do this is the name of the synth, I
> >    feel it's very artificial.
> 
> I think Daniel's point isn't that they won't do it because of the 
name;
> it's that it's called Monomachine for a reason.  i.e. they didn't 
design
> it with full polyphonic playing/sequencing in mind, thus it's not 
really
> a good idea to place emphasis on doing it now
> 
> Personally, I think the ensemble mode (4-voice Superwave) will be 
quite
> interesting and will offer a lot.  I would, however, *really love* 
it if
> the MIDI sequencer was polyphonic.

The midi sequencer is polyphonic. I tried it yesterday and it's very 
powerfull to use with soft sampler like kontakt. I love it. Why I'm 
writing so much of poly mode isn't because I'm thinking this machine 
as polyphonic, no. The monoside already is very good and doesn't need 
many changes. Allthought I would be sad to see a possiable and 
powerfull feature to get lost, just because of we are speaking of 
monophonic machine.

Toni.
ps. peace :)

What other company in the world pays so much attention
to the people who use their products? 
I myself have not had this experience before (and I'm
pretty old, believe me). Much respect to Elektron for
your dedication to making amazing instruments aimed at
perfection, and not at making a quick buck. Polyphonic
sequencing in the MM would be awesome. Knowing that
you listen to what we're saying is even better.
Much respect
Sr. M\ufffdnimo


> > WHY NO CHORD
> SEQUENCING?????????????????????????????
> > This is perhaps the biggest turn-off for me so
> far.
> 
> I didn't say that. I said no internal sequencing in
> poly mode. But 
> who knows! We can always change our minds until
> OS1.0. :) There 
> might be some problems though, but I'll promise then
> that we'll look 
> into the matter and see if it's possible.
> 
> Daniel
> 
> 


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The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search
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--- In elektron-users@yahoogroups.com, "tahvenaine2002"
<tahvenaine@c...> wrote: 
> The midi sequencer is polyphonic.


No it's not.  You can program chords, but it's not polyphonic.  If you
program a note with a long length time (i.e. simulate one finger
holding a key down) and then program another note during that time (a
second finger pressing a key), the second note will cut off the first
note.


> I tried it yesterday and it's very 
> powerfull to use with soft sampler like kontakt. I love it.


It is powerful.  But to do something like what I described above, you
need to use at least two of the MIDI tracks (assigned to the same
channel).  I just wish it was made to be polyphonic, because I really
like using it as my main sequencer, since the interface and timing is
exactly what I'm looking for.

Joe.

I stand corrected :)
Toni.

--- In elektron-users@yahoogroups.com, "Joe" <jmelnyk@c...> wrote:
> --- In elektron-users@yahoogroups.com, "tahvenaine2002"
> <tahvenaine@c...> wrote: 
> > The midi sequencer is polyphonic.
> 
> 
> No it's not.  You can program chords, but it's not polyphonic.  If 
you
> program a note with a long length time (i.e. simulate one finger
> holding a key down) and then program another note during that time 
(a
> second finger pressing a key), the second note will cut off the 
first
> note.
> 
> 
> > I tried it yesterday and it's very 
> > powerfull to use with soft sampler like kontakt. I love it.
> 
> 
> It is powerful.  But to do something like what I described above, 
you
> need to use at least two of the MIDI tracks (assigned to the same
> channel).  I just wish it was made to be polyphonic, because I 
really
> like using it as my main sequencer, since the interface and timing 
is

> exactly what I'm looking for.
> 
> Joe.

Hi to all,
I've been thinking about this midisequencer. In this way way it is 
implemented now it is quite difficult to do chords. At least I find 
my self pressing too many buttons at the same time. It could be 
better if it would be done like this:

you enter the polyphonic midiseq and in the lcd it it shows this.
you start programming chords with seq. You put the first note on it's 
place. Then you hit arrow down and and you get another clean 16 
buttons. Now you may ask where is the note I entered? It shows on lcd 
something like this:

  1: .....IxxxO...... F#2
  2: Active

Now you will see that in this measure there is a seq-layer (16 
buttons) above this new layer and there is a Note-on (I) and Note-off 
(O) for F#2
So you hit another note here and after that you hit the down arrow 
again. Now this is what you see on the lcd:

  1: .....IxxxO...... F#2
  2: .......IxxxxO... G#2
  3: Active

So this way you continue doing and if there is a reason to go and 
change that G#2 note you push up arrow and it shows you:

  1: .....IxxxO...... F#2
  2: Active
  3: ..........IxxxO. C-3


Now you can do polyphonic chords with any note on/off combinations. 
If you had MnM playing while doing this you had seen that leds above 
keyboard still shows every note on this pattern (so I mean all of 
them F#2, G#2 and C-3). So there you can see the overall picture of 
what is going on. Note also that there would always be layers as 
there would be notes, so that if you have 4 notes you would have 4 
layers and if you only had 3 notes then you would have 3 layers. And 
maybe there should be some maximum of layers like 8.

On the other hand you could use record and play the notes straight to 
MnM (which is better way off course). The it would happen like this: 
You hit the record and hit some chords. Note data will be recorded 
but so that every note goes to new layer. So when you hit stop it 
could look something like this (I've illustrated 2 measures here):

1: .....IxxxO...... F#2   .....IxxxO...... E#2
2: .....Ixxxxxxxxxx C-4   xxxxxxxO........
3: IxxxxxxxxxxxxxxO D-3   ................
4: Active                 Active

So here you can see that there can be also more than one note on on 
layer (layer 1. Notes F#2 and E#2). But not so that anyother could 
stop the other.

Ok, this could be ok system to handdle polyphonic data on MnM seq. At 
least I think so. Of course there is technical things, but I'm now 
aware of them. It's fairly hard to write these kind of thing in 
english, if don't have a skill for english. I hope everyone 
understands this and react to this (what do you think of it?).

Toni.

This one is also reported to Elektron as feature suggestion.

--- In elektron-users@yahoogroups.com, "tahvenaine2002" 
<tahvenaine@c...> wrote:
> Hi to all,
> I've been thinking about this midisequencer. In this way way it is 
> implemented now it is quite difficult to do chords. At least I find 
> my self pressing too many buttons at the same time. It could be 
> better if it would be done like this:
> 
> you enter the polyphonic midiseq and in the lcd it it shows this.
> you start programming chords with seq. You put the first note on 
it's 
> place. Then you hit arrow down and and you get another clean 16 
> buttons. Now you may ask where is the note I entered? It shows on 
lcd 
> something like this:
> 
>   1: .....IxxxO...... F#2
>   2: Active
> 
> Now you will see that in this measure there is a seq-layer (16 
> buttons) above this new layer and there is a Note-on (I) and Note-
off 
> (O) for F#2
> So you hit another note here and after that you hit the down arrow 
> again. Now this is what you see on the lcd:
> 
>   1: .....IxxxO...... F#2
>   2: .......IxxxxO... G#2
>   3: Active
> 
> So this way you continue doing and if there is a reason to go and 
> change that G#2 note you push up arrow and it shows you:
> 
>   1: .....IxxxO...... F#2
>   2: Active
>   3: ..........IxxxO. C-3
> 
> 
> Now you can do polyphonic chords with any note on/off combinations. 
> If you had MnM playing while doing this you had seen that leds 
above 
> keyboard still shows every note on this pattern (so I mean all of 
> them F#2, G#2 and C-3). So there you can see the overall picture of 
> what is going on. Note also that there would always be layers as 
> there would be notes, so that if you have 4 notes you would have 4 
> layers and if you only had 3 notes then you would have 3 layers. 
And 
> maybe there should be some maximum of layers like 8.
> 
> On the other hand you could use record and play the notes straight 
to 
> MnM (which is better way off course). The it would happen like 
this: 
> You hit the record and hit some chords. Note data will be recorded 
> but so that every note goes to new layer. So when you hit stop it 
> could look something like this (I've illustrated 2 measures here):
> 
> 1: .....IxxxO...... F#2   .....IxxxO...... E#2
> 2: .....Ixxxxxxxxxx C-4   xxxxxxxO........
> 3: IxxxxxxxxxxxxxxO D-3   ................
> 4: Active                 Active
> 
> So here you can see that there can be also more than one note on on 
> layer (layer 1. Notes F#2 and E#2). But not so that anyother could 
> stop the other.
> 
> Ok, this could be ok system to handdle polyphonic data on MnM seq. 
At 

> least I think so. Of course there is technical things, but I'm now 
> aware of them. It's fairly hard to write these kind of thing in 
> english, if don't have a skill for english. I hope everyone 
> understands this and react to this (what do you think of it?).
> 
> Toni.

--- In elektron-users@yahoogroups.com, "tahvenaine2002" 
<tahvenaine@c...> wrote:
> I've been thinking about this midisequencer. In this way way it is 
> implemented now it is quite difficult to do chords. At least I 
find 
> my self pressing too many buttons at the same time. 

Maybe there can be an easier way to record chords.
Why not make another function in the ARP wich just play's the chords 
you press.
I understood that the arp will be recordable in a future release so 
there you go and no conflicts between ARP and chords!
Maybe the easiest solution.....Daniel?

Ronald.