Mailist to discuss all issues regarding the Digitech GSP-2101 Guitar FX Processor

Hi together,
I have a problem with my Digitech 2101. I want to use a Kitty Hawk 
Quattro Tube Preamp as FX Loop Preamp in the Digitech. The Kitty Hawk 
have only 1 Input and 1 Mono Output, no FX Send / Return.
I go with the Guitar into the Input of  the 2101 and connect Fx Send 
to Input of the Kitty Hawk. With the output of the Kiity I go to Fx 
return of the 2101. The Problem is, that the Signal of the Kitty 
comes out very flat , not good at all.
Have anyone an idea what the problem is, or any better Idea to 
connect the Amps ?
Maybe I have to change some settings in the Digitech ?

Thanks for your help.
Steve

hey andy,i\ufffdrecommend you to try this:

split the guitar signal to the input of the 2101 as well as to the input of
the kitty hawk.
connect the output of the kitty hawk to the fx return of the digitech.
whenever the fx loop is on "bypass", you\ufffdll have the 2101 for a preamp, when
it\ufffds on "no sum" you\ufffdll hear the kitty hawk.
two preamps in a row rarely give you good results.

something else:
some effect algorithms use only the signal from the left fx-return, others
use both signals (left and right). thus it might be a good idea to split the
output of the kitty hawk to both of them.
cheers
klaus

Andy wrote:
> Hi together,
> I have a problem with my Digitech 2101. I want to use a Kitty Hawk
> Quattro Tube Preamp as FX Loop Preamp in the Digitech. The Kitty Hawk
> have only 1 Input and 1 Mono Output, no FX Send / Return.
> I go with the Guitar into the Input of  the 2101 and connect Fx Send
> to Input of the Kitty Hawk. With the output of the Kiity I go to Fx
> return of the 2101. The Problem is, that the Signal of the Kitty
> comes out very flat , not good at all.
> Have anyone an idea what the problem is, or any better Idea to
> connect the Amps ?
> Maybe I have to change some settings in the Digitech ?
>
> Thanks for your help.
> Steve
>
>
>
>
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Hi Klaus,
Thanks for your help. I will try this, on post it if it works.

Steve,

I'd recommend you use the same routing as you're currently using. I 
have my Triaxis hooked up that very same way.

However, you have to pay close attention to the way the algo on the 
GSP2101 is designed. Since the guitar goes initially into the 2101 
input, make sure the compression, distortion and pre-FX EQ are all 
off (and EQ flat). Then the programmable volume you can leave on 0, 
so that you have room for adjustments anytime.

Then, the signal goes out to your pre-amp, and back. From there on, 
make sure that whatever algo you design has the right linking from 
the FX-input you're using (LEFT or RIGHT) to the next FX in the 
algo. There rest is up to you but probably shouldn't affect much the 
sound.

If you search the forum back a few months, some of us did a side-by-
side comparison of the amount of signal "coloring" that the 2101 
causes to the signal. In my particular findings and opinion, it 
slightly colors the sound probably due to the A/D conversion 
process, and a marginal signal delay (about 4 ms). In general, 
however, I'm very comfortable and happy with the overall sound, the 
best ALL-IN-ONE unit I've ever owned.

Gus.

--- In gsp-2101@yahoogroups.com, "Andy" <rocktus@a...> wrote:
> 
> Hi together,
> I have a problem with my Digitech 2101. I want to use a Kitty Hawk 
> Quattro Tube Preamp as FX Loop Preamp in the Digitech. The Kitty 
Hawk 
> have only 1 Input and 1 Mono Output, no FX Send / Return.
> I go with the Guitar into the Input of  the 2101 and connect Fx 
Send 
> to Input of the Kitty Hawk. With the output of the Kiity I go to 
Fx 

> return of the 2101. The Problem is, that the Signal of the Kitty 
> comes out very flat , not good at all.
> Have anyone an idea what the problem is, or any better Idea to 
> connect the Amps ?
> Maybe I have to change some settings in the Digitech ?
> 
> Thanks for your help.
> Steve

This's not really to do with 2101, but a lot of us use some other kind of
pre and we all know that pre's sound better if driven directly by the
guitar. So what I would like to ask is how you split your guitar signal to
both (or more than 2, you lucky bastards) preamps.

Long life the 2101...

Pedro Ferreira

I'm using a Valvulator from VHT and the signal reaching the
preamps is just as good if not better than straight from
the guitar.

Javi

--- Pedro Ferreira <pedro_mig_ferreira@...> wrote:
> This's not really to do with 2101, but a lot of us use
> some other kind of
> pre and we all know that pre's sound better if driven
> directly by the
> guitar. So what I would like to ask is how you split your
> guitar signal to
> both (or more than 2, you lucky bastards) preamps.
> 
> Long life the 2101...
> 
> Pedro Ferreira
> 
> 
> 
> 

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Oh, Steve (Andi?), I forgot to mention that by plugging the guitar 
right into the 2101 also gives you the flexibility to use either the 
2101 for its pre-amp section or your external pre-amp. It's just a 
matter of programming patches with the FX-loop option DISABLED (for 
the pre on the 2101) or NO SUM (for your external).

One more thing, so far I tend to use the final DRY/WET mixer all the 
way cranked WET when using a patch with the external pre, so that 
you only get the full signal processed, otherwise you are going to 
hear (barely probably, but you will) some dry and clean (straight) 
guitar sound mixed in.

Hope this helps.

Gus.

--- In gsp-2101@yahoogroups.com, "gusfmm" <gusfmm@y...> wrote:
> 
> Steve,
> 
> I'd recommend you use the same routing as you're currently using. 
I 
> have my Triaxis hooked up that very same way.
>

Hi Gus,
thank you for your help. I`ve got it now. I go with the guitar signal into a 
Midi- Looper , than I go from the looper into the preamp input (Loop 1) and 
with the guitar signal from looper into the input of Digitech, (Loop 2) from the 
preamp output (I splitt the signal with an Y-adapter) I go to the left and 
right FX - Return from the Digitech, ( this way I can drive the Digitech 
Stereo). From the Digitech Output I go to the poweramp. If I want the preamp section 
from the Digitech I just have to use Loop 2 if I want the extern preamp i use 
Loop 1.
I also use my Korg Tuner  as a Loop (Loop 3) if I use loop 3 there is just an 
input signal to the tuner. I think this way is ok. What do you think ?
Best Regards
Andi

Andi,

What you are doing using the Midi-looper can be done the way I 
suggested to you in my previous email. No extra gear needed. That I 
think is the beauty of the way the 2101 FX loop is designed and that 
some other renowned guitar mFXs incredibly do not have (e.g. G-
Force). 

Another suggestion: There is no need to split your pre-amp signal 
using a Y-adapter. If you want to get a stereo signal from the 2101, 
the only thing you have to do is program your algo appropriately. In 
other words, if you want to have a stereo sound you need some FXs 
that are to generate some stereo effect. For instance, a ping-pong 
delay, pitch-shifter with its source and shifted signal panned 
separately across the stereo field, etc.

For that, you just need a MONO source from the guitar. Feed that to 
the delay input for instance, and use a 2x2 mixer (or 3x2 if you 
wanted some "raw" signal mixed along) to handle the stereo output of 
the delay and so on with any other FX you might want to use. Most of 
these FXs are to get a mono input and they produce a stereo out.

Hope this helps, let me kno if there is anything unclear.

Gus.



--- In gsp-2101@yahoogroups.com, rocktus@a... wrote:
> Hi Gus,
> thank you for your help. I`ve got it now. I go with the guitar 
signal into a 
> Midi- Looper , than I go from the looper into the preamp input 
(Loop 1) and 
> with the guitar signal from looper into the input of Digitech, 
(Loop 2) from the 
> preamp output (I splitt the signal with an Y-adapter) I go to the 
left and 
> right FX - Return from the Digitech, ( this way I can drive the 
Digitech 
> Stereo). From the Digitech Output I go to the poweramp. If I want 
the preamp section 
> from the Digitech I just have to use Loop 2 if I want the extern 
preamp i use 
> Loop 1.
> I also use my Korg Tuner  as a Loop (Loop 3) if I use loop 3 there 
is just an 
> input signal to the tuner. I think this way is ok. What do you 
think ?
> Best Regards
> Andi

Hello Gus,
 
Thanks for your help again ! 
There is one more question. For example: If I go with the Guitar Signal 
direct in the extern preamp input and send the output to the Digitech FX return 
(switching the FX Loop of Digitech to NO SUM) then I have no EQ and no 
Mastervolume effects for this presets.
But how can I regulate the Volume of this presets ? Without any digital 
effects I have a great sound 100 % Volume, but if i use presets with digital 
effects the volume is going down.
The only way to regulate the volume is the wet/dry mixer. Is there any other 
way to keep the signal "wet" and still have 100% dry volume ??
 
If I use the signal the way you told me, do I have the mastervolume and EQ 
funktion ?
Sorry for askin so much, but want to try it both way`s and find out what 
sounds better to me.
Best Regards
Andi

Andi,

In order for me to fully explain this I'd need to
write a quite lenghty manifest... but let's see how
best I can try to help.

The 2101 has two section, one analog and one digital.
The analog is everything that goes before the FX-loop.
Digital is everything after. If you do what you're
saying you'd be bypassing completely the analog
section. Not necessarily a bad thing, but IMHO, you'd
be losing the opportunity to have the extra sounds you
can achieve using the 2101 analog distortions and
clean sounds. By doing that, you'd obviously also lose
the 11-band graphic EQ, which is useful often times.

The volume control that is part of the analog section
controls the amount of signal going into the digital
section (and FX-loop). This SHOULD NOT be used as the
patch volume control, because in theory you are rather
controlling the amount of signal going to the digital
FXs, which can dramatically affect your sound without
necessarily give "volume control" as you wanted.

That's why I suggested you to connect the guitar
directly to the 2101 input and the external pre-amp to
the FX-loop: 
- For those patches you'd like to use the external
pre-amp, you'd have to program the whole analog
section as to be OFF (compression, distortion, flat EQ
and volume to << 0 >> ) and FX-loop to NO SUM. Then,
the signal from the guitar simply goes UNPROCESSED to
your pre-amp via FX-loop and back to the 2101 digital
section.
- For those patches you'd like to get some of the
analog sounds from the 2101, simply program the analog
section at your will and set the FX-loop to DISABLE.

Now, addressing the second part of your question: Why
you are getting a lower level sound going through the 2101
from your pre-amp. To respond that please confirm you
understand well how to program an algorithm. This is
key for me to try to further help you. I use my own
algos when using my Triaxis as I want them to be
exactly the way I want them to sound. However, when
using digital FXs, you have to understand well how an
algo is built and how you route the signal internally.
Linking the different FXs and using well the 2101
"mixers" is key to achieve a good sound.

Let me know how we are doing so far.

Gus.


--- In gsp-2101@yahoogroups.com, rocktus@a... wrote:
> Hello Gus,
>  
> Thanks for your help again ! 
> There is one more question. For example: If I go with the Guitar 
Signal 
> direct in the extern preamp input and send the output to the 
Digitech FX return 
> (switching the FX Loop of Digitech to NO SUM) then I have no EQ and 
no 
> Mastervolume effects for this presets.
> But how can I regulate the Volume of this presets ? Without any 
digital 
> effects I have a great sound 100 % Volume, but if i use presets 
with digital 
> effects the volume is going down.
> The only way to regulate the volume is the wet/dry mixer. Is there 
any other 
> way to keep the signal "wet" and still have 100% dry volume ??
>  
> If I use the signal the way you told me, do I have the mastervolume 
and EQ 
> funktion ?
> Sorry for askin so much, but want to try it both way`s and find out 
what 

> sounds better to me.
> Best Regards
> Andi

Hi Gus,
 
Ok, now I understand why you suggested my to connect the guitar into the 
Digitech.
So far I understand everything you wrote.
I just have the Digitech a few weeks and I always used the existing 
algorithms from Digitech.
So I did never build my own algorithm.
Maybe it is a good start for me, if you give me an example for an algorithm 
for a solosound (Delay, Reverb). Or any other algorithm you did build for your 
triaxis.. I can try to find out how to do, if you tell my what I need in my 
algorithm. What do you think ?
Best Regards
Andi