EXS 24 Logic Sampler Users Group

>  > I wrote:
>>
>>>>  Ah, the bleeding edge. I just installed Panther and like it a lot,
>>>>   but actually doing work in it is still a few months off. My PT system
>>>>   won't run on it yet, Logic is still growing into it, etc. OS 9 is
>>>>  still very much alive!
>>
>>  From: Eddie Sullivan <esullivan@...>
>>
>>>  OS 9 is dead on my machine.
>>  etc. etc. etc.
>>
>>  Please Eddie, lots of people are running OS X very happily. But for
>>  your post to be anything other than a religious knee-jerk reaction,
>
>It wasn't a religious knee jerk reaction, it was my personal experience.

I think your response was to someone saying OS X is crap, which 
wasn't what I was saying!

>  > you have to respond to what I said. I promise that you're not running
>>  a Pro Tools MIX system, and you're not trying to run a large
>>  streaming orchestral sample library (VSL) with over three dozen
>>  EXS24s going at once.
>
>You didn't specify what PT system you had. Of course if you are going to use
>older technology on a new operating system there are going to be issues. If
>I needed to run a large orchestral sample library, I would instinctively
>know that I was going to need more processing power than a MIX system.

Of course, the EXS24s run on the host computer, not the MIX system. 
The MIX hardware runs plug-ins and audio on its own hardware, freeing 
up the host for other things. HD systems do indeed have more power 
per card then MIX systems, but either TDM system is only behaving as 
a sound card as far as the native engine is concerned. It would be 
nice to upgrade to HD, but that would have no effect on this issue 
(with the exception that HD is better behaved on the PCI bus).

Also note that one of the selling points for TDM systems, whether MIX 
or HD, is that they're scalable: if you need more power, add more 
cards. Overall, a 7-card MIX system has more power than a HD Core 
system, for example, although there are some newer plug-ins that 
require the increased power of HD chips to run.

And by the way, HD systems aren't running on Panther yet either!

>You
>sound like a good candidate for upgrading to an HD card and maybe adding an
>Accel process card. Doing what you want to do is going to be rough going
>regardless of the OS or the machine.

That's 100% true, which is why people run these libraries on several 
computers. I just feel that this isn't the time to invest in more 
computers, because machines that do the job seem to be right around 
the corner. Hopefully the G5 will be that machine, but 64-bit Athlon 
processors may be another alternative.

>OSX and Panther are much more stable
>than OS9 and the issue of your sampling needs has nothing to do with that.

I suspect the stability depends on what you're doing, but the 
relationship to what I'm doing is that G5s running Panther can access 
several times more memory. That means you can have many times more 
programs loaded and ready to play.

>Let me know if you wish to upgrade, I can actually help you with the
>hardware and software.

Thanks, I appreciate the offer.
-- 

Nick Batzdorf
818/905-9101, cell 590-9101, fax 905-5434

On 10/30/03 6:14 PM, "Nick Batzdorf" <recording@...> wrote:

>>> I wrote:
>>> 
>>>>>  Ah, the bleeding edge. I just installed Panther and like it a lot,
>>>>>   but actually doing work in it is still a few months off. My PT system
>>>>>   won't run on it yet, Logic is still growing into it, etc. OS 9 is
>>>>>  still very much alive!
>>> 
>>>  From: Eddie Sullivan <esullivan@...>
>>> 
>>>>  OS 9 is dead on my machine.
>>>  etc. etc. etc.
>>> 
>>>  Please Eddie, lots of people are running OS X very happily. But for
>>>  your post to be anything other than a religious knee-jerk reaction,
>> 
>> It wasn't a religious knee jerk reaction, it was my personal experience.
> 
> I think your response was to someone saying OS X is crap, which
> wasn't what I was saying!

I was trying to be helpful, I'm in OSX land totally- it's working for me. It
was a simple statement regarding my personal experience. It wasn't really a
criticism or judgement of anyone else.


> 
>>> you have to respond to what I said. I promise that you're not running
>>>  a Pro Tools MIX system, and you're not trying to run a large
>>>  streaming orchestral sample library (VSL) with over three dozen
>>>  EXS24s going at once.
>> 
>> You didn't specify what PT system you had. Of course if you are going to use
>> older technology on a new operating system there are going to be issues. If
>> I needed to run a large orchestral sample library, I would instinctively
>> know that I was going to need more processing power than a MIX system.
> 
> Of course, the EXS24s run on the host computer, not the MIX system.

Now I'm really confused, how is OS 9 helping you again???

> The MIX hardware runs plug-ins and audio on its own hardware, freeing
> up the host for other things. HD systems do indeed have more power
> per card then MIX systems, but either TDM system is only behaving as
> a sound card as far as the native engine is concerned. It would be
> nice to upgrade to HD, but that would have no effect on this issue
> (with the exception that HD is better behaved on the PCI bus).

Do you think that the ESB TDM software can help you? You can upgrade your
Didgidesign hardware and use ESB TDM to allow the ESX24 to take advantage of
the DSP on board. This may give you the power you are looking for.
See http://www.digidesign.com/news/details.cfm?story_id=483

> 
> Also note that one of the selling points for TDM systems, whether MIX
> or HD, is that they're scalable: if you need more power, add more
> cards. Overall, a 7-card MIX system has more power than a HD Core
> system, for example, although there are some newer plug-ins that
> require the increased power of HD chips to run.
> 
> And by the way, HD systems aren't running on Panther yet either!

We are testing this here- official support from Digi is literally days
away...
See http://www.digidesign.com/news/details.cfm?story_id=537&localonly=N
> 
>> You
>> sound like a good candidate for upgrading to an HD card and maybe adding an
>> Accel process card. Doing what you want to do is going to be rough going
>> regardless of the OS or the machine.
> 
> That's 100% true, which is why people run these libraries on several
> computers. 




I just feel that this isn't the time to invest in more
> computers, because machines that do the job seem to be right around
> the corner. Hopefully the G5 will be that machine, but 64-bit Athlon
> processors may be another alternative.

We're still talking about your dilemma with the EXS24? The EXS24 doesn't
work on Windoze... 

> 
>> OSX and Panther are much more stable
>> than OS9 and the issue of your sampling needs has nothing to do with that.
> 
> I suspect the stability depends on what you're doing, but the
> relationship to what I'm doing is that G5s running Panther can access
> several times more memory. That means you can have many times more
> programs loaded and ready to play.
> 
>> Let me know if you wish to upgrade, I can actually help you with the
>> hardware and software.
> 
> Thanks, I appreciate the offer.

We are in a business that is always changing, I look to the forums here for
insight and am available to help anytime... I'm no genius, a lot of this
because it is so new is still a bit subjective..

Peace : )

Eddie
IMS

Eddie Sullivan wrote:
> 
> We're still talking about your dilemma with the EXS24? The EXS24 
doesn't
> work on Windoze... 
> 
The EXS 24 still works great for me and, I believe, many other users, 
on Windows.

Mark Cahill